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Gitmo Guards Often Attacked by Detainees
Graphic shows type and number of incidents by prisoners at Guantanamo Bay from December 2002 to July 2005. (AP Graphic)
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- Public Discussion (28)
Is there another chart that compares illegally detaining people -- probably innocent of everything except their ethnicity -- and torturing them to what amounts to spitting at guards? What about charts about the number of similar "abuses" suffered by any guard in a typical super-max facility? Do they expect these people, who have been robbed of their very humanity, to what, sit still and be quiet? Casually, calmly wait for the text round of torture and humiliation?
- 8 votes
#1 - Mon Jul 31, 2006 4:32 PM EDTWhy would you overexaggerate what the guards did and underexaggerate what the prisoners did? At least show some consistancy.
Here, I'll show you:
The prisoners just spit on the guards and the guards just turned the thermostat down to 60 degrees F.
You could go the other way, too, that's just an example.
enigma: "probably innocent"
That assumption tells me you're not so enigmatic after all.
- 2 votes
what part of innocent til proved guilty don't you understand? And if that isn't suitable for you please trot out your second hand reasoning for implict guilt without trial. Try not to be too enigmatic with it. thanks.
- 1 vote
600 prisoners for 2 and a half years committed 440 incidents? So the worst "terrorists" on the planet, so vile that we cannot risk extending humane treatment or access to legal representation, committed as a group three offences per week. A typical US High School sees more misconduct. I would have expected worse from the "terrorists"...
Grab 600 young men off any street in the world, treat them like we have treated the Gitmo detainees, and you will have similar results.
- 5 votes
#2 - Mon Jul 31, 2006 11:45 PM EDTThey're prisoners for crying out loud. They are angry they are locked up. Innocent or not, I'd get my knickers in a twist if I was in prison and would like to get my guards' panties in a bunch for my amusement and revenge.
- 8 votes
#3 - Tue Aug 1, 2006 2:06 AM EDTEven better, they see themselves as prisoners of a government that will give them no legal recourse or opportunity to prove their guilt or innocence. So what do they have to lose? There comes a point when even death becomes a viable escape.
(And since they're brown peoples' lives, c'mon... what are they worth?)
- 4 votes
T.
I totally agree. In fact I actually censored myself from responding to this yesterday as I couldn't help but feel empathy for these people. Ok, I would be a little more convinced of their terrible terrorist status if they'd had access to SOME sort of legal process.
The headline makes me think: Should i say "no wonder" or "where's the outrage?"
What is the nobler art form, tragedy or satire?
- 5 votes
#4 - Tue Aug 1, 2006 2:09 AM EDTBoth Aristotle and Seneca seemed to agree with you Ansab, even if tragedy writers generally held a higher status in ancient Greece...
Satire is one of the highest forms of comedy although at its basis it requires a victim.
There are higher forms but they are sufficiently rare that i would need further research to corral them.
There are various humanistic, foible 'risk and redemption' forms that are pan cultural.
I like, given the humanistic form, the quotation that 'Laughter is the closest distance between people.'
Satire would be in this context, the closest distance between some people laughing at others.
'Laughter is the closest distance between people.'
Boy, I must be pretty close to a lot of people because they sure love laughing at me.
- 1 vote
lol
here's a thought, lock yourself up for 5 years without geneva convention protection, let's see what happens to you.
Most of these men were innocents. Now you're turn them into Terrorists. Good job.
That's a convenient way to set the "truth", isn't it? Drive these men to madness, eventually they do become terrorists, all the more to justify why we put them in the first place.
Horrifying.
I saw that.
I suggest you do too.
- 1 vote
#5 - Tue Aug 1, 2006 3:13 AM EDTZaki
Most of these men were innocents.
Got proof of that? I mean if most are innocent that means you can porvide at least 300 cases based on total population or 2 hundred based on current population.
Sorry the RtG Flic is meaningless tripe.
- 2 votes
Got proof of that?
and got proof that they are guilty?
if you "believe" in our laws, then you believe in innocent until proven guilty, not guilty until proven innocent.
this is a @!$%#ing witchhunt. how many of them have been charged? Like 10 of them?
Is it really that hard for yourself to picture your body in that situation?
I swear, some minds are simply impossible to break.
People who refuse to turn the tables are doomed to be themselves expose to non-sense.
These are a bunch of people who were at the wrong place at the wrong time. The way they are currently treated at Gitmo actually worsen their conditions and turns them more into terrorist.
If you didn't like that movie,
watch this one
The War Within
about a man who is wrongfully kidnapped in France, flown to some secret prison, accused of being a terrorist, and after a few years once he was finally released, turned into a terrorist. He went from being a normal guy to a full blown terrorist BECAUSE he was wrongfully imprisoned in horrible conditions!
The War Within
- 3 votes
Zaki
Got proof of that?
and got proof that they are guilty?
Didn't think so. Move the goalposts, change the subject. Call it what you want, end result you got called on a ludicrous statement and can't back it up. You avoid it by asking another question.
if you "believe" in our laws, then you believe in innocent until proven guilty, not guilty until proven innocent.this is a @!$%#ing witchhunt. how many of them have been charged? Like 10 of them?
How many in history that have been caught on a battle field have been charged? At best they are POW's. They don't get "charged," they get held in prison.
Is it really that hard for yourself to picture your body in that situation?I swear, some minds are simply impossible to break.
Yes it is, I'm not now or ever have been a terrorist. I never had the inclination to wonder around the Afghan countryside during a war then claim in blissful ignorance. "Oh please... I'm not a terrorist I'm a tourist here on vacation."
And BTW I do believe in the rule of law and defer to the recent Supreme Court ruling where part of Justice Scalia's opinion written as part of the majority ruling said the US could keep those at Gitmo indefinitely or until the end of the war on terror. That ruling only stated the gov had to reform the way any trials would be conducted and then submit it the Congress for approval.
These are a bunch of people who were at the wrong place at the wrong time. The way they are currently treated at Gitmo actually worsen their conditions and turns them more into terrorist.
I'll try again considering you are so insistent on making that fallacious claim. (And use your words for emphasis: "I swear, some minds are simply impossible to break.")
How many? 50%, 100%. Just how many of the approx 400 at gitmo right now, or out of the 600 total, are or were a bunch of people who were at the wrong place at the wrong time?
- 2 votes
Awwww poor guards. I cant even imagine the stuff they have to go through....wait....i mean prisoners...not guards.
#6 - Tue Aug 1, 2006 3:20 AM EDTCheck out these ads for Amnesty International:
http://adsoftheworld.com/media/print/amnesty_international_tightrope
http://adsoftheworld.com/media/print/amnesty_international_awake
http://adsoftheworld.com/media/print/amnesty_international_breath
- 1 vote
#7 - Tue Aug 1, 2006 3:30 AM EDTAt the risk of saying the very obvious indeed, Pentagon comment like this needs to be treated with extreme caution.
- 4 votes
#8 - Tue Aug 1, 2006 3:32 AM EDT"Yes, you do get upset but you get somebody to take your place," Keen said in explaining how he survives the tensions of the cell block. "You go outside. You walk it off and you come back and (say) I want to be back in the fight."
Because there is no battle more pure or satisfying than fighting with a man who has his hands handcuffed behind his back.
- 4 votes
#9 - Tue Aug 1, 2006 5:49 AM EDTSounds like it's more of a mental fight. A man with his hands tied behind is back is at no disadvantage when it comes to mind games.
That may be, but I'm having a little trouble reconciling "mental fight" with "assault with bodily fluids". Something just doesn't ring true there.
Then again, according to the New Math, magnet + car = patriotism, so what do I know?
- 4 votes
Please, be my guest. Although, to inflict maximum dissonance upon the user, may I suggest another medium?
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