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US: al-Qaida in Iraq Training Children

Wed Feb 6, 2008 2:15 PM EST
world-news, iraq, terrorists, boy
Lauren Frayer, Associated Press Writer
< PreviousNext >
showing 1 of 3 photos
<p>This undated image made from video released by the US military in Iraq which it says shows an apparent al-Qaida training operation. The videotapes seized during U.S. raids on suspected al-Qaida in Iraq hide-outs show the terror group training young boys to kidnap and assassinate civilians, U.S. and Iraqi officials said Wednesday, Feb. 6, 2008. (AP Photo/US Military via APTN)</p>

This undated image made from video released by the US military in Iraq which it says shows an apparent al-Qaida training operation. The videotapes seized during U.S. raids on suspected al-Qaida in Iraq hide-outs show the terror group training young boys to kidnap and assassinate civilians, U.S. and Iraqi officials said Wednesday, Feb. 6, 2008. (AP Photo/US Military via APTN)

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BAGHDAD — Boys in soccer jerseys don black masks and grab weapons. They scramble over mud-brick walls, blast down doors and hold guns to the heads of residents inside. The U.S. military said videos seized from suspected al-Qaida in Iraq hideouts show militants training children who appear as young as 10 to kidnap and kill.

It's viewed as a sign that the terror network — hungry for recruits — may be using younger Iraqis in propaganda to lure a new crop of fighters.

"Al-Qaida in Iraq wants to poison the next generation of Iraqis," said Rear Adm. Gregory Smith, a U.S. military spokesman. "It is offering children as the new generation of mujahedeen," he added, using the Arabic term for holy warriors.

The video, shown to reporters Wednesday, depicted an apparent training session with black-masked boys — ammunition belts draped across their small chests — forcing a man off his bicycle at gunpoint and marching him off down a muddy lane. An off-camera voice, speaking with an Iraqi accent, instructs children how to take firing positions with assault rifles.

At one point, the boys huddle in a circle on a cement floor, solemnly pledging allegiance to al-Qaida.

U.S. and Iraqi officials said they could offer no estimate of how many children have joined the insurgency.

Young children are rarely behind insurgent attacks in Iraq, though they have been used as decoys. In March, police said children were used in a car bombing in which the driver gained permission to park in a busy shopping area after pointing out that he was leaving his kids in the back seat. The children were killed along with three Iraqi bystanders.

The military said the videos — seized in a December raid in Khan Bani Saad northeast of Baghdad — were filmed in Iraq and depicted Iraqi children, but offered no definitive evidence. Smith said the adult trainer's voice had an Iraqi accent. It could not be determined when the videos were made, he added.

The scenes included boys mimicking the violence and aggression that have become familiar to Iraqi children since the 2003 U.S.-led invasion. But the footage also appeared to show organized militant training sessions, suggesting an effort by al-Qaida-inspired insurgents to train ever-younger — and perhaps less conspicuous — militants.

The raw footage was likely to be incorporated into propaganda films for al-Qaida or other militant groups.

"We believe this video is used as propaganda to send out to recruit other boys ... and to send a broader message across Iraq to indoctrinate youth into al-Qaida," Smith said.

American soldiers frequently discover propaganda-style materials among the weapons and ammunition they confiscate daily in raids across Iraq.

In a Dec. 8 operation in Muqdadiyah, north of the Iraqi capital, U.S. troops found an Arabic movie script with scenes of terrorists training children, and children interrogating and executing victims, Smith said.

Both the videos and film script were found in Diyala province, a hotbed of Sunni militant activity.

Smith said the military decided to show the videos of children to expose al-Qaida's "morally broken ideology" and encourage Iraqi opposition. An estimated 80,000 Sunni tribesmen have already crossed lines to join the Americans in ousting militants from their hometowns.

Last week, Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice called al-Qaida in Iraq "the most brutal and bankrupt of movements" after twin market bombings carried out by women described by Iraqi authorities as mentally disabled. The U.S. military later backed the Iraqi account of the bombings, which killed nearly 100 people.

"Iraq's democratic and elected government is building schools ... and offers the children of Iraq hope for a peaceful and prosperous future. Al-Qaida in Iraq sends 15-year-old boys and mentally handicapped women on suicide missions, builds car bombs and is trying to teach children how to kill," Smith said.

In one scene, young trainees — toting guns as long as the children are tall — pile out of a van in military-style formation. They surround a car and force out the mock driver. One hauls along a rocket-propelled grenade launcher.

Another clip shows a young boy wearing a suicide vest and posing with automatic weapons.

Iraqi Defense Ministry spokesman Mohammed al-Askari said he believed insurgents were kidnapping an increasing number of Iraqi children, though he could not offer details or figures.

"This is not only to recruit them, but also to demand ransom to fund the operations of al-Qaida," al-Askari said. He aired another grainy video clip which he said showed Iraqi security forces rescuing an 11-year-old boy who had been kidnapped by al-Qaida.

The short clip was mostly dark, and showed a boy blinking in the beam of a flashlight. Al-Qaida had demanded a $100,000 ransom for his release, but an informant's tip led to his rescue, al-Askari said.

© 2008 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.
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  • Lauren Frayer's Column, All of Newsvine
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  • Regions: Iraq , United States , Baghdad
  • Public Discussion (73)
Sprydle

Yep - invading Iraq as part of the "War on Terror" has been really successful.

Best AQ recruiting tool ever.

  • 9 votes
Reply#1 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 4:43 PM EST
query

Best AQ recruiting tool ever.

I don't know about that-America's fully in control of Iraq. Al Qaeda must be desperate for Islamic martyrs after most of their jihadists got decimated in Iraq or were running scared from US forces. Now they're turning to women, children and mentally handicapped people, how pathetic.

When they've exhausted this supply of 'willing subjects', they'll turn to senior citizens and stray animals to carry out their terrorist attacks that they're too cowardly to do themselves.

  • 3 votes
#1.1 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 8:46 PM EST
Reply
MaryGJ

Well, what did you all expect? Does the Shrub care that thanks to him and his stealth VP al-Qaida is all over Iraq now? Saddam would never have let that happen as brutal as he was.

  • 6 votes
Reply#2 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 4:43 PM EST
bighed03

Fresh war propaganda just when the citizens of the US start to dream of better days in new leadership.
I wouldn't put it past the CIA fabricating this.

  • 4 votes
Reply#3 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 4:49 PM EST
kiml

My sentiments exactly.
Bush and Co. are becoming the boy who cried wolf.
The sad part is that many Americans are still doing the "run, duck and cover" routine.
My main fear is that when they figure that they can't control the oil, they will look for an easier target. Canada!

  • 3 votes
#3.1 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 4:56 PM EST
Reply
IndependentVoter

A terrorist organization is training children to be terrorist..and let me guess it is Bush's fault.

Amazing. It will not be long before you sue the police for not providing a get away for a bank robber.

  • 7 votes
Reply#4 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 5:06 PM EST
JoulesBeef

um.. well concidering theri wasnt an al qaeda till we gave it a name..
concidering all reports have shown that bush's war on terror has increased al qaedas recruiting.
recent reports by our own cia says that al qeada is now as strong as it was on 9/11
but is the unitary executive.. it was his decidering that have caused al qeada to grow..

I suppose if the police instead of going after the bank robbers, decided to attack the donnut shop down the street and left the banks un guarded... well then you could blame the cops.. but luckily for all of us.. most of society isnt as dangerously ignorant and incompetant as bush.

  • 10 votes
#4.1 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 5:22 PM EST
IndependentVoter

Since when do you believe what the CIA says?

  • 4 votes
#4.2 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 5:43 PM EST
IndependentVoter

well concidering theri wasnt an al qaeda till we gave it a name..

Take your medication.

We did not give it a name.

This vanguard constitutes the solid base` [qaeda in Arabic] for the hoped-for society .... We shall continue the jihad no matter how long the way, until the last breath and the last beat of the pulse - or until we see the Islamic state established.'

"The Solid Base" (Al-Qaeda), Al-Jihad (journal), April 1988, n.41

Abdullah Yusuf Azzam

Al-Qaeda (also al-Qaida or al-Qa'ida or al-Qa'idah) (Arabic: القاعدة‎ al-qāʕida, translation: The Base) is an international alliance of Islamic militant terrorist organizations founded in 1988 by Azzam

  • 6 votes
#4.3 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 5:53 PM EST
MaryGJ

Perhaps he meant we gave it a world stage and recognition it would not have received. bin Laden is a product of the USA, period. Another example of what is going to happen in Iraq when the Sunnis we have been arming turn against us. I guess by then the Shrub, Decider, Commander Guy will have retreated to his ranch in Texas or maybe kidnapped to go on trial at the Hague for war crimes.

  • 2 votes
#4.4 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 6:00 PM EST
IndependentVoter

According to history Azzam was Bin ladin mentor

  • 4 votes
#4.5 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 6:52 PM EST
JoulesBeef

can you shgow me a quote from ossama using that term prior to 9/11
how about in his war decoration on the west in 96??? no?? but he is the leader of al qaeda head boogey man no? maybe he didnt know what to call his group.
did you scrolll down to the bottom of that wiki entry that talks abotu the origins of the term?

anyway i did mean what the poster above suggest.. we gave them legitamacy.

  • 3 votes
#4.6 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 6:54 PM EST
IndependentVoter

Azzam named the group. Take your meds...get some sleep.

  • 6 votes
#4.7 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 7:02 PM EST
hllclmbr

can you shgow me a quote from ossama using that term prior to 9/11
how about in his war decoration on the west in 96??? no?? but he is the leader of al qaeda head boogey man no? maybe he didnt know what to call his group.
did you scrolll down to the bottom of that wiki entry that talks abotu the origins of the term?

anyway i did mean what the poster above suggest.. we gave them legitamacy.

I know drunken typing when I see it.

Carry on...

  • 2 votes
#4.8 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 7:32 PM EST
Bill Harrison

Dude, everytime an article like this appears the same circle of jerks line up to take turns blaming everyone except the ones who should be blamed in the first place.

  • 2 votes
#4.9 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 8:42 PM EST
IndependentVoter

True

  • 1 vote
#4.10 - Thu Feb 7, 2008 11:17 AM EST
Reply
Shawn Gordon

Al-Queda has been training children for decades, it's pretty common knowledge - especially if you can remember the first gulf war... we talked about it a lot back then - reporters would ask "why do you hate Americans", and they'd respond "they are the white devil". Now, think... that's not a WHY answer, its a WHAT answer. They've been teaching kids to hate Americans and oppose those who oppose their parents, as I said... for decades

  • 3 votes
Reply#5 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 5:08 PM EST
JoulesBeef

decades?

maybe terrorist groups.. or if you mean al qaeda means terrorist in arabic or something..
but al qaeda didnt exist decades ago.
the cia first used the term al qaeda in 1998
bin ladin himself never used the term until well after 9/11

it's an avertisement.. a NLP.. stupid terorists couldnt get organised.. so we did it for them.

  • 5 votes
#5.1 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 5:26 PM EST
krishna-167929

Al-Queda has been training children for decades, it's pretty common knowledge

I am not surprized.The Palis have also been training kids to hate-- and to kill. They've been doing it for years.

  • 4 votes
#5.2 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 5:40 PM EST
Shawn Gordon

the cia first used the term al qaeda in 1998
bin ladin himself never used the term until well after 9/11

Ok... a decade 1998-2008

It's a label and doesn't mean that prior to the term the group did not exist, even by the same label. Palestine didn't 'exist' until a US reporter 'coined' the term in WWII (or shortly after) - but I'm willing to bet you that Palestinians would rigorously argue that Palestine in fact did exist. the point is that WE (Americans) didn't use the word commonly or that most of us didn't hear the word until 1997. But, the did exist for decades

so...

The radical Islamist movement in general and al-Qaeda in particular developed during the Islamic revival and Islamist movement of the last three decades of the 20th century along with less extreme movements.

-source

  • 2 votes
#5.3 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 5:46 PM EST
ehad aham

Palestine didn't 'exist' until a US reporter 'coined' the term in WWII (or shortly after) - but I'm willing to bet you that Palestinians would rigorously argue that Palestine in fact did exist.

Thats a fairly interesting claim. Can you explain why my grandma's birth certificate says Palestine then?

  • 4 votes
#5.4 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 6:01 PM EST
Shawn Gordon

Thats a fairly interesting claim. Can you explain why my grandma's birth certificate says Palestine then?

Thats why I had 'exist' and 'coined' in quotes. I was illustrating that simply because people in the US never heard of the place or of an action before does not mean that it didn't exist prior to hearing about it. And, just because someone in the US introduced the term or event isn't grounds to say that we discovered it or created it - as Joules Beef was trying to say about Al-Queda not being around until 1998. My entire point was that Palestine did exist before the US heard of it or before it was a heavy use word, just like Al-Queda.

In short, I think you took what I was saying wrong, but its okay.

  • 1 vote
#5.5 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 10:27 PM EST
ehad aham

I did, indeed, misconstrue your point. My bad.

  • 1 vote
#5.6 - Thu Feb 7, 2008 2:03 AM EST
Shawn Gordon

Not a problem, sometimes that happens.

    #5.7 - Thu Feb 7, 2008 2:56 AM EST
    Reply
    atonhunter

    ROFL! This article is killing me.

    AP needs to remember to use the "SATIRE" tag...

    • 3 votes
    Reply#6 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 5:10 PM EST
    ehad aham

    "Al-Qaida in Iraq wants to poison the next generation of Iraqis," said Rear Adm. Gregory Smith, a U.S. military spokesman. "It is offering children as the new generation of mujahedeen," he added, using the Arabic term for holy warriors.

    Al-Qaida in Iraq or as the news networks love to call it, AQI, are a tiny minority of the "insurgency" faced in Iraq, even according to government papers. This is fear-mongering at its best.

    • 4 votes
    Reply#7 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 5:35 PM EST
    WhyIt

    Maybe it's because we dropped bombs on their parents.

    • 2 votes
    Reply#8 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 5:36 PM EST
    Joseph Cotton

    Just in case the GOP wins....

      Reply#9 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 5:37 PM EST
      JoulesBeef

      For fairness in reporting..
      The US is far far more advanced in this area.
      We have the video game "Americas army"
      and then we also have a wide variety of military schools for troubled kids of all ages.

      so far the youngest terrorist captured was a 15 year old boy picked up in aphghanistan.. there are arguements he wasnt involved in anything.
      the youngest confirmed was a suicide bomber of 16

      the us youngest solider in history was Edward black at age of 8 in the civil war. (i only put it in here for the info not to compare like i did above)

      teh youngest us soldier in WWII was 12 or 13 depends on where you look

      • 3 votes
      Reply#10 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 5:39 PM EST
      MightyMait

      My thoughts exactly regarding the violent video-games.

      Also, don't forget the Boy Scouts. Surely we must dismantle this Christian terrorist-training organization!! All those boys going around learning how to tie knots, build fires and use knives!

      • 1 vote
      #10.1 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 6:09 PM EST
      winsomecowboy

      And hate gays.

      • 2 votes
      #10.2 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 7:00 PM EST
      MightyMait

      And hate gays.

      So true. Funny (and also sad)!!

      It's an "extremist, hate" group!

      • 2 votes
      #10.3 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 7:07 PM EST
      Shawn Gordon

      First, Boy Scouts aren't a 'hate group'. it is a group that you can choose to join, but are not required to join. As such the rules as they are set forth give the participants an option. Be a member and do or dont do these things, or dont be a member and dont worry about it.

      One of the rules is that a Scout Leader cannot be gay. I could understand the anger at teh BSA is say the government disallowed a gay only organization to form. Girls are not allowed to join the BSA (they can Explorers which is co-ed). What did the girls do? Made the GSA... what stops gays from making the Homosexual Scouts of America? Nothing.

      At NO point in my BSA membership was I EVER told, taught, or even given suggestion to hate anyone for any reason. Nor were any of the things we did 'extreme' unless you consider kayaking in class 4 waters, spelunking about 200 feet down, or hiking 50 miles in 3 days kind of extreme.

      It is true that they do have a lot of Christian backing, but that has a lot to do with their founding and that most Troops are sponsored by a Church. It is not required you attend church or even have a faith. The do offer medals and 'knots' for having faith and demonstrating a good working knowledge of your faith if you have one, but no merit badges or belt loops (if you kick it old school) have any requirements that can only be met with church involvement (aside from Clerical ones, which are optional and rare)

      It amazes me at the total lack of understanding people have of the BSA yet their readiness to fire off about it.

      @ Joules Beef

      We have the video game "Americas army" and then we also have a wide variety of military schools for troubled kids of all ages.

      I don't buy into the vilent video games makes violent kids stuff... nor do I completely buy into AA being a training tool. A recruiting tool (but its purpose is optional) - yes I'll agree to that much.

      Anyone who wants to equate 8 and 9 year olds using live AKU-74s and AK47s to kill real people to being just as bad as using a mouse to point and click a glossed overview of a watered down Medal of Honor is really far off base. Especially when in the same comment you point out that the youngest suicide bomber was 16.

      Did America's Army cause Columbine? No... they blamed that on 'artists' like Marylin Manson and Ozzy... despite that Americas Army was popular in those times too.

      Pointing out children in war from close to 70 to....about 130 years ago does what? show that we stopped doing that and they didn't? okay.... and then....

      • 1 vote
      #10.4 - Thu Feb 7, 2008 3:15 AM EST
      MightyMait

      Gee whiz!! I was half-way joking about the BSA!

      I was never a Boy Scout, but, as a boy, I had the Boy Scout manual right next to the U.S. Army Improvised Munitions Handbook. I never actually did much with each, but it was fun reading about how one could make explosives using urea from pee and all the different types of knots one could tie.

      As a(n) (almost) typical American youth, we were running around with cammo pants and toy guns pretending to kill each other. My friends who lived up in the mountains got to fire real guns (and would have been trained to hunt, no doubt, had they not been vegetarians).

      Even if the story is about real occurrences, I see a whole lot of hypocrisy in any American decrying it considering the culture of violence in which we live.

      • 2 votes
      #10.5 - Thu Feb 7, 2008 9:43 AM EST
      Reply
      TBone

      Seriously. Nobody believes this crap any more do they?

      • 5 votes
      Reply#11 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 6:03 PM EST
      JoulesBeef

      sad state when the US and the world soooo disbelieve our intelligence service.
      Bush has made us much much more in danger with all his lies.
      iran could probably nuke a city and the world wouldnt belive us, even if we have amadinajda admit it on live tv.

      • 3 votes
      #11.1 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 7:02 PM EST
      TBone

      You know JoulesBeef...I couldn't agree more. Crazy that we tolerate even a *single* lie from our commander in chief.

      • 1 vote
      #11.2 - Thu Feb 7, 2008 12:41 PM EST
      Reply
      ytmnd

      Clearly this story is a neocon fabrication, right guys?

      • 4 votes
      Reply#12 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 6:23 PM EST
      JoulesBeef

      if you recall wolf was actually real once.. still didnt change the story.

      • 1 vote
      #12.1 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 7:00 PM EST
      Reply
      Defektiv

      uh, this is old news. if our political leaders did ANY research into fundamentalism in the middle east then they'd know that the extremist leaders yank boys out of villages at young ages, put them into a literal world of hell while they grow up without any contact with a woman then tell them the only way out of this hell is to take out a bunch of people by blowing themselves up, in which case they'd drink wine with God and have 72 virgins.

      as a young man literally living in a hell on earth during almost their entire younger life, why wouldn't they believe this? but no, lets just bomb iraq for 72 hours, disband their entire army sitting on caches of weapons and then sell off all their national assets while we regulate their oil. that surely won't create more of a reason for them to hate us.

      and mccain is currently leading the GOP with his "100 years in iraq, i promise many more wars" views. i'm an american but most of us are hopeless at this point. no longer can the excuse be used, "oh wow, i had no idea." willful ignorance in order that you won't feel a little bad is no excuse, its just plain abhorrent and despicable. the truth and facts are out there and people like me have been frantically trying to get people to go research this crap but get told we're terrorists for contradicting the white house.

      • 6 votes
      Reply#13 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 6:30 PM EST
      patti-235819

      HEY! Just because we hadn't heard about this in the past doesn't mean it wasn't happening before we entered the region. These folks have been fighting since the beginning of time and will continue to fight until they are exterminated.

      Be happy that Bush and Cheney took to arms against these people. If it were me, I would not have listened to a word anyone else said and I would have given the order to drop the bombs. I want that region obliterated. Nuke the whole god-forsaken region. They are of no use to anyone...if you think that's harsh...well, it is what it is. If we don't stop them...then who?

      • 4 votes
      Reply#14 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 6:44 PM EST
      winsomecowboy

      You should get help.

      • 6 votes
      #14.1 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 7:02 PM EST
      TBone

      It's not harsh, patti, it's genocide.

      • 4 votes
      #14.2 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 7:03 PM EST
      atonhunter

      You should get help.

      Why seek help when you can hate?

      Much easier to blame others for all your trouble, no?

      • 3 votes
      #14.3 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 8:56 PM EST
      Reply
      patti-235819

      Why should I get help? And why is it genocide?

      I speak the truth...fear not the truth. I don't sucide bomb people!!! If you commit the crime then you must pay the piper.

      Time to meet your maker terrorists!

      • 2 votes
      Reply#15 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 8:45 PM EST
      TBone

      1) Your tax dollars do bomb people
      2) Your argument is that we should bomb more people
      3) The vast, vast, overwhelming majority of the people you now want to bomb are very nice people that don't bomb anybody, children patti...you remember them, right?
      4) You wouldn't last 30 minutes in the deserts where these people have created civilization

      • 3 votes
      #15.1 - Thu Feb 7, 2008 12:50 PM EST
      atonhunter

      PLEASE don't feed the trolls!

      Although, I think we've found a good running mate for Huckabee now. An independent run for the Turn-Em-Into-A-Glass-Parking-Lot / Arab-Genocide Party?

      • 2 votes
      #15.2 - Thu Feb 7, 2008 1:47 PM EST
      MightyMait

      Although, I think we've found a good running mate for Huckabee now. An independent run for the Turn-Em-Into-A-Glass-Parking-Lot / Arab-Genocide Party?

      LOL!!

      You'd think that Huckabee, with his connections "Upstairs" could arrange for a Passover-like plague that would only afflict the baddies without having to take out everybody in the region.

      • 2 votes
      #15.3 - Thu Feb 7, 2008 2:14 PM EST
      Reply
      patti-235819

      How many people must they continue to slaughter before you open your eyes and see what they really are?

      And hate? Who knows how better to hate than those raised in the middle east to hate the west? Why can't you put the blame where it really goes? Are you that naive that you think you could broker peace by saying, "I understand your plight?" I would love to see how long it takes before they behead you and give you your 15 minutes of fame, posthumously, of course.

      • 1 vote
      Reply#16 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 9:10 PM EST
      Defektiv

      and i suppose you believe all muslims are terrorists too? i suppose you believe that there are still wmds to be found? i suppose you think there were still ties between sadaam and bin-laden? i suppose you still think that bushs abuse of signing statements, proven lies and pardoning of a man that was tried and convicted in our own courts was ok? i suppose you think that bush claiming executive privilege to keep people from adhering to a congressional subpoena is just fine and constitutional? i suppose you think cheney illegally classifying every document so that it will never leave the white house and bush trying to establish retroactive immunity to being charge for any of this is just plain christian-like? i suppose you also think that halliburtons 82% of the war reconstruction contracts without delivering (in fact being caught NOT doing so) and cheneys stock in halliburton rising over 3000% is just coincidence? i suppose its also just ok that thousands of emails, ones that were illegally forwarded through the GOP, just disappeared including backups that system redundancies are designed to keep?

      just shut up. you obviously have no clue what you're talking about. you haven't done crap for research or you'd realize you're talking straight out of your backside. it's an insult to us that spend our time researching the truth that you would even expect anyone to believe that crap anymore. get off of fox news and start searching the internet. theres plenty of public data out there and you do yourself and this country an incredible disservice to keep spreading this kind of propaganda.

      or are you getting paid to spread this crap? it surely would explain the blatant disregard for logic and truth.

      • 5 votes
      #16.1 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 10:03 PM EST
      winsomecowboy

      don't feed the trolls

      • 5 votes
      #16.2 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 10:10 PM EST
      Sprydle

      She's worse than a troll, she's a psychotic bucket o' irony.

      • 5 votes
      #16.3 - Wed Feb 6, 2008 10:36 PM EST
      MightyMait

      How many people must they continue to slaughter before you open your eyes and see what they really are?

      I think "we" have slaughtered way more of "them" than "they" have slaughtered of "us".

      That, and what everybody else said.

      • 2 votes
      #16.4 - Thu Feb 7, 2008 9:47 AM EST
      Reply
      Arbitrary Intelligence

      Surely Al Qaeda would never do such a terrible thing had we not provoked them to these means. ;-)

      I'm surprised that everyone is either shocked or in disbelief. This has been going on in Africa and the Middle East for years. This has not been fabricated, nor is it breaking news. I'm surprised at how fickle-minded people can be.

      Another thing, this is in no way Bush's doing. Yes, Bush is not an intelligent man. That has been long established, but the extremist indoctrination and military training of youth was around and prevailing long before G-Dub was born. Al Qaeda has been "recruiting" (kidnapping) children just as long as the FARC (Columbia) and Janjaweed (Sudan).

      This is not new information to the U.S. intelligence community. I love how everyone believes that because a topic is not #1 with the ever trustworthy media that our intelligence community is not already on top of it. There is simply no easy, cheap, or politically-correct way to specifically combat these terrorist orgs who recruit this way.

        Reply#17 - Thu Feb 7, 2008 11:02 AM EST
        MightyMait

        The U.S. practically kidnaps children, but it waits until they're 18 (though many, no doubt, are still 12 emotionally). With recruitment centers predominantly in lower-income areas, the Army entices the "lower classes" with promises of job-training, money for college, respectability, etc.

        More hypocrisy.

        • 2 votes
        #17.1 - Thu Feb 7, 2008 12:11 PM EST
        IndependentVoter

        More nonsense.

          #17.2 - Thu Feb 7, 2008 12:42 PM EST
          MightyMait

          More nonsense.

          Have a lot of recruitment centers in *your* neighborhood, do you?

          • 2 votes
          #17.3 - Thu Feb 7, 2008 1:16 PM EST
          Arbitrary Intelligence

          Mighty,
          What are you talking about? Any Army in the history of man has been made predominately of the underprivileged.

          At least in the U.S. we have a choice whether or not to serve in our Armed Forces. Furthermore, the lower-income individuals who volunteer for service keep people, like yourself, from being drafted. They receive great benefits and make decent money for not having a college degree.

          Anyway, who are the hypocrites?

            #17.4 - Thu Feb 7, 2008 2:53 PM EST
            MightyMait

            Anyway, who are the hypocrites?

            I would have happily spent a few years of my younger years in a mandatory service corps dedicated to maintaining infrastructure, building goodwill with our neighbors, etc.

            I don't consider killing strangers to be in anybody's interest--not mine, not yours, not theirs--except the person selling the bullets.

            • 2 votes
            #17.5 - Thu Feb 7, 2008 3:00 PM EST
            MightyMait

            Any Army in the history of man has been made predominately of the underprivileged.

            That's right. "Predominately" being the key word. The officers have almost all been members of the social elites. In England, they even bought and sold their commissions.

            Can you explain to me why a country like ours, which has not been attacked from without since 1812 needs an Army of more than a couple hundred thousand unpaid volunteers? What's wrong with militias? Heck, why not mandatory military service for all adults the way Israel has? I'm all for that, as long as we are *defending* our country and not invading sovereign nations with our armed forces.

            • 2 votes
            #17.6 - Thu Feb 7, 2008 3:04 PM EST
            IndependentVoter

            Can you explain to me why a country like ours, which has not been attacked from without since 1812 needs an Army of more than a couple hundred thousand unpaid volunteers?

            Pearl Harbor does not count?

            Anyway, we could not have defended Europe with militias.

              #17.7 - Thu Feb 7, 2008 3:39 PM EST
              Arbitrary Intelligence

              Kind of like what IndependentVoter was alluding to: The reasoning for our massive military goes back to WWII when we had to gain and train around 4 million troops over the course of a year.

              The military is also a great source of employment in peacetime.

              I do, however, see your point on defense. It could be a good thing to re-establish the State Militia as our forefathers intended. I would have to look into that deeper before I would be sold on it. We did go through a civil war once.

                #17.8 - Thu Feb 7, 2008 3:43 PM EST
                MightyMait

                Pearl Harbor does not count?

                Anyway, we could not have defended Europe with militias.

                Good point about Hawaii. It's not part of the Continental United States, though, and, according to many ought to be a sovereign nation like the Philippines.

                Why was it our business to defend Europe? If Europe had fallen to the Germans (probably only temporarily--they never did fully take Russia), do you honestly think they would have tried to conquer the US next?

                Still, these are quibbles. In today's world, imperialism is the only reason why the US needs a professional military.

                • 2 votes
                #17.9 - Thu Feb 7, 2008 4:12 PM EST
                MightyMait

                The military is also a great source of employment in peacetime.

                Yeah, and what do they do during peace-time? Train and sit on their butts? How useful is that?

                In the former Soviet Union, a good many troops, so I am told, never even fired a real rifle--they would drill with wooden dummies. Many Soviet troops were involved with infrastructure-related work--building and repairing railroads and the like.

                Considering that we have bridges collapsing here at home, our military could be better employed repairing and extending our infrastructure, don't you think?

                • 2 votes
                #17.10 - Thu Feb 7, 2008 4:16 PM EST
                IndependentVoter

                Better yet...why don't you get a job.

                  #17.11 - Fri Feb 8, 2008 12:05 PM EST
                  MightyMait

                  Better yet...why don't you get a job.

                  Is that "you" me? I've been working full-time for county government since 2000, when my son was born. I do volunteer video/audio work with my local Community Television. Before that, I lived simply and worked part-time to pay my bills so I'd have more time to make music.

                  Or am I getting needlessly defensive?

                  Perhaps you were referring to people getting "real" jobs rather relying on the military for employment.

                    #17.12 - Fri Feb 8, 2008 12:35 PM EST
                    MaryGJ

                    MM do not let Independent bait you.

                    • 2 votes
                    #17.13 - Fri Feb 8, 2008 12:56 PM EST
                    MightyMait

                    MM do not let Independent bait you.

                    Thanks for the warning, MaryGJ. I thought I might have just misunderstood him/her.

                    • 1 vote
                    #17.14 - Fri Feb 8, 2008 1:19 PM EST
                    Reply
                    patti-235819

                    Why should I be labeled a troll just because I have a different opinion that you?

                    You people are no better than the terrorists in the way you try and bully those who don't see your point.

                    You are the trolls. Go back under your bridge so I can bomb it!

                      Reply#18 - Thu Feb 7, 2008 2:40 PM EST
                      Arbitrary Intelligence

                      Patti,
                      Settle down now. You seem to have some hate issues. Do you think that all Muslims are bad? Perhaps you are just being misread?????

                      • 1 vote
                      #18.1 - Thu Feb 7, 2008 3:08 PM EST
                      Reply
                      patti-235819

                      Yes...misread. I do believe I said the region...not the people. I do have some Muslim friends and I do not like to generalize, but the people in this thread leave me no choice. I do not have hate issues, but when people refuse to debate properly and seemingly want to take things to the playground...well, then there is no reasoning with them. And I mean the people in this forum, not the Middle East.

                        Reply#19 - Thu Feb 7, 2008 3:11 PM EST
                        Arbitrary Intelligence

                        Do some research on UAE. You will find an Islamic. Middle Eastern, State that is tolerant, conservative and stable.

                        There are many places in turmoil outside the Middle East.

                        I just find it best to try not to generalize, though it is difficult at times, always look at the big picture.

                        ~have a grand day~

                        • 2 votes
                        #19.1 - Thu Feb 7, 2008 3:34 PM EST
                        Reply
                        Martin Westenfelder

                        Strangely enough, it somewhat mimicks what was the training of the Fedayeen Saddam youth before the invasion - in general, the Fedayi movement, which has always been starting indoctrination somewhat in the way done by the Hitler Youth. A perverted form of boyscouting.

                        I have no doubt that Al-Quaida is using Iraqi tactics here, which also shows how far it has developed away from the times of Afghanistan & Sudan (where it drew young men) into a long-term thinking militia movement - like Hesb'allah, Hamas and others.

                        I personally find this video very troubling. Those who can find the time to do youth-training, have more backing in the society than is often suggested.

                        • 2 votes
                        Reply#20 - Thu Feb 7, 2008 9:56 PM EST
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