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Fort Riley atheist soldier speaks out on lawsuit

Sat Apr 26, 2008 3:22 AM EDT
us-news, army, atheist, speaks, jeremy-hall
John Milburn, Associated Press

United States Army Specialist Jeremy Hall takes a moment to collect his thoughts at a local coffee shop near Fort Riley in Junction City, Kan., Thursday, April, 24, 2008. Hall, an atheist, has brought a religious discrimination lawsuit against the government naming Secretary of Defense Robert Gates in the legal proceedings. He has filed a lawsuit alleging his constitutional rights have been violated because he doesn't believe in God. (AP Photo/Chuck France)

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— Like hundreds of young men joining the Army in recent years, Jeremy Hall professes a desire to serve his country while it fights terrorism.

But the short and soft-spoken specialist is at the center of a legal controversy. He has filed a lawsuit alleging he's been harassed and his constitutional rights have been violated because he doesn't believe in God. The suit names Defense Secretary Robert Gates.

"I'm not in it for cash," Hall said. "I want no one else to go what I went through."

Known as "the atheist guy," Hall has been called immoral, a devil worshipper and — just as severe to some soldiers — gay, none of which, he says, is true. Hall even drove fellow soldiers to church in Iraq and paused while they prayed before meals.

"I see a name and rank and United States flag on their shoulder. That's what I believe everyone else should see," he said.

Hall, 23, was raised in a Protestant family in North Carolina and dropped out of school before earning his GED. It wasn't until after he joined the Army that he began questioning religion, eventually deciding he couldn't follow any faith.

But he feared how that would look to other soldiers.

"I was ashamed to say that I was an atheist," Hall said.

It eventually came out in Iraq in 2007, when he was in a firefight. Hall was a gunner on a Humvee, which took several bullets in its protective shield. Afterward, his commander asked whether he believed in God, Hall said.

"I said, 'No, but I believe in Plexiglas,'" Hall said. "I've never believed I was going to a happy place. You get one life. When I die, I'm worm food."

The issue came to a head when, according to Hall, a superior officer, Maj. Freddy J. Welborn, threatened to bring charges against him for trying to hold a meeting of atheists in Iraq. Welborn has denied Hall's allegations.

Hall said he had had enough but feared he wouldn't get support from Welborn's superiors. He turned to Mikey Weinstein and the Military Religious Freedom Foundation.

Weinstein is the foundation's president and a U.S. Air Force Academy graduate. He had previously sued the Air Force for acts he said illegally imposed Christianity on students at the academy, though that case was dismissed. He calls Hall a hero.

"The average American doesn't have enough intestinal fortitude to tell someone to shut up if they are talking in a movie theater," Weinstein said. "You know how hard it is to take on your chain of command? This isn't the shift manager at KFC."

Hall was in Qatar when the lawsuit was filed on Sept. 18 in federal court in Kansas City, Kan. Other soldiers learned of it and he feared for his own safety. Once, Hall said, a group of soldiers followed him, harassing him, but no one did anything to make it stop.

The Army told him it couldn't protect him and sent him back to Fort Riley. He resumed duties with a military police battalion. He believes his promotion to sergeant has been blocked because of his lawsuit, but he is a team leader responsible for two junior enlisted soldiers.

No one with Fort Riley, the Army or Defense Department would comment about Hall or the lawsuit. Each issued statements saying that discrimination will not be tolerated regardless of race, religion or gender.

"The Department respects (and supports by its policy) the rights of others to their own religious beliefs, including the right to hold no beliefs," said Eileen Lainez, a spokeswoman for the Department of Defense.

All three organizations said existing systems help soldiers "address and resolve any perceived unfair treatment."

Lt. Col. David Shurtleff, a Fort Riley chaplain, declined to discuss Hall's case but said chaplains accommodate all faiths as best they can. In most cases, religious issues can be worked out without jeopardizing military operations.

"When you're in Afghanistan and an IED blows up a Humvee, they aren't asking about a wounded soldier's faith," Shurtleff said.

Hall said he enjoys being a team leader but has been told that having faith would make him a better leader.

"I will take care of my soldiers. Nowhere does it say I have to pray with my soldiers, but I do have to make sure my soldiers' religious needs are met," he said.

"Religion brings comfort to a lot of people," he said. "Personally, I don't want it or need it. But I'm not going to get down on anybody else for it."

Hall leaves the Army in April 2009. He would like to find work with the National Park Service or Environmental Protection Agency, anything outdoors.

"I hope this doesn't define me," Hall said of his lawsuit. "It's just about time somebody said something."

___

On the Net:

Military Religious Freedom Foundation: http://www.militaryreligiousfreedom.org

Fort Riley: http://www.riley.army.mil

Department of Defense: http://www.defenselink.mil

© 2008 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.
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  • John Milburn's Column, All of Newsvine
  • Groups: Atheism 101
  • Regions: United States , Qatar , Iraq , Afghanistan
  • Public Discussion (59)
Igor The Troll

Can you blame the guy? Bush telling everyone that God told him to invade Iraq!

Bush cut out your Bush@!$%# before the whole world becomes Atheist!

  • 2 votes
Reply#1 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 4:52 AM EDT
replytoj001

Great, the first reply blames Bush.....

What this is about is a soldier who has expressed his faith of having no faith. I see no problem with that.

replytoj001

    #1.1 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 6:44 AM EDT
    Igor The Troll

    Too bad the Christendom brethren do not see is as we do!

    • 1 vote
    #1.2 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 7:31 AM EDT
    miasma

    The fish rots from the head down.

    • 2 votes
    #1.3 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 9:07 AM EDT
    CliffDogg

    The fish rots from the head down.

    true - like most things, the culture and norms of any organization come from the top. The leaders indicate what is expected, allowed and rewarded (torture would be the other example that jumps out).

    But beyond blaming Bush, I think we have to give this kid credit for the guts and integrity he has to push this issue. Of course it'll be squashed by the military. But at least he tried.

    • 4 votes
    #1.4 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 9:27 AM EDT
    miasma

    Right, well I am more concerned with McCain's views than Bush' at this point. Since he is actively courting the fundies you have to think he'd support this kind of harassment and discrimination.

    • 2 votes
    #1.5 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 5:27 PM EDT
    Reply
    cyssus

    This guy has been discriminated against and harassed - as one unfortunately can expect.
    With Army/Marines lowering the bar further and accepting felons to the ranks to make the numbers - one begins to worry who will protect innocents from the army?

    • 3 votes
    Reply#2 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 5:43 AM EDT
    PudgeDiesel

    As a Deist in the military I see were he is coming from. You would be surprised by the discrimination against those without a major religious belief. When I was in training Sundays were days when no training took place and you had a choice, you could go to a religious service or do manual labor. I would just pick a random service to go to to avoid working my butt off on a Sunday afternoon.

    • 4 votes
    Reply#3 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 5:55 AM EDT
    replytoj001

    I am sorry for what you have gone through.

    As an Old 1SG who has his own religious beliefs I know I would not stand for any of this suttle discrimination against you or anyone else.

    When Sundays rolled around, if a soldier went to service...fine, if a soldier did not want to go....fine, I tried to make sure everyone had the time to worship with others if that was their choice, and I tried to make sure that if a soldier wanted to have time for quiet reflection that was fine to, and if a soldier wanted to rack out and veg that was fine to.

    Religion is so personal, I never have really understood it......

    BB

    replytoj001

    • 2 votes
    #3.1 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 6:55 AM EDT
    Reply
    Igor The Troll

    Sounds like the Roman Church Inquisition and its Crusaders! Witch Hunts everywhere to take the blame of its own ineptness.

    • 3 votes
    Reply#4 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 6:36 AM EDT
    juli54

    " The issue came to a head when, according to Hall, a superior officer, Maj. Freddy J. Welborn, threatened to bring charges against him for trying to hold a meeting of atheists in Iraq."

    Perhaps, just perhaps, he should have concentrated more on soldiering and less on his 'beliefs'.

    It's a good thing that he is leaving the military. He doesn't have his battle buddy's safety in mind. He has his own best interests at heart, and that does not a good soldier make.

    • 2 votes
    #5 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 7:29 AM EDT
    Igor The Troll

    Soldiering? What do you mean by that? Kill a few Sunnies or a few Shiats?
    Today we support Shaits tomorrow Sunnies? Or which one I forgot. It is so confusing!

    Better drop a Nuke and go home..:)

    • 3 votes
    #5.1 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 7:34 AM EDT
    juli54

    What I mean by that is staying focused on his mission, whatever it may be for that day. Unlike your apparently uninformed view of the American soldier, they are an honorable group for the most part, well trained and professional.

    • 1 vote
    #5.2 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 7:45 AM EDT
    iarnuocon

    Perhaps, just perhaps, he should have concentrated more on soldiering and less on his 'beliefs'. It's a good thing that he is leaving the military. He doesn't have his battle buddy's safety in mind. He has his own best interests at heart, and that does not a good soldier make.

    Congratulations, you win the prize for ass-hat of the day.

    Soldiers going to "worship" draws no comment from you, but if an atheist tries to get a couple of other atheists together-- whoa! Look out! He's too focused on his beliefs. That fella's mind isn't on soldierin'! Better get him out of the service. From the simple fact that he's an atheist who has filed a lawsuit against the military for discriminating against him, you've drawn the conclusion that he's a detriment to the military, that he's reckless of his buddies' safety, that he's selfish, and that he's not a good soldier.

    You and Freddy Wellborn. Two people who should be fired. Out of a cannon. Preferably into a wall.

    • 14 votes
    #5.3 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 12:11 PM EDT
    Youssef51

    juli54:

    Ever hear about something called the First Amendment?

    Given the tone of your comments you might want to investigate it.

    By the way: US military personnel take an oath in which they swear to uphold and protect the Constitution. They do not swear to protect the President of the United States or any church.

    iarnuocon:

    You said it.

    • 3 votes
    #5.4 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 3:16 PM EDT
    juli54

    Have you ever heard of the UCMJ, Youssef?

    Given the tone of your comments you might want to investigate it.

    "They do not swear to protect the President of the United States or any church. "

    I have no idea how this statement fits into this discussion.

    "

      #5.5 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 3:39 PM EDT
      juli54

      Re #5.3. Nice job on the personal attacks.

      He didn't follow the chain-of-command.

      That's why he doesn't belong in the military. Period.

        #5.6 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 4:09 PM EDT
        Dan LS

        "They do not swear to protect the President of the United States or any church. "

        I have no idea how this statement fits into this discussion.

        The Constitution protects religious freedom. The current President (or a church) do not.

        So, every soldier swears to die defending religious freedom.... get it?

        • 4 votes
        #5.7 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 4:12 PM EDT
        Dan LS

        He didn't follow the chain-of-command.

        That's why he doesn't belong in the military. Period.

        Its your duty as a soldier (ok, maybe this one was just taught to the officers) to questing illegal orders.

        If you are ordered to line up a dozen children and shoot them in front of their parents, in that circumstance, you should disobey the chain-of-command. No one wants another Vietnam.

        This soldier is questioning orders that told him he could not assemble a group of atheists on base. This is illegal (according to the Constitution) and a violation of his right to religious freedom. Thus, he did the RIGHT THING and questioned it.

        • 5 votes
        #5.8 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 4:16 PM EDT
        juli54

        Okay, yeah I get that.

        The military is also under the constraints of the UCMJ which states that all service members must follow the chain-of-command.

        Get it?

          #5.9 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 4:23 PM EDT
          Dan LS

          A little required reading on the UCMJ:

          These articles require the obedience of LAWFUL orders. An order which is unlawful not only does not need to be obeyed, but obeying such an order can result in criminal prosecution of the one who obeys it. Military courts have long held that military members are accountable for their actions even while following orders -- if the order was illegal.

          Ordering a subordinate to pray/not pray is illegal.

          • 5 votes
          #5.10 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 4:35 PM EDT
          juli54

          Dan, this is not about illegal orders. If a soldier has a grievance, he is required to follow the chain-of-command to voice them. He did not.

          " Specialist Hall did not file a complaint with the Army's Equal Opportunity Office because, he said, he was mistrustful of his superior officers. Instead, he told leaders of the Military Association of Atheists and Freethinkers, who put him in touch with Mr. Weinstein."

          He created the problem and the press is all too willing to run with it because it puts the military in a bad light.

          • 1 vote
          #5.11 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 4:35 PM EDT
          Dan LS

          The issue came to a head when, according to Hall, a superior officer, Maj. Freddy J. Welborn, threatened to bring charges against him for trying to hold a meeting of atheists in Iraq. Welborn has denied Hall's allegations.

          Actually, it seems like he was never ordered to do anything... just threatened. So if anyone should be in trouble for this, its Maj. Freddy J. Welborn for threatening a subordinate's freedom of religion.

          • 5 votes
          #5.12 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 4:41 PM EDT
          juli54

          "Actually, it seems like he was never ordered to do anything... just threatened."

          Alledgedly.

          Or are we just taking Hall's word for everything because he is a 'cause celebre'?

          Doesn't matter. He. Didn't. Follow. The. Chain. Of. Command.

            #5.13 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 4:56 PM EDT
            iarnuocon

            Doesn't matter. He. Didn't. Follow. The. Chain. Of. Command. I like how when you're called on your bigotry, suddenly it's all about the UCMJ and the chain of command. Great, he "didn't follow the chain of command." Neither you, me nor anyone else knows his reasons for that outside of what he has stated-- Hall said he had had enough but feared he wouldn't get support from Welborn's superiors. That's what the trial is about, isn't it? The question as to whether he would have gotten support from Welborn's superiors, or whether the military is creating an atmosphere of religious intolerance, and maintaining an unconstitutional religious preference?

            Of course, faced with people such as yourself, who I will again repeat, base your initial reaction to the man solely on his atheism and your ignorant assumption that it makes him a "bad" person and a "bad" soldier, I might do the same thing in his shoes.

            So you can blow the UCMJ horn all you like, but that doesn't erase in any way the fact that your first reaction had @!$%#-all to do with the UCMJ, that your second reaction was to get all puffed up about being "attacked personally" (apparently blind to the trenchant irony of the complaint), and that only after having been called out for you stupidity did you seek to frame this as being about something other than his atheism.

            Like I said-- congratulations, you win the ass-hat of the day award.

            • 6 votes
            #5.14 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 8:01 PM EDT
            Youssef51

            juli54:

            He created the problem and the press is all too willing to run with it because it puts the military in a bad light.

            "He created the problem". OK. As you wish.

            Your line of reasoning is remarkable and discouraging.

            The people who wrote the US Constitution knew all about this kind of talk and they did what they could to protect the Republic against it. They were a thousand times smarter than people are today. Braver, too.

            I hope you never end up in a situation even remotely similar to the case at hand. You would almost certainly blame yourself and keep silent rather than standing up for your rights as a US citizen.

            • 4 votes
            #5.15 - Sun Apr 27, 2008 3:51 AM EDT
            PudgeDiesel

            if yoyu feel you acnnot go through your Chain of Command there are many alternatives, like the Chaplain,your Congressman, and IG. Going through the Chain of Command is not required.

            • 2 votes
            #5.16 - Sun Apr 27, 2008 5:05 AM EDT
            Reply
            Igor The Troll

            Ok, let's Scapegoat the guy! Uncle Sam wants you, as long as you are not Gay or Atheist.
            Free Greencard and Citizenship when you sign on the doted line!

            Fight for God, Country, and a Pass across the Rio Grande!

            • 3 votes
            Reply#6 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 7:43 AM EDT
            kcsdarwin

            "Religion is stupid." Bill Maher

            • 3 votes
            Reply#7 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 8:59 AM EDT
            miasma

            There are, of course, many sins one can commit in the eyes of religion. Among the greatest is the sin of having an original thought. Religion disapproves of original thought the way Dracula disapproves of sunlight. Almost as bad is the sin of blasphemy, for which Christ was executed. - Pat Condell.

            WWJHD? (what would john hagee do?)

            • 2 votes
            #7.1 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 9:14 AM EDT
            replytoj001

            "Religion is stupid." Bill Maher

            Right up to he point when something happens in your life that causes you to wonder if there is a higher power.

            So wonder, some don't, some will, some won't....either way it is all personal and we all react differently to certain situations and events.

            replytoj001

              #7.2 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 8:45 PM EDT
              replytoj001

              Soldiering? What do you mean by that? Kill a few Sunnies or a few Shiats?

              This comment on our military is uncalled for, it went to far.

              Soldiers deserve better than this .

              replytoj001

              • 2 votes
              #7.3 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 8:49 PM EDT
              juli54

              Yes, they do deserve better than this, but they're not going to get it on this thread.

                #7.4 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 9:24 PM EDT
                Reply
                jnick

                The guy takes his job serious, he takes care of the men under him. He is doing what he believes in. He should not be persecuted for any religion or non-religion he chooses to follow. If he is indeed being held back from promotion because of his belief, an investigation should be held and those in wrong should be held accountable. He volunteered to bear arms and defend our country. Any who have served in the military has respect for one who risks his or her life to defend our way of life. He has proven his worth in battle and should not have to prove his right to believe as he wants. Politics of right or wrong, why we are there, have no injection in this. He is a proven warrior and deserves our respect and admiration.

                • 5 votes
                Reply#8 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 9:05 AM EDT
                Skylights

                It's too bad that in the last few years intolerance seems to be gaining a foothold due in part to the views of the present administration no doubt. A democratic, progressive, forward moving society can't exist with the attitude that everyone must think alike or be ostracized. In my view, any supposedly religious person who condemns or harasses another because of religious beliefs is themselves a hypocrite with questionable morals.

                • 3 votes
                Reply#9 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 9:28 AM EDT
                Igor The Troll

                I am just glad it is not 2000 BC or 700 AD and this guy is not having Sex with goats, otherwise he would get a firing squad!

                • 2 votes
                Reply#10 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 10:27 AM EDT
                Neron Kesar

                Clipped to Atheism 101:

                http://atheism101.newsvine.com/

                • 3 votes
                Reply#11 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 10:51 AM EDT
                iarnuocon

                It should also be noted that this

                Weinstein is the foundation's president and a U.S. Air Force Academy graduate. He had previously sued the Air Force for acts he said illegally imposed Christianity on students at the academy, though that case was dismissed.

                is a bit misleading and needs some clarification. Weinstein's case was dismissed by the court because they said he did not have standing to sue, since he was not an active member of the service. Weinstein has reframed his case in a way that can go forward in the courts, and Jeremy Hall is a part of that lawsuit.

                The Air Force Academy currently does discriminate against non-Christians and is actively proselytizing, and does deserve to be sued. The situation has been written about extensively, is confirmed by multiple sources who were in a position to know and who aren't particularly "atheist."

                The AP's statement about the Weinstein case makes it seem as though the allegation were groundless, and it clearly isn't.

                • 8 votes
                Reply#12 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 12:19 PM EDT
                vas

                The irony in all this is the way many Americans look down their noses at Islam when we read of cases where Muslim leaders suppress dissenting beliefs.

                • 6 votes
                Reply#13 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 12:51 PM EDT
                juli54

                I also find irony in the way you all look down your noses at how the military, who defends your right to do so, operates.

                • 1 vote
                Reply#14 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 7:32 PM EDT
                Adam Kemp

                It's not so black-and-white, juli. I love my country, but that doesn't mean I won't criticize it when it does something wrong. In the same way, we respect the military, but we're still going to criticize it when they're discriminating against people.

                I don't think you would be making this argument if he was a Christian discriminated against for his beliefs. It's really just anti-atheist sentiment that makes you completely unsympathetic.

                • 6 votes
                #14.1 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 8:24 PM EDT
                juli54

                No Adam, you are just assuming that about me.

                A soldier, especially on deployment, especially in a war zone, must be a soldier first.

                When you are a soldier, it's not all about you.

                That is my problem with this.

                  #14.2 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 9:23 PM EDT
                  Adam Kemp

                  What the hell are you talking about? This man was discriminated against. If anyone is disrespecting a soldier it's you! How dare you tell this man he's not a good enough soldier. He has done nothing wrong so far as we can tell. Apparently him being an atheist is enough for his fellow officers to harass him. You think he should just keep quiet??

                  Be honest. If you heard that a soldier was being harassed for being a Christian you would throw a fit. Am I assuming that? Yes. Is it true? I'd bet good money on it. And you know what? I'd throw a fit too because it would be just as wrong as this. So why is it that when an atheist is the target of discrimination, instead of complaining about the real problem (discrimination) you're insulting the victim by implying that he's just not a good soldier? That is just incredibly screwed up.

                  • 9 votes
                  #14.3 - Sat Apr 26, 2008 10:38 PM EDT
                  Youssef51

                  Adam:

                  The simple fact is this incident could never have happened if the man wasn't an atheist.

                  He could have been a practitioner of Voodoo and been organizing his fellow believers into a seance, sacrificing chickens and sticking pins in Moslem dolls, and everything would have been just fine.

                  Some comments made by G. H. Bush come to mind on the subject of atheism.

                  • 6 votes
                  #14.4 - Sun Apr 27, 2008 3:59 AM EDT
                  PudgeDiesel

                  A soldier on deployment, especially in a war zone shouild have the right to practise his beliefs and explore them with others who feel the same. I ddon't know about you, but being in a war zone made me want to explore my beliefs a lot more than when I was stateside. If I'm fighting for my rights and freedoms I am damn sure gonna say something when they take them away!

                  • 5 votes
                  #14.5 - Sun Apr 27, 2008 5:19 AM EDT
                  Youssef51

                  PudgeDiesel:

                  Excellent.

                  Some of the posters here could learn a lot by thinking about what you have written.

                  • 5 votes
                  #14.6 - Sun Apr 27, 2008 7:17 AM EDT
                  Reply
                  juli54

                  Unbelievable.

                  Newsvine seems to reflect society.

                  Funny. 'Dissenting opinions' are all the rage.

                  Ummmm, that is, unless one's opinion is conservative.

                  Then personal attacks are acceptable, even condoned by Newsvine.

                  'Code of honor'. Yeah. Right.

                  • 1 vote
                  Reply#15 - Sun Apr 27, 2008 7:54 AM EDT
                  Adam Kemp

                  As another asked in the other thread, "where"? I was probably the most aggressive in my response to you, but I never once called you a name or insulted you. Your argument doesn't make sense and is disrespectful of this soldier. I pointed that out.

                  • 4 votes
                  #15.1 - Sun Apr 27, 2008 12:26 PM EDT
                  juli54

                  Ummm, no, Adam, you weren't the MOST aggressive. Interesting how not one reader complained about the 'code of honor' being violated. Sure.

                  "Congratulations, you win the prize for ass-hat of the day." See comment #5.3 and continue down the thread.

                  I was asked, "How dare you...".

                  How DARE I? WTF?

                  Bye now. Not interested. Thanks anyway.

                    #15.2 - Sun Apr 27, 2008 1:03 PM EDT
                    Adam Kemp

                    Seriously, though. How can you accuse us all of disrespecting soldiers when you are the only person here disrespecting a soldier? I really want to know how you ca justify your position here.

                    • 6 votes
                    #15.3 - Sun Apr 27, 2008 9:56 PM EDT
                    Reply
                    juli54

                    Seriously, though, this site is ridiculous. You guys all enjoy patting each other and yourselves on the back at how 'enlightened' you all are, and make sure to shout any dissenting voice down. And you accuse conservatives of violating the First Amendment. By your actions, you all do a mighty fine job of that yourselves. Sheesh.

                      Reply#16 - Mon Apr 28, 2008 8:16 PM EDT
                      vas

                      So the First Amendment gives you the right to say something free from criticism? You don't seem to have any qualms about criticizing this soldier.

                      You guys all enjoy patting each other and yourselves on the back at how 'enlightened' you all are

                      Where? So far you've pretty much avoided answering every direct question to you, and instead respond with whining.

                      • 5 votes
                      #16.1 - Mon Apr 28, 2008 8:48 PM EDT
                      TheJonesGirl

                      Juli, if you hate it here, you can type a new address into your address bar. The internets are big.

                      • 4 votes
                      #16.2 - Mon Apr 28, 2008 9:04 PM EDT
                      Adam Kemp

                      You apparently feel offended when people challenge your position. Maybe you're used to being able to make any ridiculous argument you want without anyone questioning it, but that doesn't work here. If you make an argument then you have to back it up. So far you've been completely unwilling to back up anything you've said.

                      • 5 votes
                      #16.3 - Mon Apr 28, 2008 10:08 PM EDT
                      Reply
                      Mike Sifeldeen

                      A soldier, especially on deployment, especially in a war zone, must be a soldier first.

                      When you are a soldier, it's not all about you.

                      That is my problem with this.

                      So, clearly then, you also have a problem with all the Christians making a big fuss about Thanksgiving prayers, too, right?

                      Otherwise, one might call you a hypocrite.

                      • 4 votes
                      Reply#17 - Tue Apr 29, 2008 3:15 AM EDT
                      miasma

                      Its' the WAR ON THANKSGIVING! Someone alert O'Reilly. Gobble, gobble. On second thought, don't.

                      • 3 votes
                      #17.1 - Tue Apr 29, 2008 7:20 AM EDT
                      Mike Sifeldeen

                      It's the greatest threat facing America, too.

                      Except for all the other greatest threats.

                      And spandex.

                      • 4 votes
                      #17.2 - Wed Apr 30, 2008 12:08 AM EDT
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                      Bounty HunterDeleted
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