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{"contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"ap-230"}

Analysis: McCain puts Obama on the defensive

Wed Oct 15, 2008 11:01 PM EDT
politics, barack-obama, john-mccain, debate, analysis
Liz Sidoti, AP National Political Writer
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< PreviousNext >
showing 1 of 3 photos
<p>Democratic presidential candidate Sen. Barack Obama, D-Ill., and Republican presidential candidate Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., participate in a presidential debate at Hofstra University in Hempstead, N.Y., Wednesday, Oct. 15, 2008. (AP Photo/Ron Edmonds)</p>

Democratic presidential candidate Sen. Barack Obama, D-Ill., and Republican presidential candidate Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., participate in a presidential debate at Hofstra University in Hempstead, N.Y., Wednesday, Oct. 15, 2008. (AP Photo/Ron Edmonds)

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— This time, John McCain kept Barack Obama on the defensive.

The feisty Republican tried hard to find a lifeline Wednesday night, challenging his Democratic rival at every turn over his truthfulness, associations and record.

By that measure, McCain won the last debate of the 2008 campaign.

But that may not be enough.

McCain still desperately needs to change the trajectory of a race that's tilting significantly toward Obama. Democratic voters outnumber Republicans, the economic crisis has transformed the race in Obama's favor, President Bush is extremely unpopular, most voters think the country is on the wrong track and the Democrat is leading in key-state polling.

There's little McCain can do on his own to change the dynamic. Not that he didn't try. "I am not President Bush," he said.

"You didn't keep your word," McCain reminded Obama on the issue of accepting public financing, something Obama had said he would do if the GOP nominee followed suit.

McCain, seemingly more prepared and definitely more aggressive than in past debates, called Obama's tax plan "class warfare," accused him of failing to stand up to his party's leaders and said the Democrat twisted his record in ads.

With his repeated attacks, the Republican ran the risk of turning off voters. Their negative impressions of him have risen as he questioned Obama's character over the past week. A New York Times/CBS News poll this week found that more voters see McCain as having waged a negative campaign than Obama.

Yet, McCain had little choice but to turn up the heat — and endure the consequences.

With the election in less than three weeks, the debate season is over and there are no more high-profile opportunities that can guarantee McCain an audience of tens of millions of people. Flush with cash, Obama has bought 30-minute blocks of prime-time advertising six days before the election; McCain may not be able to afford the same.

Over the next 20 days, both candidates will go after the voters who say they could still change their minds.

There are a lot of them — about one-third of all voters — but McCain has to win many more than Obama. Not only is he behind in the polls, but the base of all-but-certain Republican voters is smaller than Obama's Democratic foundation.

The Arizona senator's challenge is great.

In the race for 270 Electoral College votes, Obama has comfortable leads in polls in Democratic-held states and is competitive if not ahead in surveys in Republican bastions. A look at the intensity of candidate visits and television advertising shows the contest is basically playing out in states that Bush won four years ago, with Obama slated to visit Missouri, North Carolina and Virginia this weekend. Only two states that Democrat John Kerry won in 2004, Pennsylvania and New Hampshire, are getting serious attention.

The candidates went into the debate season 20 days ago, virtually tied in polls in the race for the White House.

Since then, Wall Street collapsed, the markets plummeted and the government intervened, putting the economy — and Bush's policies — at the forefront of voters' minds.

Again and again, McCain looked directly at Obama and let him have it.

_"You have to tell me one time when you have stood up with the leaders of your party on one single major issue."

_"You're running ads right now that say that I oppose federal funding for stem cell research. I don't. You're running ads that misportray completely my position on immigration."

_"You don't tell countries you're going to unilaterally renegotiate agreements with them."

Obama had a ready answer for McCain and brushed aside the negatives.

"I think the American people are less interested in our hurt feelings during the course of the campaign than addressing the issues that matter to them so deeply," the Democrat said.

McCain's eagerness could be seen in his demeanor as he waited to pounce after each Obama statement. Eyes wide, he breathed deeply, moved his eyebrows up and shot sharp glances in Obama's direction. Obama's usually earnest demeanor, meanwhile, was regularly broken by big smiles as McCain attacked.

Over the course of the debates, a confident and collected Obama held his own in what amounted to an audition for the chief executive position.

He displayed a knack for quick response again Wednesday when McCain raised issue with Obama's links to William Ayers, a radical during the Vietnam War era. "The fact that this has become such an important part of your campaign, Sen. McCain, says more about your campaign than it says about me," Obama said.

The debate said a lot about both candidates. McCain did better Wednesday than ever before but, even as he took punches, Obama succeeded in appearing presidential.

____

EDITOR'S NOTE — Liz Sidoti covers the presidential campaign for The Associated Press and has covered national politics since 2003.

© 2008 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.
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{"contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"ap-230"}
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  • Public Discussion (132)
{"commentId":3511439,"authorDomain":"JohnRussell"}
JohnRussell

John McCain's best debate. Barck Obama was searching for the right words to answer Mccain's points more tonight than in both the other debates combined.

I see where The crew at Fox News was disappointed that Mccain couldn't come up with something more dramatic, but he was clear, concise, and on the offense all night. Mccain is not a great debater, it is not his thing, and he did the best he could have tonight .

Obama was taken aback a few times so I would say this was his weakest debate. People say all Obama had to do was keep from falling over and he would 'win' so one could argue that happened also.

{"commentId":3511439,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"JohnRussell"}
  • 3 votes
Reply#1 - Wed Oct 15, 2008 11:29 PM EDT
{"commentId":3512874,"authorDomain":"proscribe"}
Edward Arnold

It was said Obama didn't have to do much during the debate to stay on top and he didn't let anyone down...he did very little except attempt to search for the right comeback. McCain told him "I'm not George Bush, maybe you should have run four years ago against him". Now THAT took the wind out of Obama's sails, you could see it on his face and put an end to Obama's tired rhetoric of "Four more years of George Bush"...that's GONE.  And for the rest of the evening Obama sort of stumbled and mumbled his way through it. I give him this...he IS a good talker, smooth as silk, had a few good jabs, but he is still nothing more than a smooth talking, but very empty suit. He NEVER gives us anything but fancy words.

{"commentId":3512874,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"proscribe"}
  • 3 votes
#1.1 - Wed Oct 15, 2008 11:48 PM EDT
{"commentId":3513652,"authorDomain":"brianford"}
Brian Ford

By that measure, McCain won the last debate of the 2008 campaign

The AP's instant analysis has been wrong every time, thus far and voters have proved them wrong again.

Two instant polls (one of undecided voters) show Obama winning ~ 60% to McCain's 30%.
It's not looking good for McCain/Palin.

"Four more years of George Bush"...that's GONE.

Except for the multiple times Obama made that same connection in the remainder of the debate? Like it or not, it's resonating with voters, and you're foolish if you think it's an issue that Obama should or will (or has to) drop.

{"commentId":3513652,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"brianford"}
  • 9 votes
#1.2 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:02 AM EDT
{"commentId":3514139,"authorDomain":"JohnRussell"}
JohnRussell

The comment about "if you wanted to run against Bush, you should have run 4 years ago" was a great line , certainly compared to the humor you usually get in these things, and you could hear a few people in the audience laugh and clap ( a big no-no, since they promise not to repond to anything during the debates). McCain would have been far better off if he gave this line in the first debate instead of the last.

{"commentId":3514139,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"JohnRussell"}
  • 3 votes
#1.3 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:13 AM EDT
{"commentId":3514843,"authorDomain":"rdonaldsnyder"}
R. Donald Snyder

ROTFLMAO! The idea that Barack was "on the defensive" is a right wing wet dream. Barack was calm, cool and collected while McCain twisted in his seat like his hemroids were on fire. He came across as angry and petty, while Barack came across as presidential. This one wasn't even close. Barack handed McCain his ass to him on a silver platter. Every poll so far says the same, even FOX Noise. McCain lost, deal with it.

{"commentId":3514843,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"rdonaldsnyder"}
  • 7 votes
#1.4 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:29 AM EDT
{"commentId":3515120,"authorDomain":"stevencwatts"}
Steve Watts

The comment about "if you wanted to run against Bush, you should have run 4 years ago" was a great line

A good sound byte, sure, but it doesn't really address the soul of Obama's criticism that McCain's record and proposed policies are similar to George W Bush's. Until he can equivically confront that, the criticism is valid, cheeky comment or no.

{"commentId":3515120,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"stevencwatts"}
  • 4 votes
#1.5 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:36 AM EDT
{"commentId":3515193,"authorDomain":"rdonaldsnyder"}
R. Donald Snyder

The comment about "if you wanted to run against Bush, you should have run 4 years ago" was a great line ,

It was a good pre-rehearsed line, but Barack's come back that it's difficult to tell the difference between Bush and McCain was better and more true.

{"commentId":3515193,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"rdonaldsnyder"}
  • 8 votes
#1.6 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:38 AM EDT
{"commentId":3515258,"authorDomain":"biggerthebetter"}
biggerthebetter

No, McCain is NOT Bush.  Bush at least had a check on his temper during debates.  For the rest of it, they are the same.

{"commentId":3515258,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"biggerthebetter"}
  • 5 votes
#1.7 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:40 AM EDT
{"commentId":3515564,"authorDomain":"JohnRussell"}
JohnRussell

ROTFLMAO! The idea that Barack was "on the defensive" is a right wing wet dream. Barack was calm, cool and collected while McCain twisted in his seat like his hemroids were on fire. He came across as angry and petty, while Barack came across as presidential. This one wasn't even close. Barack handed McCain his ass to him on a silver platter. Every poll so far says the same, even FOX Noise. McCain lost, deal with it.

I know one thing, there isn't a drop of fairness or objective analysis in your body. You may be the most bullheadedly partisan person on this site. To each his own.

{"commentId":3515564,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"JohnRussell"}
  • 1 vote
#1.8 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:48 AM EDT
{"commentId":3515689,"authorDomain":"rdonaldsnyder"}
R. Donald Snyder

No John, I just have my eyes wide open, not wide shut. Barack Obama came off as presidential. McCain came off as an angry old man. I trust that America will make the right choice and put the next John Fitzgerald Kennedy in the White House and I trust that any assassins hired by the GOP will be worse shots then Lee Harvey Oswald was.

{"commentId":3515689,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"rdonaldsnyder"}
  • 5 votes
#1.9 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:52 AM EDT
{"commentId":3515930,"authorDomain":"JohnRussell"}
JohnRussell

I apologize, I mischaracterized you. You're not just bullheadedly partisan, you're nuts.

{"commentId":3515930,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"JohnRussell"}
  • 3 votes
#1.10 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:59 AM EDT
{"commentId":3516377,"authorDomain":"rdonaldsnyder"}
R. Donald Snyder

Nuts? No John, I'm a paying attention American.

{"commentId":3516377,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"rdonaldsnyder"}
  • 6 votes
#1.11 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 1:17 AM EDT
{"commentId":3516446,"authorDomain":"JohnRussell"}
JohnRussell

You're either nuts or your'e drunk. One or the other.

{"commentId":3516446,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"JohnRussell"}
  • 3 votes
#1.12 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 1:21 AM EDT
{"commentId":3516523,"authorDomain":"rdonaldsnyder"}
R. Donald Snyder

LOL! Nice well thought out GOP comeback. Makes no sense and it's an attack. Not the kind of thought I'd like to base a vote upon though. When you don't have a leg to stand on, punt.

{"commentId":3516523,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"rdonaldsnyder"}
  • 6 votes
#1.13 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 1:25 AM EDT
{"commentId":3517632,"authorDomain":"spiffie"}
spiffie
By that measure, McCain won the last debate of the 2008 campaign

The AP's instant analysis has been wrong every time, thus far and voters have proved them wrong again.

Brian, it's amazing how much the east coast media elites are in the tank for McCain, huh? Clearly the American people have other ideas than to listen to overpaid, professional talking heads.

(Heh, heh, that felt kind of good.)

{"commentId":3517632,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"spiffie"}
  • 5 votes
#1.14 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 2:33 AM EDT
{"commentId":3518468,"authorDomain":"chasing"}
Chasing

You know how McCain was on the offensive and aggressive?

Didn't he pay attention to the polling that says that's when voters like him least?

{"commentId":3518468,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"chasing"}
  • 4 votes
#1.15 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 4:28 AM EDT
{"commentId":3519445,"authorDomain":"lasong"}
Pittsburgh2

Hi John.

You may know that I am supporting Senator Obama.  But I would agree that this was Senator McCain's strongest debate and had more pressure on him to perform well.  suit.  I would say that what consistently gives Obama the advantage (debate-wise) is when even on the defense, he manages to stay focused and calm. 

{"commentId":3519445,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"lasong"}
    #1.16 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 7:07 AM EDT
    {"commentId":3519518,"authorDomain":"sunnyside"}
    SUNNY SIDE

    I must be insensitive somehow, but during all three debates, I couldn't see where one won out over the other.  Their style of conversation is so different and I thought each surprised the other in turn ("Don't compare me to Bush" or "Guess what you're going to pay in taxes Joe: zero, zero")  In the end, they're both rather unshakeable and can hold their own.  On top of that, their both good men in their own way. 

    Every time I get info/analysis of their economic plans, the wonks say neither one is offering a better solution than the other.  At any rate, tonight it struck me:  McCain's comment that he's going to balance the budget by the end of his first term.  It's so categorically fantastical at this point that I was surprised he was still holding on to this notion at the debate.  Given the 700+ drop in the DJ, that comment reeeally hit me in the gut.  Maybe I just imagined he said that, but I don't think so.

    So, what's left?  How they run their campaigns.  Who's managed their campaign the best.  Who's the one demonstrating that he can use his resources (people and money) to effect the best outcome for his political machine.  Nothing's over yet, but my vote will most likely go to the guy that visualized the big political picture and moved across the landscape effectively, being firm where necessary and in turn adding flexibility as needed.  That's the guy with the good judgement and the vision.  After all, they can both say they want to create jobs until the cows come home, but only one of them is going to be better at it.

    Of course, the economy isn't the only issue, but it's definitely on the top of the list.  I'm getting spanked in the market, too, but I'm nowhere near losing home or quality of life, plus my family has the 10-20 year recovery window.  I just want the country to get the best guy in the White House so we can minimize the casualties -  the people whose lives are spiraling out of control.

    {"commentId":3519518,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"sunnyside"}
      #1.17 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 7:15 AM EDT
      {"commentId":3519799,"authorDomain":"JohnRussell"}
      JohnRussell

      Snyder-

      You are persistently a clown on these forums, as seen in this handiwork of yours -

       and I trust that any assassins hired by the GOP will be worse shots then Lee Harvey Oswald was.

      I don't know what kind of mind altering substances you ingest, but I would lower the dosage if I were you.

      {"commentId":3519799,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"JohnRussell"}
      • 1 vote
      #1.18 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 7:36 AM EDT
      {"commentId":3525148,"authorDomain":"werblssed"}
      Beverly H

      I think John McCain did really well, I would have liked to see him come off even more aggresive then he was, Obama drives me crazy listening to his long drawn out answers he sounds like a boring professor, goes on and on about everything.

      After the debate brit hume said some reporters got a hold of Joe the Plumber and he still feels Obama's tax plan will not be very good for him, so Obama won't be getting his vote.

      {"commentId":3525148,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"werblssed"}
      • 3 votes
      #1.19 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 10:43 AM EDT
      {"commentId":3525305,"authorDomain":"werblssed"}
      Beverly H

      Heres the thing WE still don't know who Obama is...

      {"commentId":3525305,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"werblssed"}
      • 3 votes
      #1.20 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 10:47 AM EDT
      {"commentId":3528527,"authorDomain":"lasong"}
      Pittsburgh2

      I think "we" do.  Be honest. You really don't want to know.

      If you're referring to we as the American voters.  They're speaking.  Boy are they speaking--loud and clear. 

      {"commentId":3528527,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"lasong"}
      • 3 votes
      #1.21 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:14 PM EDT
      {"commentId":3529738,"authorDomain":"werblssed"}
      Beverly H

      I don't think we do, Obama Lied about not launching his political career in Ayers living room , last night on the debate there are pictures circulating around showing he did...Ayers himself would tell you he gave Obama's political coming out party...Obama is a liar, and you know it, but you give him a pass, he sweeps everything under the rug and gets away with it. 

      {"commentId":3529738,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"werblssed"}
      • 2 votes
      #1.22 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:50 PM EDT
      {"commentId":3530977,"authorDomain":"lasong"}
      Pittsburgh2

      That's your opinion and your persepctive.  It's a tough sell when the majority of Americans are voting for him, but if it makes you feel better, okay.

      (Obama is a liar?.... ) First,  I know no such thing.  (b) "there are ""pictures circulating" Ah, yes, proof positive.  The world of "photo-shop,air-brushes and illusions.

      It's time to move on.to real issues.

      {"commentId":3530977,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"lasong"}
        #1.23 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 1:24 PM EDT
        {"commentId":3533264,"authorDomain":"BlueLeftHand"}
        Kim-298921

        Obama drives me crazy listening to his long drawn out answers he sounds like a boring professor

        Did you even get through high school?

        {"commentId":3533264,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"BlueLeftHand"}
        • 2 votes
        #1.24 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 2:26 PM EDT
        {"commentId":3534038,"authorDomain":"PartysOver"}
        PartysOverDeleted
        {"commentId":3536935,"authorDomain":"BlueLeftHand"}
        Kim-298921

        The polls (multiple) are putting Obama at 47% and McCain at 43% and with a 4.5% error rate that still puts them at a dead heat

        Can you point to any one of these polls?  A link? Because I couldn't find a single poll at RCP that has those numbers, at all.

        Here's what I found:

        PollDateSampleObama (D)McCain (R)Spread

        RCP Average
        10/09 - 10/15
        --
        49.5
        42.7
        Obama +6.8

        Rasmussen Tracking
        10/13 - 10/15
        3000 LV
        50
        46
        Obama +4

        Reuters/C-Span/Zogby Tracking
        10/13 - 10/15
        1208 LV
        49
        44
        Obama +5

        Hotline/FD Tracking
        10/13 - 10/15
        817 LV
        49
        41
        Obama +8

        Gallup Tracking (Traditional)*
        10/13 - 10/15
        2143 LV
        49
        47
        Obama +2

        Gallup Tracking (Expanded)*
        10/13 - 10/15
        2312 LV
        51
        45
        Obama +6

        GW/Battleground Tracking
        10/09 - 10/15
        800 LV
        50
        44
        Obama +6

        IBD/TIPP Tracking
        10/09 - 10/14
        825 LV
        45
        42
        Obama +3

        LA Times/Bloomberg
        10/10 - 10/13
        1030 LV
        50
        41
        Obama +9

        CBS News/NY Times
        10/10 - 10/13
        699 LV
        53
        39
        Obama +14

        USA Today/Gallup (Traditional)*
        10/10 - 10/12
        761 LV
        50
        46
        Obama +4

        USA Today/Gallup (Expanded)*
        10/10 - 10/12
        1030 LV
        52
        45
        Obama +7

        Pew Research
        10/09 - 10/12
        1191 LV
        49
        42
        Obama +7

        Ipsos/McClatchy
        10/09 - 10/13
        1036 RV
        48
        39

        Obama +9

        {"commentId":3536935,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"BlueLeftHand"}
        • 3 votes
        #1.26 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 4:39 PM EDT
        {"commentId":3537758,"authorDomain":"sunnyside"}
        SUNNY SIDE

        Kim - it's very clear that Obama has made some in roads and maintained them.  I imagine he and Joe Biden have connected with middle class America at this point.  I think those numbers show people get that it's the economy AND the war (that's draining the economy/$10Bil per month).

        {"commentId":3537758,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"sunnyside"}
        • 1 vote
        #1.27 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 5:12 PM EDT
        {"commentId":3538105,"authorDomain":"PartysOver"}
        PartysOverDeleted
        {"commentId":3539898,"authorDomain":"spiffie"}
        spiffie

        In the last election, 7 of 9 final polls had President Bush ahead of John Kerry, with a margin for Bush between 2 and 5 percent. The two polls that had Kerry ahead had him up 1 or 2 points. The polls taken together were clearly forecasting a Bush win. (You can get details at pollingreport.com.)

        {"commentId":3539898,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"spiffie"}
        • 4 votes
        #1.29 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 6:40 PM EDT
        {"commentId":3540072,"authorDomain":"BlueLeftHand"}
        Kim-298921

        Obominous:

        Where did you get the margin of error rate? Just make that up and decide to apply it to all polls?

        They vary from poll to poll. I just picked one of the above at random, clicked on USA Today/Gallup (extended) and then clicked the link for "The Election" on the left hand side.

        The margin of error is 3 points.  Obama is ahead by 7 points. That's more than twice the margin of error.

        Nice try.

        {"commentId":3540072,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"BlueLeftHand"}
        • 3 votes
        #1.30 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 6:47 PM EDT
        {"commentId":3540105,"authorDomain":"chasing"}
        Chasing

        ok now factor in the error rates and none of those leads are big enuf to exclude an upset on November 4th.

        Even if you factor in the margin of error, Obama comes out on top, generally, with the margin having to swing completely toward McCain in all swing/close states for him to pull off that upset.  And that's about as likely as putting lipstick on a pitbull and not looking like a fool doing it.

        {"commentId":3540105,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"chasing"}
        • 4 votes
        #1.31 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 6:48 PM EDT
        {"commentId":3543926,"authorDomain":"PartysOver"}
        PartysOverDeleted
        {"commentId":3545662,"authorDomain":"chasing"}
        Chasing

        Ok then The Karnacs have spoken... Are you feelin like sharing the wealth yet because I could use a vacation to Maui.

        Did you not hear?  I already pay taxes.  I'm already sharing the wealth.  But that's not what Obama was talking about, and you know it, despite McCain's shrill protestations to the contrary.  Soundbites are better, it seems, when there's no facts behind them.  Policy, however, is another matter.  We've already had 8 years of a President who presides via the former; now perhaps we should try the other approach? 

        {"commentId":3545662,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"chasing"}
        • 4 votes
        #1.33 - Fri Oct 17, 2008 2:04 AM EDT
        Reply
        {"commentId":3512997,"authorDomain":"davidjewell"}
        David Jewell

        I thought McCain looked flustered and sarcastic the whole night. His demeanor when answering questions is either self-agrandizing or sarcastic.  Everytime he says the words, "My friends," you can insert 'you morons' without changing the tone or apparent meaning of his answer.

        Stick a fork in him...

        The argument that I have with Obama is that he's too polite with McCain but then he's far enough ahead that he doesn't need to risk bruising his knuckle on McCain's bottom lip.   I would like to see him get tough at the debate table once though because he'll need to as he talks to unfriendly world leaders. At the very least, they need to know that he CAN play rough.  McCain would have made a good test dummy for that demonstration.

        {"commentId":3512997,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"davidjewell"}
        • 6 votes
        Reply#2 - Wed Oct 15, 2008 11:50 PM EDT
        {"commentId":3513246,"authorDomain":"bfrdi"}
        brianbaDeleted
        {"commentId":3513937,"authorDomain":"proscribe"}
        Edward Arnold

        Think about what group or groups would benefit having a communist leaning president in the White House. Also think nut cases like George Soros. Not to mention a bunch of PLO supporters.

        {"commentId":3513937,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"proscribe"}
        • 3 votes
        #2.2 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:08 AM EDT
        {"commentId":3514899,"authorDomain":"rdonaldsnyder"}
        R. Donald Snyder

        Except of course Barack is not a communist. Kinda deflates your whole argument.

        {"commentId":3514899,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"rdonaldsnyder"}
        • 7 votes
        #2.3 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:30 AM EDT
        {"commentId":3515228,"authorDomain":"stevencwatts"}
        Steve Watts

        Agreed that McCain looked flustered, often frustrated, and at one point, absolutely dumbstruck:

        Obama: I'll tell you what the fine will be on Joe the Plumber: zero.

        McCain: Excuse me?! [sits with his mouth hanging open for 15 seconds]

        Obama may have been the one on the defensive tonight, but that's only because McCain was attacking, which polls have already shown to be hurting him. And, when on the defense, he answered with poise and calm, which showed pretty stark contrast to McCain's grasping. McCain kept lobbing black-or-white oversimplifications, and Obama kept answering with concise explanations on the nuance of politics. For a good example, see his explanation that his vote against the "infant urgent care" bill was because that law was already on the books, and the wording of this one was engineered to lay groundwork for attacking Roe vs Wade. 

        If anything this made him look more presidential, not less.

        {"commentId":3515228,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"stevencwatts"}
        • 7 votes
        #2.4 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:39 AM EDT
        {"commentId":3515353,"authorDomain":"biggerthebetter"}
        biggerthebetter

        Republicans themselves were saying in 2000 that McCain was a RINO.  They have called him a democrat in sheep's clothing for years now.  If you are going to vote and get a liberal, why not vote for the one who at least admits he is one, and hasn't flip flopped on EVERY MAJOR ISSUE that has ever come up?

        Obama/Biden 08.

        {"commentId":3515353,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"biggerthebetter"}
        • 4 votes
        #2.5 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:42 AM EDT
        {"commentId":3515479,"authorDomain":"proscribe"}
        Edward Arnold

        Please repeat Obama's words after me (at least ten times): "I think if you spread the wealth around, it's good for everyone". Okay! Socialism, not communism... Socialism, commonly confused with communism, is the belief that the state has a responsibility to reduce wealth disparity between people and prevent any citizen from suffering neglect. Socialism is extremely inefficient and unfair but, unlike communism, it can continue operating indefinitely. Now this is Obama's dream, to be the best socialist president we have ever had.

        {"commentId":3515479,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"proscribe"}
        • 2 votes
        #2.6 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:46 AM EDT
        {"commentId":3515907,"authorDomain":"rdonaldsnyder"}
        R. Donald Snyder

        "I think if you spread the wealth around, it's good for everyone"

        "I think if you spread the wealth around, it's good for everyone"

        "I think if you spread the wealth around, it's good for everyone"

        "I think if you spread the wealth around, it's good for everyone"

        "I think if you spread the wealth around, it's good for everyone"

        "I think if you spread the wealth around, it's good for everyone"

        "I think if you spread the wealth around, it's good for everyone"

        "I think if you spread the wealth around, it's good for everyone"

        "I think if you spread the wealth around, it's good for everyone"

        "I think if you spread the wealth around, it's good for everyone"

        "I think if you spread the wealth around, it's good for everyone"

        Sounds better everytime I hear it. I too think that of you spread some of the wealth around that it's good for everybody.

        {"commentId":3515907,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"rdonaldsnyder"}
        • 5 votes
        #2.7 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:59 AM EDT
        {"commentId":3518282,"authorDomain":"drscott2k8"}
        HyperActive

        I apologize in advance if this post sounds a littleself serving.  I assure you it is not.  It is merely to make a point.

        Just a note on "redistribution".  I own my own busines.  In the last 6 years I have gone from 5 ft and 3 pt to 23 ft and 6 pt emps.  My emps make a HEALTHY salary plus benefits.  Benefits include I pay 95% of their medical, vision, and dental, match $2 for $1 on their retirement, and have very generous leave benefits.  My employees make almost as much as I do, but they ARE the ones making the money for me.

        Every one of them is buying their own homes (none are behind, or using sub-prime or ARM loans).  Most of them have paid for their vehicles.  One of my emps had an issue a couple of years ago and I "loaned" him several thousand dollars.  I really didn't care if I got it back or not (and he knew this when I gave him the money).  He is a very loyal employee.  He paid it back in short order.  Heck, my emps take home almost as much as I do.

        This is what redistribution should be.  It is UP TO ME how I redistribute MY money.  Not some some jerk arse that has had everything handed to him on a silver spoon.  A few weeks ago I had my CPA (who is STAUNCH democrat byt the way) analyze my books under McCain's and Obama's suggested plans.  Under Obama I would more than likely have to reduce my benefits package by a MINIMUM of 50%, release 8-11 FT emps and and 3 PT emps to remain viable.  Under McCain's plan I would be able to continue business as usual and even a maintain my current projected growth trends.

        This, my friends, is redistribution.

        {"commentId":3518282,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"drscott2k8"}
        • 4 votes
        #2.8 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 3:51 AM EDT
        {"commentId":3518473,"authorDomain":"chasing"}
        Chasing

        I would like Obama to tell me where all the money for his new programs is coming from

        AGAIN????

        {"commentId":3518473,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"chasing"}
        • 4 votes
        #2.9 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 4:29 AM EDT
        {"commentId":3518481,"authorDomain":"chasing"}
        Chasing

        "I think if you spread the wealth around, it's good for everyone".

        These are commonly called "taxes".  They pay for all sorts of things.  Like roads.  Armies.  911.  Police. 

        Y'know.  Just the basics.

        Now, I don't know about you, but I'm fond of roads.  Not that I want to blanket the planet in them - but, yeah, the ones that get me where I'm going?  They're pretty neat.

        {"commentId":3518481,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"chasing"}
        • 5 votes
        #2.10 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 4:32 AM EDT
        {"commentId":3518851,"authorDomain":"StellaCa"}
        StellaCa

        HyperActive...

        I applaud you for leading with integrity, as well as demonstrating fairness and generosity to your employees. I hate to say it, but some business owners are more motivated by fear than fairness when it comes to providing a decent living wage. Given your info is on the up and up (and I trust it is), how good it is to find someone who displays these attributes, particularly in tough economic times. I appreciate knowing you've done your homework - spent the time and money to determine for yourself whose plan is actually feasible. No doubt, others will benefit from your findings...at least know what to expect should Mr. Obama win the General Election.

        It perplexes me to know how easily people accept Mr. Obama's economic policies at the expense of American business owners. I take my share of ridicule for even questioning his socialistic proposals, yet it isn't that I want to be "right." Rather, I wish to see what ought to be rightly done by millions upon millions of hard-working business owners and their employees. It's when the people are strong that government is strong.

        If the polls are prognosticating accurately and Mr. Obama does win, I have a feeling it will be by a much closer margin than expected. But my concern is that those Obama supporters who truly believe he *is* their great hope personified, will only come to a disillusioning and heart-rending truth that this election was much more about Barack Obama's self-realization than it ever was about the American people. And unfortunately, an Obama win may wage costs that are not only dear to us, but to our children on all fronts in a way that will take many more terms to repair. Redistribution, indeed.

        {"commentId":3518851,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"StellaCa"}
        • 4 votes
        #2.11 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 5:48 AM EDT
        {"commentId":3522885,"authorDomain":"lasong"}
        Pittsburgh2

        ........I respectfully disagree.
        It's a popular argument that if keep the businesses and corporations profitable it helps the workers and the econony.  The only problem with that is that the
        "trickle down" economics has not worked.  It's not "trickling down" ---and it certainly has not reached the American worker or their families.

        {"commentId":3522885,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"lasong"}
          #2.12 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 9:40 AM EDT
          {"commentId":3525668,"authorDomain":"werblssed"}
          Beverly H

          Good post Hyper, I would assume most of the readers of this board have never owned a small business and have no idea what kind of capitol it takes to do so. They have probably never been on the giving side, giving paychecks, health insurance, benefits, and jobs..But in order to keep a business running and growing you need capitol...I would like to hear just one GOOD answer as to how Obama's plan would be better then McCains for all the small businesses of America?

          {"commentId":3525668,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"werblssed"}
          • 2 votes
          #2.13 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 10:57 AM EDT
          {"commentId":3525979,"authorDomain":"bfrdi"}
          brianbaDeleted
          {"commentId":3527674,"authorDomain":"werblssed"}
          Beverly H

          Pittsburg, You are wrong trickle down does work, you just want to stand in line with the rest and hold you hand out instead of working for a living...The financial mess this country is in was not caused by the tax policy..It was your Dem. Party in congress and F/F.

          {"commentId":3527674,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"werblssed"}
          • 2 votes
          #2.15 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 11:51 AM EDT
          {"commentId":3528453,"authorDomain":"JohnRussell"}
          JohnRussell

          They have probably never been on the giving side, giving paychecks, health insurance, benefits, and jobs..

          99% of employers don't GIVE their employees anything. And they certainly don't give them their paychecks, insurance or benefits, which are all part of the compensation for labor.  An employer who believes he is 'giving' something to his employees is probably prone to be the petty tyrant who tries to cheat people out of overtime pay.

          {"commentId":3528453,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"JohnRussell"}
          • 1 vote
          #2.16 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:12 PM EDT
          {"commentId":3529320,"authorDomain":"werblssed"}
          Beverly H

          John, If they GAVE you a job, then your wrong..they didn't have to give you a job.

          {"commentId":3529320,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"werblssed"}
            #2.17 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:38 PM EDT
            {"commentId":3531344,"authorDomain":"JohnRussell"}
            JohnRussell

            They don't GIVE you a job. They hire you to work for them.

            Some employers are nice people, and good to their employees , and some exploit their employees. But virtually NONE of them are in the business of GIVING their employees anything.

            {"commentId":3531344,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"JohnRussell"}
            • 1 vote
            #2.18 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 1:33 PM EDT
            {"commentId":3533560,"authorDomain":"BlueLeftHand"}
            Kim-298921

            Hyper:

            Hire yourself a competent CPA.  One who knows how to factor in the support that Obama gives you tax credits for your employees' health benefits.

            {"commentId":3533560,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"BlueLeftHand"}
              #2.19 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 2:35 PM EDT
              {"commentId":3540247,"authorDomain":"drscott2k8"}
              HyperActive

              Stella - ty for your comments.  And yes you trust correctly.  I particulary appreciated this comment "it's when the people are strong that government is strong."  When the people are weak they don't support government and the government falls (collapse of USSR anybody).

              Keep questioning the socialistic agenda of Obama.  We can't allow this to happen to this great country.

              Pittsburgh - If a company is not profitable how do propose they pay for wages, expansion, increased benefits when possible, and even a stake in the company itself.  Unprofitable companies layoff workers, cut benefits, and actually downsize production. 

              You're welcome for the Econ 101 class.

              Kim - My CPA is quite competent.  His firm is the most sought after firm in the NW.

              {"commentId":3540247,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"drscott2k8"}
              • 3 votes
              #2.20 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 6:54 PM EDT
              Reply
              {"commentId":3515684,"authorDomain":"jillatteridge"}
              jma154

              So here's the first thing I noticed in this debate, I am going to break it down a bit.
              Economic crisis how to pull us out:
              McCain's suggested gov. buying home loans.
              Obama- ending tax breaks for companies opening jobs overseas. Helping families with tax breaks and allowing access to IRA's without penalties. Renagotiating home loans and building our energy.
              McCain's response to bring up plumber Joe.

              My question is, how many of us out there own our own business? I don't. I would love to get some of the wealth that McCain is saying Obama is going to spread around. I think Obama won this one.

              {"commentId":3515684,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"jillatteridge"}
              • 4 votes
              Reply#3 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:51 AM EDT
              {"commentId":3515998,"authorDomain":"jillatteridge"}
              jma154

              Another thing that stuck out in my head was the nuclear power plants McCain wants to build everywhere, safe energy. From what I have seen, and this is mainly of discovery channel, online bits and pieces and so forth. Nuclear power plants can be a huge hazard especially when regulations are not met, equipment malfunctions and there are human errors not to mention sufficient security to keep them safe. Too many mistakes can occur with too much risk, same thing with drilling... off shore drilling has just about as much risk.

              {"commentId":3515998,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"jillatteridge"}
              • 2 votes
              #3.1 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 1:01 AM EDT
              {"commentId":3516104,"authorDomain":"proscribe"}
              Edward Arnold

              Yes, Obama wants to take more money from the succesful business person and give it to those that are struggling to get their business up to the level of the one he just took money from, so then they in turn will pay more...and so on and so on. "Spreading the wealth around" as he proposes sounds good to those at the bottom, but instead of me giving someone my hard earned money why doesn't Obama just say "WORK HARDER"?? Yes, I make a nice sum of money, but where was everyone else during the years I struggled, did without, no new cars, no vacations, no fancy clothes...just work, work, and work. So my attitude is -- SCREW ALL OF THEM, if you want to rise up then get off your lazy asses, work fifteen hours a day, forget monday night football where the guys sit around guzzling beer, eating potato chips and dip, scratching, belching, and farting...get out and bust you butt and get off of the sofa... So I have money, big deal!! I damn sure am not about to give it away to some lazy @!$%#. But I WILL help (and I have in the past) give a helping hand to those that show some spunk. Obama's answer is socialism pure and simple...no way is he going to make me pay more taxes, I didn't get where I'm at by being stupid. Who was it years ago that said: "only the poor pay taxes"??? Sure, I pay my fair share of taxes, but no more than that...period!!

              {"commentId":3516104,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"proscribe"}
              • 3 votes
              #3.2 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 1:06 AM EDT
              {"commentId":3516117,"authorDomain":"JohnRussell"}
              JohnRussell

              Obama keeps talking about raising taxes on corporations. Sounds good until you realize that Obama is playing a game called "How many votes can I get with this cheap ploy?". Obama knows that any taxes placed on corporations will be passed on to the rest of us, the consumers as price hikes for the corporation's goods or services. Obama knows this, but makes the pitch anyway. Typical dishonest move by a typical politician.

              {"commentId":3516117,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"JohnRussell"}
              • 2 votes
              #3.3 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 1:06 AM EDT
              {"commentId":3516320,"authorDomain":"rdonaldsnyder"}
              R. Donald Snyder

              jma154

              And there is also the problem that, along with no viable way to dispose of the waste, is that nuclear power is not efficient. There has never been a nuclear power plant that has turned a profit in America. The costs of building them and operating them safely is so huge that everyone of them has depended on government subsidies to stay operating.

              {"commentId":3516320,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"rdonaldsnyder"}
              • 4 votes
              #3.4 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 1:15 AM EDT
              {"commentId":3518606,"authorDomain":"jilwater"}
              Happyblue

              I am really sick of Joe the plumber who seems a bit like a spoiled brat, or a Republican plant.   Most of the people I know in working class America would be happy making 75K, consider that huge,  but Joe the Plumber wants to make so much more and he wants the Democratic candidate to guarantee him that he can achieve his American Dream, keep his bass boat and his rifles. 

              Completely out of touch with reality and the Republicans ran with it.  I wonder how on earth they think someone working two jobs to make 40K a year, without a bass boat to boot feels about hearing Joe the Plumber whine over the fact that he may not get to go fishing whenever he feels the need because Obama is going to tax him too much.   Poor guy.  

              It is the mind set of people like this, that stand up on national TV and are made into mini stars because they use the word, American Dream.   That dream is long gone for every day average Americans that struggle with housing and health care costs.  The Republicans and Joe the Plumber completely dismisses those that feel they are doing okay because they do have a roof over their heads and food on the table.   But, Joe the Plumber wants so much more, he wants the whole enchilada because he feels the American Dream is his right.   The American dream is everyone's right, not just Joe the Plumber's.   Sally the Teacher, Mike the EMT, the elderly lady at the checkout who should have retired years ago, nurses, police officers, the list goes on and on.....  perhaps these folks would like to go bass fishing too.

              Here are the Republican ideals in place that got America into the mess it is in today.  The ME generation, take it all and I want more.  Joe decries Socialism, but then what does he think about the govt. bailout plan?  The goverment investing in banks?  Joe the Plumber is capable of ignoring socialism via the current administration but can drop the word on a dime when it comes to his bass boat.  

              Poor Joe the Plumber, you got to feel for him, he thinks Obama is going to initiate socialist policies while the Plumber's union endorses Obama.   Guess Joe didn't get the memo, maybe he was out fishing contemplating his American Dream. 

              So as I understand it, only small business owners work harder than anyone else in the US and they deserve more and we, the teachers, the every day people who service the small business owners should allow them to have more, because they employ people.  Like say, ten employees, that need health care and stuff.    So Mike the EMT should realize this and not complain because for all the lives he saves while making little to nothing and no bass boat - there are ten people with healthcare thanks to Joe the Plumber!

              I get it now.

                
               

              {"commentId":3518606,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"jilwater"}
              • 3 votes
              #3.5 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 5:00 AM EDT
              {"commentId":3519354,"authorDomain":"PartysOver"}
              PartysOverDeleted
              {"commentId":3520209,"authorDomain":"jilwater"}
              Happyblue

              That is your opinion, but it puts you in the top 1% of the country who have the privlege of thinking that way.     If you have kids, I hope you look their teacher in the eye and tell that teacher the same thing.    I'm sure she will agree that you should 'spread' your money around any way you would like and not be responsible for your fair share of taxes.    

              {"commentId":3520209,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"jilwater"}
                #3.7 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 8:02 AM EDT
                {"commentId":3520355,"authorDomain":"PartysOver"}
                PartysOverDeleted
                {"commentId":3521934,"authorDomain":"jilwater"}
                Happyblue

                Teachers wages depend on what State you are in.     However,  I know teachers whose starting pay is 20K.   There are EMT's who start at 16K.   Not a whole lot of money for teaching and saving lives.     Good for you that your life is set and you have worked hard, many people work hard their entire lives AND pay taxes yet will not be as comfortable as you or have had the opportunities that you or your daughter received.  

                Good luck on that SS.   McCain wants to privatize it via Wall Street and we all know how reliable Wall Street is.     I wouldn't want them playing with my retirement.  

                {"commentId":3521934,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"jilwater"}
                • 2 votes
                #3.9 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 9:12 AM EDT
                {"commentId":3522457,"authorDomain":"PartysOver"}
                PartysOverDeleted
                {"commentId":3526144,"authorDomain":"bfrdi"}
                brianbaDeleted
                {"commentId":3526350,"authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                Beverly H

                JMI,
                Thats my point, you have never owned a small business but YOU want some of their money, Have you ever worked for a small business? If you want some of their money go work for a small business and save some of the money you earn, that way you can have some of their money, but they are the catalys in which America has prospered in the past...They are the ones that pay you for a job well done, life is not handed to you on a silver platter and no has the right to take something that they did not earn.
                All of these people that complain about not having an education to build a career on I have a solution for you, Join the Military, they will train you, pay you, feed you and house you and pay your medical and when you've completed  your tour of duty, you will be educated and can pursue a career in the private sector.   But the best thing about this plan is you will be giving and not just taking

                {"commentId":3526350,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                • 1 vote
                #3.12 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 11:16 AM EDT
                {"commentId":3527536,"authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                Beverly H

                HAPPYBLUE..You seem to be obsessed with trying to take Joe the Plumbers money, If you want to work 2 jobs, (I personally doubt that you do or you wouldn't have all this time you spend on the computer) than work two jobs, Rather than trying to take money from others why not give to the country Join the military, they'll feed you, house you, cover your medical, and they'll train you and then one day you can be Joe the Plumber, And you will actually be doing something good for your country. You can either be part of the problem or be part of the solution.

                {"commentId":3527536,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                • 1 vote
                #3.13 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 11:47 AM EDT
                {"commentId":3528778,"authorDomain":"lasong"}
                Pittsburgh2

                ,
                ......you want to stand in line...with your hand out instead of working for a living...

                Beverly,
                Nice.  Your post was offensive.  "My friend" your arguments would have some credibility if you could learn how to debate without insults.

                {"commentId":3528778,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"lasong"}
                • 2 votes
                #3.14 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:20 PM EDT
                {"commentId":3528969,"authorDomain":"jilwater"}
                Happyblue

                Beverly, you haven't a clue.  You say you were a vet.  Then you continually tell people to join the  military.   Then you say you were homeless and you have suffered and struggled.   Why then would anyone join the military, just so they can be homeless and struggle for the rest of their lives?   You know, because all that military spending takes such good care of America's vets.  

                Seems to me you are a bit confused.

                {"commentId":3528969,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"jilwater"}
                  #3.15 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:26 PM EDT
                  {"commentId":3529040,"authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                  Beverly H

                  I tell it like it is, that is just how yall sound, We Want Obama so we can have the money we didn't earn...sometimes the truth hurts don't it

                  {"commentId":3529040,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                  • 1 vote
                  #3.16 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:28 PM EDT
                  {"commentId":3529143,"authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                  Beverly H

                  Happy I was homeless but I am not now because when I was homeless I went out and helped people so I could help myself..sorry you don't approve.
                  And Yes I do say if people want to lift themselves up in life the can do it by joining the military, they would have FREE housing, food, medical, and education, plus they would be GIVING rather then TAKING. but thats just too much for you to understand isn't it?

                  {"commentId":3529143,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                  • 1 vote
                  #3.17 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:32 PM EDT
                  {"commentId":3530986,"authorDomain":"jilwater"}
                  Happyblue

                  No, I can understand that, however you never explained how as a vet you ended up homeless, and at the same time you want people to lift themselves up by joining the military.   It doesn't appear that the military helped you very much.

                  {"commentId":3530986,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"jilwater"}
                    #3.18 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 1:24 PM EDT
                    {"commentId":3532803,"authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                    Beverly H

                    Happy, when I left the Military I was still married to my first husband, He was physically abusive and in order for me to save my self I left him, I had no place to go and ended up on the streets living in my car, I started cleaning houses for some elderly people and then found a job on the Aif force base... It wasn't the proudest moment in my life , but I worked my way out of it by giving to others, I was fortunate enough to know some of the military officers, because I had just been honorably discharged, and it was through them I was able to open a barber shop in the Officers club...

                    {"commentId":3532803,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                      #3.19 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 2:13 PM EDT
                      {"commentId":3535085,"authorDomain":"jilwater"}
                      Happyblue

                      Thank you for explaining.   Still, someone helped you and I am glad that they did, they offered you work. 

                      However, I wish you would see that not every person on the streets and particularly those who fell on hard times with children in tow are able to find people generous enough to open their homes for them to clean.   Often these people have a stigma attached to them, one that isn't fair.    They are proud and want to work, they have few skills, they may be too old for the military or in several cases I know, were vets from the military just as you were. 

                      However, just glad you found your way.  

                      {"commentId":3535085,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"jilwater"}
                        #3.20 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 3:34 PM EDT
                        {"commentId":3535532,"authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                        Beverly H

                        Happy thank, you, But I do want you to know that I am a very compassionate person, and I have gone out and helped with the underprivledged, but the answer is not more Government, the answer is self help. If they want work there are things they can do. I know alot of people that do recycling, they take their children with them and collect cans and bottles and believe it or not  some of them make pretty good money doing it and it helps the environment, I know its not glorified work but it helps feed them and in some cases actually puts a roof over their heads..You just have to let people know there are things they can do and places they can go, alot of the churches provide food and warm clothing for families and people in dispair, but what I am basically trying to get across is we can't afford for the government to provide for everyone, especially when there are private organization and churches that are willing and able to help.

                        {"commentId":3535532,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                          #3.21 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 3:49 PM EDT
                          {"commentId":3542669,"authorDomain":"jillatteridge"}
                          jma154

                          Please see below for my continued response to all comments in this box.

                          {"commentId":3542669,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"jillatteridge"}
                            #3.22 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 9:06 PM EDT
                            Reply
                            {"commentId":3516411,"authorDomain":"rdonaldsnyder"}
                            R. Donald Snyder

                            I would like Obama to tell me where all the money for his new programs is coming from

                            A large part of it will come from not transferring more taxpayer money from the middle-class to the rich via Bush's war of choice in Iraq.

                            {"commentId":3516411,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"rdonaldsnyder"}
                            • 6 votes
                            Reply#4 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 1:19 AM EDT
                            {"commentId":3526183,"authorDomain":"bfrdi"}
                            brianbaDeleted
                            {"commentId":3527026,"authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                            Beverly H

                            Snyder, It seems to me that America has become a bunch of turn tail whimps, They would rather call off the war in Iraq and run to their corner for cover then to stand proud and defend her.
                            No One likes war,but we all know that in order to preserve our freedoms and protect those living in an oppressive country, we sometimes have to engage. I would love to see an end to the war but not by defeat. I know what its like to send family members off to fight for our rights, I know what its like to lose someone in those battles, but I also know what its like to live in America, the one country that so many others try to come to risking life and limb. We have something special here in America even with the problems we see today. Preserving America's integrity and turning the page to a brighter future is in our hands and I know that McCain's fighting spirit will take us to a brighter tomorrow. He has been the fighter and reformer all through his career and this is what we need now in our country, someone that will shake it up in Washington to get the job done for all Americans. I am afraid if Obama wins it will only compound the problems and make things worse, he will have a complete philibuster in congress and  bills will not be past logically, we will all suffer because of it, we will lose our democracy with such a left leaning congress and president...We can't let this happen to America

                            {"commentId":3527026,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                              #4.2 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 11:33 AM EDT
                              {"commentId":3531072,"authorDomain":"lasong"}
                              Pittsburgh2

                              .....I am afraid if Obama wins....

                              Don't be afraid.  It's going to be fine.  Be afraid if we get more of the same.

                              {"commentId":3531072,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"lasong"}
                                #4.3 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 1:26 PM EDT
                                Reply
                                {"commentId":3517638,"authorDomain":"ernieelf"}
                                ernieelf

                                Hmmm,  must be ACORN in charge of these debate polls.

                                Clearly,  McCain was in charge and on the offensive throughout the debate.   Obama could only come back with his longwinded and misguidedly muddled choppy replies. 

                                {"commentId":3517638,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"ernieelf"}
                                • 4 votes
                                Reply#5 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 2:33 AM EDT
                                {"commentId":3517811,"authorDomain":"rdonaldsnyder"}
                                R. Donald Snyder

                                Go back to your tree ernie, the stove is on fire.

                                {"commentId":3517811,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"rdonaldsnyder"}
                                • 3 votes
                                #5.1 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 2:50 AM EDT
                                {"commentId":3517934,"authorDomain":"ernieelf"}
                                ernieelf

                                How about you go crawl back into your liberal hole of ignorance.   Anyone who would actually vote for Obama just doesn't get it. 

                                {"commentId":3517934,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"ernieelf"}
                                • 3 votes
                                #5.2 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 3:01 AM EDT
                                {"commentId":3518023,"authorDomain":"rdonaldsnyder"}
                                R. Donald Snyder

                                Nice intellectual comeback for an elf. Don't let your cookies burn.

                                ;-)

                                {"commentId":3518023,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"rdonaldsnyder"}
                                • 3 votes
                                #5.3 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 3:15 AM EDT
                                {"commentId":3518486,"authorDomain":"chasing"}
                                Chasing

                                Anyone who would actually vote for Obama just doesn't get it.

                                Get WHAT precisely.  Answer in detail, or don't bother at all.

                                {"commentId":3518486,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"chasing"}
                                • 4 votes
                                #5.4 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 4:33 AM EDT
                                {"commentId":3519369,"authorDomain":"PartysOver"}
                                PartysOverDeleted
                                {"commentId":3528584,"authorDomain":"PartysOver"}
                                PartysOverDeleted
                                {"commentId":3531202,"authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                                Beverly H

                                Put it out there in simple terms.....

                                MC-Lower taxes for all Americans paying taxes

                                Obama- says lower taxes for 95% of Ameicans, 95% of Americans don't pay taxes

                                MC- Lower taxes on businesses, to help generate jobs

                                O- Raise taxes on businesses making over 250,000., lose jobs businesses move to other countries so they can afford to stay in business

                                MC-reduce capitol gains

                                O- raise capitol gains

                                MC- wants people to distribute their own money

                                O, wants to distribute OPM to those that don't pay taxes

                                MC- wants to deregulate private businesses but keep OSHA standards in place

                                O , wants to regulate private businesses telling them who they can hire, how much to pay them, what benefits they need to give

                                MC, believes people should be able to choose Schools for their children by vouchers and charter schools

                                O, wants charter schools, wants to teach radical lessons on activisim and sex ed to Kindergarten

                                MC- wants to help homeowners with their mortgage losses through the 700 bill. bailout, to sure up the mortgage crisis and create jobs that were lost as a result of current situation

                                O, wants to help mortgage holders by introducing new legislative bills, cost the American taxpayer more money

                                MC- wants independence on foriegn oil by drilling, Nueclear power, wind, solar and natural gas, clean coal, creating new jobs

                                O, wants to use the fields all ready leased to oil companies that have been surveyed and found only to have a small amount of oil, and use wind, solar and natural gas

                                MC wants free market trade

                                O, wants trade but not free market

                                MC wants all earmarks in congress cut

                                Obama, has called for 1,000,000. a day since he's been in congress in new earmarks

                                MC is Pro-life

                                Obama is Pro- abortion

                                MC wants to finish business in Iraq and bring our men and women home in honor

                                O, wants to let our country down in defeat

                                MC- has years of experience in government and Military

                                O, never served in the Military and was a community organizer and Jr. Senator

                                Its pretty clear to me that MC is the better candidate  

                                {"commentId":3531202,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                                • 3 votes
                                #5.7 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 1:30 PM EDT
                                {"commentId":3531473,"authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                                Beverly H

                                One last thing,

                                MC- wants to freeze all spending in congress except for the military and Social security

                                O, hasn't come up with a plan to reduce spending except with a scalpel, like thats going to help

                                {"commentId":3531473,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                                • 1 vote
                                #5.8 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 1:37 PM EDT
                                {"commentId":3533598,"authorDomain":"striider2-1"}
                                Striider

                                Beverly H:  You, like McCain and Palin, are so quick to completely distort the truth (and, actually, outright lie). I could easily take issue with just about every bullet point you made, but time is so short.

                                First of all, you make the completely false statement that "Obama is Pro- abortion." Please, do refer me to any statement, made anytime, by Barak Obama where he says he is "Pro-abortion." I think you cannot. Barak Obama is pro-choice - and that is not at all the same thing as being pro-abortion. A great many Americans are anti-abortion, but pro-choice. So, don't make such irresponsible statements.

                                You say that McCain wants to "wants to finish business in Iraq and bring our men and women home in honor."  "Business" will never be finished in Iraq. Thank God, the Iraqis themselves will ultimately require that we cease the occupation of their country that we have so screwed, at the cost of over 4,000 Ameican lives, over 300 other coalition lives, hundreds of thousands of innocent Iraqis, and the loss of homes and displacement of millions of Iraqis. That is, unless President Obama brings our troops home first. I suppose that you probably supported that megalomaniac George Bush who took us over there in the first place, his supposed justification being nothing but lies and fraud perpetrated on the American people and the world. Shame on you guys who subjected the USA and the world to George Bush. So much shame.

                                You say: "wants to use the fields all ready leased to oil companies that have been surveyed and found only to have a small amount of oil, and use wind, solar and natural gas". If those fields already leased to oil companies have only a small amount of oil, then they should mind if their leases are revoked and given to someone else. Should they?

                                You say that "95% of Americans don't pay taxes". That is such an absurdity. Where on earth do you come up with your mis-information?

                                Come on, take off your blinders and see things as they really are, rather than painting your own picture based on what you hear.

                                {"commentId":3533598,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"striider2-1"}
                                  #5.9 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 2:36 PM EDT
                                  {"commentId":3534336,"authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                                  Beverly H

                                  Strider, let me clearify it for you then, he is pro-choice and doesn't give a damn if the abortion fails and the baby lives, just don't give them any medical assistance and let them die...they are just a mistake...
                                  Business will be finished in Iraq when the Iraq's take over their own efforts, will we have soldiers there? you bet as we have had soldiers in Germany, Japan and many other places around the globe.
                                  The number you state is approximately 860 lives a year to the given cause, now obviously no one wants any lives lost, but remember these men and women knew what they were doing and the potential risk of doing it, they were not forced to sign enlistment papers, I know I was enlisted. Sometimes people do whats right for humanity and don't always just think about themselves..That is another reason we don't just pull out and come home, why take down those that have given so much?
                                  It has been said again and again that these leases are almost useless why not go to where we know the oil exists in large quantities.
                                  Not all of the 95% of  Americans pay taxes, I didn't mean 95% don't pay taxes, but his plan is clearly that even if you don't pay taxes he's going to strip money off of the business owners and give it to them. Redistribution of wealth, which is ridiculous 
                                  Frankly, My blinders are off and my eyes are wide open and no matter how you look at it Obama's plan stinks.  BUT GOSH IT WAS A GOOD TRY YOU MADE

                                  {"commentId":3534336,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                                  • 1 vote
                                  #5.10 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 3:01 PM EDT
                                  Reply
                                  {"commentId":3517774,"authorDomain":"striider2-1"}
                                  Striider

                                  Dear Joe the Plumber... I'm afraid that you've fallen victim to the intentional misrepresentation and fear mongering of John McCain. You say that you want to purchase the company that you currently work for, but you couldn't afford to with Barak Obama's additional tax burden. Huh? What's up with that? His additional tax applies only to small businesses that earn more than $250k per year. And - the higher tax bracket is only 3% more than the current, meaning that any additional profits you make above $250k would be taxed at 39% rather than the current 36%. So, if your company were to earn a profit of, say, $300,000 your tax liability would increase by a whopping $1,500 ($50k x 39% instead of $50k x 36%). If that additional tax liability of $1,500 is going to turn you away from purchasing a company that's going to give you $300k in profits (before tax) then you're not very business savvy and it's better that you not undertake to become your own boss anyway. Perhaps you've forgotten that tax is on profits, not on gross sales. Give it some thought, and try not to get lost in the McCain-Palin smoke.

                                  Good wishes, and good luck in your decision!

                                  {"commentId":3517774,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"striider2-1"}
                                  • 2 votes
                                  Reply#6 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 2:46 AM EDT
                                  {"commentId":3526266,"authorDomain":"bfrdi"}
                                  brianbaDeleted
                                  Reply
                                  {"commentId":3517858,"authorDomain":"marlene-9"}
                                  Marlene G

                                  I dont like any of the candidates. Both have a tendency to provide inaccurate facts, give double messages and constantly repeat themselves. Sincerelly, I like Biden better. Or Mrs. Clinton.

                                  I was more open to McCain until he choose Mrs. Maverick Drill Maniac as a VP

                                  {"commentId":3517858,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"marlene-9"}
                                    Reply#7 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 2:54 AM EDT
                                    {"commentId":3518060,"authorDomain":"striider2-1"}
                                    Striider

                                    To Edward Arnold:  Your argument is rather lame. You don't want to pay more taxes just because you earn more money, and that Barak Obama's proposal that you should amounts to his being a Socialist. Huh? In case you're not familiar, we're already taxed under a tiered, marginal tax rate structure. So, what if the companies and individuals with the highest incomes are going to have their highest tier increased by 3%. Big deal to Exxon-Mobil, I think! Furthermore, if socialism is, as you say, "belief that the state has a responsibility to reduce wealth disparity between people and prevent any citizen from suffering neglect." then aren't we already operating under a Socialistic system? After all, at least in theory, the rich pay more in taxes than the poor, and the poorest pay nothing at all - and live off publicly provided housing, healthcare, foodstamps, and pauper burials.

                                    As for your own success and wealth - congratulations. I'm glad that you, through your hard work and the opportunities that have been afforded you and that you worked to your advantage have given you such a good life. Still, there are many who have worked a lot harder than you, no doubt, yet still don't enjoy your prosperity - so don't presume to tell everyone less fortunate than you that they need to get off their lazy asses, et al.

                                    Edward:  Live long and prosper - and hopefully learn to feel a little compassion....

                                    {"commentId":3518060,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"striider2-1"}
                                    • 3 votes
                                    Reply#8 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 3:20 AM EDT
                                    {"commentId":3528714,"authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                                    Beverly H

                                    Strider, what you don't seem to realize is most businesses in America are not Exxon-Mobile, they are private small businesses, and even if they were the Exxons they shouldn't have to pick up the slack for all your fellow liberals...Your all takers and not givers..Shame on you
                                    So who's fault is it that those that worked (Harder then Edward) don't have the same as Edward? Its their own fault this country has every opportunity to get were you want to be in life, if people don't take those opportunities its not up to the people who did to pave their way in life.

                                    {"commentId":3528714,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                                    • 1 vote
                                    #8.1 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:19 PM EDT
                                    Reply
                                    {"commentId":3519264,"authorDomain":"PartysOver"}
                                    PartysOverDeleted
                                    {"commentId":3519512,"authorDomain":"lasong"}
                                    Pittsburgh2

                                    Marlene,

                                    Unfortunately, with Palin, McCain, and Palin's husband in the mix I think, as I've said lately,

                                    we're getting:  "winkin'   blinkin'   &  Todd"

                                    {"commentId":3519512,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"lasong"}
                                    • 2 votes
                                    Reply#10 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 7:14 AM EDT
                                    {"commentId":3536465,"authorDomain":"marlene-9"}
                                    Marlene G

                                    lol

                                    Indeed... and the "beware, he uses 6 letter words to speak! Shame on him!" Now on, we will have to limit the number of letters in the words children learn, so they dont grow up to confuse other people. That is wordism!

                                    {"commentId":3536465,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"marlene-9"}
                                      #10.1 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 4:23 PM EDT
                                      {"commentId":3541159,"authorDomain":"striider2-1"}
                                      Striider

                                      Pittsburgh - too, too funny - but you're dern tootin'....

                                      {"commentId":3541159,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"striider2-1"}
                                        #10.2 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 7:37 PM EDT
                                        Reply
                                        {"commentId":3519561,"authorDomain":"lasong"}
                                        Pittsburgh2

                                        P.S.
                                        Audience and studio reaction on every single network last night showed how Americans are sick of the negative attacks.  I feel Sen. McCain has now found (or is finding out this morning) that the biggest mistake he made was when he starting attacking.  Whether he felt justified or not justified really did not matter to the American voters.  They wanted to hear the candidates' plans and what they were going to do.  Period.   McCain's supporters may have wanted him to be aggressive in that area, but most voters did not.   I think if McCain had stayed on course the whole time, it would given him some advantage.
                                        McCain put Obama on the defensive, but it did not get the result McCain was hoping for. Obama just merely continued on point -- The other bit of bad news for McCain is that the electorate map projection has changed to Obama's favor yet again with 277 to 174 with Virginia going blue.

                                        {"commentId":3519561,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"lasong"}
                                        • 2 votes
                                        Reply#11 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 7:19 AM EDT
                                        {"commentId":3519621,"authorDomain":"lasong"}
                                        Pittsburgh2

                                        Strider:

                                        Big hug from the "burgh--

                                        {"commentId":3519621,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"lasong"}
                                          Reply#12 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 7:24 AM EDT
                                          {"commentId":3519716,"authorDomain":"rmcduffie"}
                                          Rob M-472678

                                          What was Obama on the defense about?  Not about his policies.  It was all about the lies McCain and Palin have been using to cast doubt on his character.   McCain on the other hand had a hard time explaining his plans for the nation and continuously shifted the conversation whenever Obama called him out on some of the deficiencies of McCain's proposed plans or some of McCain's past statements.

                                          {"commentId":3519716,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"rmcduffie"}
                                            Reply#13 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 7:30 AM EDT
                                            {"commentId":3520059,"authorDomain":"PartysOver"}
                                            PartysOverDeleted
                                            {"commentId":3521060,"authorDomain":"lasong"}
                                            Pittsburgh2

                                            Obominous--
                                            .....Obama is not the new shiny nickle....,
                                            At this point in the campaign phase, Obama is clearly (even in Fox's opinions )"out-shinning" the competition.  ( I know that was kinda corny, but .....)

                                            {"commentId":3521060,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"lasong"}
                                              #13.2 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 8:41 AM EDT
                                              {"commentId":3521185,"authorDomain":"lasong"}
                                              Pittsburgh2

                                              oops--missp.

                                              {"commentId":3521185,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"lasong"}
                                                #13.3 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 8:45 AM EDT
                                                Reply
                                                {"commentId":3522610,"authorDomain":"bluecollarbytes"}
                                                bluecollarbytes

                                                Obama's redistribution of wealth, from those according to their ability to those according to what politicians tell them they need.- mo better guvmint. Obama's guvmint will force citizens to act as Obama/Nanny/Harry deems correct.

                                                {"commentId":3522610,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"bluecollarbytes"}
                                                • 2 votes
                                                Reply#14 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 9:31 AM EDT
                                                {"commentId":3522995,"authorDomain":"lasong"}
                                                Pittsburgh2

                                                bluecollarbytes:

                                                There's a Code of Honor on Newsvine.  Take note.

                                                {"commentId":3522995,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"lasong"}
                                                  #14.1 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 9:43 AM EDT
                                                  Reply
                                                  {"commentId":3525704,"authorDomain":"sylviagregory"}
                                                  sylviagregory

                                                  I was listening  to Sarah Palins stump speech today and when she came to  the part in her speech where she speaks of corruption and accountability in Washington I thought what a hypocrite.
                                                  I am just amazed how she pushed her Ethics violation charge under the rug without a public apology to the People of Alaska.
                                                  I am amazed at the press, How they are not calling her to be accountable to the People of Alaska. We have not heard from them, We don't know how they feel about the decision and if they feel she has done all that she could to bring the transparency that she speaks about daily in her campaign speech to this situation. We hear so much about Bill Ayers, Jeremiah Wright, Acorn any thing that can be brought out of the trash about Obama. 
                                                  But  the Press will not call Sarah Palin out on her disrespect towards the People she Governs in Alaska.

                                                  {"commentId":3525704,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"sylviagregory"}
                                                    Reply#15 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 10:58 AM EDT
                                                    {"commentId":3526363,"authorDomain":"bfrdi"}
                                                    brianbaDeleted
                                                    {"commentId":3528439,"authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                                                    Beverly H

                                                    Brianba, Thats the way the dems are, they can throw the punches but can't take them, I noticed last night When John McCain asked Obama to apologize for not standing up to Lewis he did not. Yet I have noticed when people in McCains crowds say derrogatory things about Obama, McCain tries to temper the situation and actually stand up for Obama. The liberals know that Obama is not the best person for the job but he offers them a free ride so they jump on board... Its a double standard, and frankly the liberals are nothing but a bunch of lazy freeloaders..Obama will be a desaster for this country and we may as will turn ourselves over to the middle East, because thats where Obama gets his GREAT ideas..Ahkmedenijad.
                                                    I truely feel sorry for the Jewish American's

                                                    {"commentId":3528439,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                                                    • 1 vote
                                                    #15.2 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:11 PM EDT
                                                    {"commentId":3528999,"authorDomain":"lasong"}
                                                    Pittsburgh2

                                                    The liberals know that Obama is not the best person for the job......
                                                    Really? 
                                                    That's a new one on me.

                                                    {"commentId":3528999,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"lasong"}
                                                    • 1 vote
                                                    #15.3 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:27 PM EDT
                                                    {"commentId":3533658,"authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                                                    Beverly H

                                                    Sylvia
                                                    The only thing they said about those ethic charges was that she didn't do enough to stop her husband from asking questions, she was completely within her rights, so you can throw that hype right out the window, the people of Alaska have given her an 80% approval rating for the job she has done and thats higher than any governor across the nation, Its not like she lying about her background like Obama does...

                                                    {"commentId":3533658,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                                                    • 1 vote
                                                    #15.4 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 2:38 PM EDT
                                                    {"commentId":3533689,"authorDomain":"BlueLeftHand"}
                                                    Kim-298921

                                                    Beverly:

                                                    Read the CoH and follow it.

                                                    {"commentId":3533689,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"BlueLeftHand"}
                                                      #15.5 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 2:39 PM EDT
                                                      {"commentId":3534531,"authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                                                      Beverly H

                                                      Kim, what did I say that your unhappy with, your always unhappy about someone..Its funny when you don't agree with someone they are always going against CoH.

                                                      {"commentId":3534531,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                                                        #15.6 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 3:07 PM EDT
                                                        {"commentId":3535138,"authorDomain":"sha-1"}
                                                        SH-2000

                                                        FYI Beverly:

                                                        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mOEqUm1CuE0

                                                        "When Barack talks about talking with our enemies, that should not be interpreted in any way as a sign of weakness," said Schakowsky in a phone interview. "This is not about backing down; this is about engaging."

                                                        -Source:

                                                        http://www.jewishexponent.com/article/17347/

                                                        {"commentId":3535138,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"sha-1"}
                                                          #15.7 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 3:35 PM EDT
                                                          Reply
                                                          {"commentId":3531461,"authorDomain":"ochorocks"}
                                                          Dave for McCain

                                                          McCain did great last night! Obama was still cool, but he was definately on his toes.

                                                          {"commentId":3531461,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"ochorocks"}
                                                          • 1 vote
                                                          Reply#16 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 1:36 PM EDT
                                                          {"commentId":3535226,"authorDomain":"sha-1"}
                                                          SH-2000

                                                          Mccain did his best, but sadly for him his best isn't enough to erase 8 years of voting 90 PLUS percent of the time for the Bush mistakes. Please see:

                                                          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LsJlSTcWqpQ

                                                          {"commentId":3535226,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"sha-1"}
                                                          • 1 vote
                                                          #16.1 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 3:39 PM EDT
                                                          Reply
                                                          {"commentId":3531515,"authorDomain":"ochorocks"}
                                                          Dave for McCain

                                                          My employers are really liberal. They told me that they were voting for Obama and I liked a lot of their reasoning why. They said that they see how the trickle down effect worked in Regan's time, but "it will not work now because of our global economy" and that they were willing to pay more in taxes to help educations and other worthy and needful causes. However....

                                                          Ironically, they were going to relocate our offices this year, but decided not too because of the "trickle down effect" from the suffering economy right now. That caused me to see a flaw in their reasoning to vote for Obama...If the trickle down effect works with negative consequences, then that why would it not work with positive consequences? I agree that this is no longer the 1980's and I sometimes get tired of all the Regan hype. I also agree that the same thing do not always work twice, but some things are just fundamental---and that was proven with the trickle down effect during Regan's era.

                                                          For those of you who do not believe in the trickle down effect, then tell me why are middle class people losing jobs after "Big Business" has done horrible in the stock market? Why does everyones expenses go up when oil prices go up? Your right, the trickle down effect has not worked since Regan. Why? Because Bush, Clinton, Congress (Republican and Democrat) and regulators failed the American people in ensuring strict regulation...which is one of Regan's pillars in making the the trickle down effect work.

                                                          {"commentId":3531515,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"ochorocks"}
                                                          • 1 vote
                                                          Reply#17 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 1:38 PM EDT
                                                          {"commentId":3535002,"authorDomain":"sha-1"}
                                                          SH-2000

                                                          Well while it was nice that Mccain gave a "shout out" to an ailing Mrs. Regan, one wonders why his well wishes weren't extended to VP Chaney?

                                                          {"commentId":3535002,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"sha-1"}
                                                            Reply#18 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 3:31 PM EDT
                                                            {"commentId":3537271,"authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                                                            Beverly H

                                                            Because Cheney's proceedure was just that, a proceedure, and he was all ready home, it was to regulate his heart beat

                                                            {"commentId":3537271,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                                                            • 1 vote
                                                            #18.1 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 4:53 PM EDT
                                                            Reply
                                                            {"commentId":3538609,"authorDomain":"blueshift-00"}
                                                            blueshift_00

                                                            I'm okay with developoing a variety of resources to meet our energy needs--including nuclear energy. But John McCain really wants to rev them up. He wants to build dozens of nuclear power plants while claiming (as he did last night in the debate) that nuclear waste is not a problem. Barack Obama missed an opportunity last night to ask McCain if Arizona would be a willing host for a national nuclear waste storage site.

                                                            {"commentId":3538609,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"blueshift-00"}
                                                              Reply#19 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 5:45 PM EDT
                                                              {"commentId":3539114,"authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                                                              Beverly H

                                                              blueshift, neuclear energy is probably as safe as natural gas, as long as its handled properly and our navy ships are a good example of that...

                                                              {"commentId":3539114,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"werblssed"}
                                                                #19.1 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 6:06 PM EDT
                                                                Reply
                                                                {"commentId":3542649,"authorDomain":"jillatteridge"}
                                                                jma154

                                                                Wow, some great postings came out of that comment. Thanks to everyone who replied, especially those that replied logically, giving solid answers/opinion and explanations or reasons to back your thoughts.

                                                                I'd rather get the comments that aren't overflowing with emotion, it seems to affect logic somehow when someone feels so strongly about something they begin call names and using swear words, it's not necessary. Thankfully there was not a lot of it in this discussion, it's been horrible in other ones. So thanks again everyone.

                                                                Also want to comment on the something I found funny. Because of my comment about loving to get some of that wealth, this was a joke on my part, I thought that McCain's comment about "spreading the wealth around" was funny because I don't think that that is what Obama is trying to do. 

                                                                However, some people assumed I am poor or lazy

                                                                "if you want to rise up then get off your lazy asses"  "I didn't get where I'm at by being stupid. Who was it years ago that said: "only the poor pay taxes"??? "

                                                                That I have not worked for a small business before, or that I am uneducated.

                                                                "you have never owned a small business but YOU want some of their money, Have you ever worked for a small business? "  ...  "life is not handed to you on a silver platter and no has the right to take something that they did not earn."   Join the Military, ... and when you've completed  your tour of duty, you will be educated and can pursue a career in the private sector."

                                                                Exactly half of my employment, has been for companies with under 25 employees, a quarter of them had less 12. So yes I have worked for small businesses and when I was laid off for the second time in less that 6 months, I specifically started looking for a corporation. I understand how the economy effects small business to a much greater degree than it does larger ones.

                                                                Neither am I uneducated, lazy, stupid or poor. I have my bachelors degree and when I graduated, it was with honors. My home was bought and paid for (at the same time) and my husband and I have a nice amount put away for rainy days. Like I said before, my original comment about wanting some of the wealth, was infact a joke, I was simply trying to go ever what was discussed in the debate and get opinions. 

                                                                {"commentId":3542649,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"jillatteridge"}
                                                                  Reply#20 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 9:05 PM EDT
                                                                  {"commentId":3544104,"authorDomain":"jillatteridge"}
                                                                  jma154

                                                                  To continue on with thoughs on the debate, the next part I think that Obama scored on ( I'm not even going to comment on the tone of the campaign) was VP's. I thought that Obama could have gone further with Biden's accomplishments and his ability to step up should the unthinkable occur, but all in all he did very well on Biden and what he said was true.

                                                                  To the other side, and Palin; let me start by saying that if Sarah Palin is a "role model to women", then we have got some serious work ahead of us. Thankfully however, it's not true, atleast not in my case. I don't think Palin is "role model" material, and neither do a whole lot of other women. And to say that she "understands" special needs children better than anyone, I think it's an insult. She has been a mother to a special needs child for how long? What about those people whose child has lived to be 60 and is a special needs child? Does she understand them better and know what they need better than someone who has devoted thier life to not only helping thier child but others as well?

                                                                  {"commentId":3544104,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"jillatteridge"}
                                                                    Reply#21 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 11:01 PM EDT
                                                                    {"commentId":3544222,"authorDomain":"striider2-1"}
                                                                    Striider

                                                                    Bravo, jma154...

                                                                    {"commentId":3544222,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"striider2-1"}
                                                                      #21.1 - Thu Oct 16, 2008 11:12 PM EDT
                                                                      {"commentId":3546626,"authorDomain":"PartysOver"}
                                                                      PartysOverDeleted
                                                                      {"commentId":3552238,"authorDomain":"StellaCa"}
                                                                      StellaCa

                                                                      Good observation. Here's one key difference: Sarah Palin wold not abort her "special needs child," and why should she ever consider doing so? But  Mr. Obama does not disapprove of "woman's right" to a partial-birth and late-term abortions. Sure, he'll deflect the question and state on his campaign site that "the states can properly restrict late-term abortions," but he won't reveal a definitive answer on the matter? That is, not until he speaks to Planned Parenthood and others...then all bets are off.

                                                                      That ineptitude goes beyond an issue of time frame. At best, that's bad judgment.

                                                                      Who's the better role model now?

                                                                      {"commentId":3552238,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"StellaCa"}
                                                                      • 1 vote
                                                                      #21.3 - Fri Oct 17, 2008 2:24 PM EDT
                                                                      {"commentId":3556919,"authorDomain":"davidjewell"}
                                                                      David Jewell

                                                                      We're electing a role model?  That's a bit naive, don't you think?

                                                                      {"commentId":3556919,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"davidjewell"}
                                                                        #21.4 - Fri Oct 17, 2008 8:26 PM EDT
                                                                        {"commentId":3558634,"authorDomain":"jillatteridge"}
                                                                        jma154

                                                                        Obaminous...Stellaca, I'm not sure that I follow?

                                                                        To reply to Obominous, I'm not sure that I follow the comparison, first I thought we were talking about what the two said about the VP candidates, I don't see how Obama's length in the senate is comparable. Second, I have not heard anyclaim that he "understands" the senate more than anyone.

                                                                        StellaCa, I'm not even going to answer the better role model question, however the better canidate I believe is Biden. Who by the way is the VP canidate on the democratic balled, not Obama.

                                                                        {"commentId":3558634,"threadId":"389925","contentId":"2003381","authorDomain":"jillatteridge"}
                                                                          #21.5 - Fri Oct 17, 2008 11:10 PM EDT
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