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Troy Anthony Powell has been running Tap’s Barber Shop for nine years and has seen business get better every year — until this year.
With the economy in a slump, Powell said loyal customers who used to come in for a haircut every week or even more often are now coming in every two or three weeks instead. Whereas some customers used to tip $5 or $10 on a $15 or $25 service, now that’s down to $3 or even just a promise that “I’ll get you next time.”
And when they do sit down in the barber’s chair, the conversation often turns to the economic pinch that everyone seems to be feeling these days.
“Within the last two months I’ve really seen a decline in business because I think a lot of people out there, they’re struggling, they’re having economic problems,” he said.
That’s translating into financial doldrums for Powell, 42, as well. This year, Powell expects to make about half as much money as he did last year in his suburban Minneapolis shop.
As the effects of the nation’s financial crisis ripple across the country, many Americans are left holding jobs but taking home less money than they have been accustomed to earning. Hundreds of msnbc.com readers who responded to a Gut Check America call said they have seen their hours or wages cut, or that their tips and commissions have fallen sharply, because of the weak economy.
The responses reflect a national trend. According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, the number of people who are working part-time but would like full-time work has risen by 1.6 million, to 6.1 million, over the past year. That figure increased by 337,000 people in September alone, the Labor Department said.
Heidi Shierholz, an economist with the Economic Policy Institute, said the sharp rise in the ranks of the underemployed has come as a big surprise and will likely end up being yet another blow for working families and the economy as a whole. That’s because it translates into less money to buy both necessities and discretionary items. That means less consumer spending, a key driver of the U.S. economy.
For Powell the drop in income means that he and his wife, a paralegal, are shopping and going out less, and probably will not be taking any trips this year. Powell has been able to keep his three other barbers on staff at the Richfield, Minn., shop, but he had to scrap a plan to provide them with health insurance.
Still, Powell said he has savings to fall back on, and he feels he has built up his business enough to weather the storm.
“I’m cutting back, but I do still feel like I’ll be all right,” he said.
For others who were already living paycheck to paycheck, the tightening market has had much harsher consequences.
Ron Siekierk, 22, quit a full-time job at a fast-food restaurant to move from his hometown of Traverse City, Mich., to California, but his plans there quickly fell through. After a stint in Florida, where he said the job market also was bleak, Siekierk found himself back in Michigan, unable to get his old job back or find another equivalent one. Everywhere he went, he said, he heard the same story — they weren’t hiring.
Siekierk finally landed a part-time job at another restaurant, making $7.40 an hour, but he said he has been unable to find full-time work. That has left his budget extremely tight.
“I don’t make enough to actually afford basic necessities,” Siekierk said.
For now, Siekierk is staying with his girlfriend, who lives about five miles outside of town, and walking to work, he said. Hoping to improve his job prospects for the future, he has enrolled in a two-year computer information technology program at Northwestern Michigan College and applied for student loans to help cover costs.
When he finishes the program, he hopes to be able to land a job that makes at least $12 an hour. While he would rather pursue a career as a cook, he has decided that getting technical training is the more practical choice.
“It’s not what I want to do, but there’s more money and it’s more readily available,” he said.
Depleted retirement savings
While Siekierk is just starting out on his career path, Milton Comeaux finds himself at what he hoped to be the tail end of it. Now 58, the car salesman had set his sights on retiring at 62, using a small 401(k) account to pad his Social Security payments.
“I’ve got grandkids; I’d love to spend some time with them,” he said.
But the stock market drop has depleted his retirement savings, and now business at the car dealership where he works, in New Iberia, La., is down sharply. Comeaux, who has worked there for the last 12 years, said he usually sells five or six cars a month, but this month, he didn’t make his first sale until Oct. 21.
Like a number of car salesmen who responded to our call for stories, Comeaux is being hit by a triple whammy of the weak economy, the recent spike in gas prices and, mostly, a tightening credit market. Customer traffic is down, and of the people who do come into the dealership, as many as half don’t qualify for a loan under new, stricter requirements, Comeaux said.
Comeaux says he lives frugally, and he’s also picked up a little extra work on the side to make ends meet, but he still has to dip into savings every month. He knows that can’t go on forever.
“At this rate I can probably go maybe another six months or so, and then I don’t know,” he said.
Bankruptcy fears
Paul Buzash also is facing the possibility that the business he has spent much of his life building will come crumbling down because of the tough credit market.
Buzash works as an environmental consultant in Glenville, N.Y., often helping companies interested in alternative energy go through the compliance process. While there has been plenty of buzz lately about alternative energy, he says most of those projects take years to complete, meaning companies can invest for as long as six years before they start generating cash.
With the credit markets tight, Buzash says many of his clients are having trouble getting the cash they need to pay him during the build-out process, in turn forcing him to leave bills unpaid. Some projects have been put on hold.
“I’m having a hard time just keeping past due 30 days, and I don’t see a change on the horizon,” he said.
For now, Buzash is relying on some savings, but he figures he can do that for only about six months. If things continue to go downhill, Buzash fears he will forced into bankruptcy, a devastating turn that could mean he would lose the house he shares with his wife and three kids, ages 17, 14 and 8. With no retirement savings, the house also is his nest egg.
“This is the worst I’ve seen it, there’s no question,” he said. “I’m trying to be optimistic and keep my head up and say, ‘Hey, it’s going to change, it’s going to get better.’ But I’m 53 years old, (and) I just don’t remember anything like this.”
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{"commentId":3735384,"authorDomain":"pmelse"}
Yeah! I've been in the car business at a high quality family owned dealership for 13 years now and this is the worst I've seen it. We have alot of loyal customeres but even they are holding back. There are at these times the people who come in and will only buy if you are willing to loose money, then they say they will "do Business"? How is that doing business?
"An exchange of goods or services for a reasonable profit"
{"commentId":3735384,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"pmelse"}
#26 - Tue Oct 28, 2008 10:45 AM EDT{"commentId":3735399,"authorDomain":"Dorothyswish"}
This economic nightmare did not happen over night and we all are to blame. When credit was easy and we could live beyond our means to keep up with the guy next door or in the "more affluent" neighborhoods; we did not stop and apply common sense or logic that someday the bill will have to be paid. My family has watched many friends and family members live in the moment and fill their lives with the "instant gratification" of having to fill their lives with material things that now are useless/meaningless and have cost them the only thing that money cannot buy....their dignity and self worth.
We are guilty of frivolous spending and have spent money unwisely however; we came from very modest means and know that we worked very hard and have stayed out of debt. This will mean very little in the coming years as everyone faces unemployment and the diminished savings/retirement nest eggs.
It is a sad and uncertain time and we have unfortunately have no faith in our leaders of our government and business entities. God help us all.
{"commentId":3735399,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"Dorothyswish"}
- 1 vote
#27 - Tue Oct 28, 2008 10:45 AM EDT{"commentId":3735443,"authorDomain":"hd65"}
Geeez people, it doesn't matter who gets elected. It is about jobs. And there are none because we are not buying American products. Look no further than you are your neighbors driveway to see where the economy is failing. There are no jobs here because we don't buy our product. But that is okay. Keep thinking the Democrats or Republicans are to blame. And watch as you lose even more jobs. And it will eventually hit everyone one way or another. I'm telling you we are detroying our economy ourselves. WAKE UP AMERICA. Love your country? Then SUPPORT IT!!! BUY AMERICAN!!!!
{"commentId":3735443,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"hd65"}
- 3 votes
#28 - Tue Oct 28, 2008 10:47 AM EDT{"commentId":3735625,"authorDomain":"Peter17"}
If you buy a Honda Accord or a Toyota Camry, you are buying a car made by Americans in this country. If you buy a Ford Fusion it was made in Mexico. A Chevy Impala is, I believe, assembled in Canada.
{"commentId":3735625,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"Peter17"}
- 1 vote
{"commentId":3735749,"authorDomain":"sjones34668"}
Puck,
I agree 100% with you. My question to you is.......Where am I going to buy all American products? Can you provide me with a list of daily necessities that are wholly made with American materials, by American workers and distributed by American companies?
{"commentId":3735749,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"sjones34668"}
- 1 vote
{"commentId":3735794,"authorDomain":"sjones34668"}
{"commentId":3735794,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"sjones34668"}
{"commentId":3735887,"authorDomain":"sabba03"}
please Peter17, educate yourself, GM employs more Americans than every foreign car company combined... even after having to cut hundreds of thousands of jobs over the last decade. Its more than just welding foreign parts together, just look at who (on average, I know there are exceptions both ways) uses more domestic suppliers. CNBC did a study that determined what has the most positive and negative impacts on the US economy when you buy a car and determined, in order: 1) American company made in America, 2)American company made in foreign country 3)Foreign company made in America 4)Foreign made foreign. Just because your rice-burner is made in Alabama, the money all goes to Tokyo, engineers are employed in Tokyo, and asian suppliers benefit the most.
{"commentId":3735887,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"sabba03"}
{"commentId":3738357,"authorDomain":"hd65"}
Uh Peter...Lesson #1 in how our economics work...well sorta
The profits from an American car manufacturer (i.e Ford, Chevy, Chrysler, etc) goes to our GNP (Gross National Product) and that is good for our country period. They assemble elsewhere because we all want to make $50/hour. So they try to cut costs by finding cheaper labor. Either to assemble, or supply the parts for assembly. Not that good, but not that bad either. Unless of course you want to make $8/hour. If not then our products cost a bit more. Suck it up for your country. The profits for Honda, Toyota, Nissan and others goes to the country where they are based. Bad for America's economy. So we will all have to allow our vehicles to be assembled cheaply elsewhere and we can all be managers. But we have to buy American to survive. End of story. Don't believe me? Fine. Keep buying foreign and see where we are 10 years from now. Oh wait, maybe it is only 5 years. LOL...Americans are just not smart enough to fix this I tell you.
{"commentId":3738357,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"hd65"}
{"commentId":3738796,"authorDomain":"bearsfansc"}
Some Toyota's are made in Kentucky & some Honda's are made in Ohio. I am PRETTY SURE THAT IS AMERICAN! Check your Vin#, since this tells you exactly where the car is made. So unless you have REALLY GOOD EYES, stop worrying about the car in your neighbor's driveway.
{"commentId":3738796,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"bearsfansc"}
{"commentId":3740743,"authorDomain":"jadej"}
Hi Puck,
What you are saying is totally true, however, you also must take into consideration how much you are spending for what you are getting. How come "American" cars (Ford, GM etc) do not last as long, or are as reliable (see Edmunds.com) than "Foreign" (Honda, Toyota) cars?
I would love to have bought an American car, but I cannot afford to replace that car after 5 years. Bring me some good ol' American QUALITY back!!
{"commentId":3740743,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"jadej"}
- 1 vote
{"commentId":3735444,"authorDomain":"MrBaker"}
I'll be 25 on Nov. 1. In 2005 my wife an i determined if I made 20 bucks in hour, she could stay home with any future children we would have. Fast forward and we have our first son (yay!) and I make 18.22 an hour. That is not enough to afford health insurance for my family under my wage but now I make too much money to afford any assistance. My wife works and they had the nerve to tell us that if she DIDN'T have a job, they could help. So should she quit her part time job at the grocery store so we can get food stamps and medicare? Its a catch 22. I make 40,000 in IT without a college degree. I used to think this was the American dream and that when I made the magical middle class 40k that I could support my family. It's pennies in today's economy. I'm proud that i have a secure job but it keeps me up at night that the best of my ambitions and hard work still has me coming up short. I'm still looking for insurance for my two week old...
{"commentId":3735444,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"MrBaker"}
- 1 vote
#29 - Tue Oct 28, 2008 10:47 AM EDT{"commentId":3735572,"authorDomain":"banopendoor"}
I am in the boat with you!
{"commentId":3735572,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"banopendoor"}
{"commentId":3735906,"authorDomain":"ls5633"}
{"commentId":3737984,"authorDomain":"mfernandez314"}
Mr. Baker, as John Lawrence states: I'm in the same boat as you. Our family has always been conservative in our spending. We do not have the latest and greatest in our home. No flat screens tv, multiple pc's, every electronic gadget that exists. Small weekend trips. We pay cash for everything. We do not use credit unless absolutely necessary. We currently have zero credit card debt. Our cars are paid for (both honda's). My husband lost his job in May (Financial Planner for Merrill Lynch), I am a Systems Analyst, his unemployment has run out. He has sent over 500 resumes, applied at fast food restaurants, retail stores, costco etc. with absolutely no bites. There will be nothing under the tree this year for our girls. Life as we knew it is gone.
We are paying for the over indulgence of our country. I hope and pray things will change and that he at least gets some income in any industry.
We don't want to move as we can walk our girls to school and their lives are established. However, it is becoming more and more difficult not to look elsewhere. Our fear is we do not have the funds to move and if we use our savings to do so then we will have nothing left (which is not much to begin with). Also, it will require for both of us to find a job in the same state because a one income family is no longer an option.
{"commentId":3737984,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"mfernandez314"}
{"commentId":3738702,"authorDomain":"JollyRogers"}
There's lots of programs for people who have minor children (WIC, etc). My advice - do the math and then do whatever is best for your family.
{"commentId":3738702,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"JollyRogers"}
- 1 vote
{"commentId":3735457,"authorDomain":"mikewittman"}
About 18 months ago I read a story in the Wall Street Journal that stated that for the first time in the history of the US "a 30 year old will make less than his/her parents" (adjusted for inflation).
It is a completley neglected fact that any "while collar" worker that I know of works 50+ hours a week and is accessible to work 24x7 thru eMail, cell-phones and beepers all for a 40 hour paycheck! In other words we're making at least 25% LESS than we even think.
Both my wife and I are so-called "white collar" but we've noticed for over 5 years that our real disposable income has been sagging. In my opinion the root of all the problems we are seeing today is due to stagnating "middle class" wages and the dissappearance of jobs to overseas labor markets.
If any of this is in fact true; then we are all in for a very long recession!
{"commentId":3735457,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"mikewittman"}
#30 - Tue Oct 28, 2008 10:47 AM EDT{"commentId":3740469,"authorDomain":"Dorothyswish"}
Amen to your comment. My husband works IT and has for 30 years. He not only is a salaried employee that has for the last 5 years worked with very insignificant increases (approximately 3%), he has had his retirement gutted, he travels 80% of the time (on his time mind you...leave on Sundays comes home on Fridays), he has watched in dismay all of the customary "bonuses" dry up. His income has not only become stagnate but almost decreased by taking in factors of inflation, cost of living increases, and the increased amount of time spent "on the Job". He puts in approximately 80-100 hours a week and when we calculate the time spent on the job by his salary; he probably makes about minimum wage! We are in the same shape as many who have written on this blog; he and I are older and know that when the job goes (either by lay-offs or outsourcing) he will be faced with limited choices on where to find employment. He practically kills himself to hang on to the job because of this knowledge in the back of his mind. We planned on retirement in 8 years but now know that will be only a "dream". The system is broke and it is not just the government but greedy corporations as well. The projects that he works on require (mandate) a certain percent to be "outsourced" and many of his employees are H1B1 from India, Pakistan, and now believe it or not..Mexico. There needs to be solutions and serious changes to save our children's future because right now we don't have faith in the so called American Dream anymore.
{"commentId":3740469,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"Dorothyswish"}
{"commentId":3735483,"authorDomain":"Tawanna"}
"Greg- 353890
Unfortunately, you are absolutely correct. I was an Obama fan until delving further. As a Christian who believes in the Book of Revelation take a look at his name Barack (6 letters) Hussein (7 letters) Obama (5 letters) do a slight shuffle removing one S from his middle name and adding another letter to his last name and he becomes The Beast- 666 and that is enough reason for me not to vote for him. and yes, We NEED GOD more than ever now!"
Are you serious? It is true that we Need God and we have always needed him, but to say that this man is beast-666 - and you are a christian and you are judging....................
this quote is correct, travel to other countries and tell me if you see foreigners driving our cars and buying our goods....................
The only way out of this mess is to buy American. Don't believe me? Okay, keep buying all the foreign goods you can find. And then drive your foreign car to the unemployment line, and to pick up your welfare check. But they won't last long either because there will be nobody paying taxes to support the sytem...LOL!!! I love it. Americans are not smart enough to realize they have destoryed their own econmy and jobs. They instead blame the politicians. This going to get REAL good REAL quick.
{"commentId":3735483,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"Tawanna"}
#31 - Tue Oct 28, 2008 10:48 AM EDT{"commentId":3735502,"authorDomain":"sweetbrsugar"}
I have not receive a raise in my job the last 4 years the last time I receive one the cost of insurance tookit away and more I'm a single person and times are hard for me some thing must be done and soon
{"commentId":3735502,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"sweetbrsugar"}
#32 - Tue Oct 28, 2008 10:49 AM EDT{"commentId":3735505,"authorDomain":"mullenepjrs5"}
I am very middle/working class. My medical benefits are great. We pay $50 every two weeks for 100% medical coverage. Then we pay $15 for office visits. John McCain would tax my medical benefits that are worth about $10,000 a year. No thanks. Since, George Bush has become President, we started paying part of the premium, and then about 4 years ago, we started office copays. McCain says the average medical insurance policy cost $5800 a year, I would like to know he got those numbers. I saw a couple on NBC news that says there medical insurance costs them $28000 a year!
{"commentId":3735505,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"mullenepjrs5"}
- 3 votes
#33 - Tue Oct 28, 2008 10:49 AM EDT{"commentId":3735956,"authorDomain":"banopendoor"}
I think you are drinking too much cool aide!
Check the truth out and you will find that McCain will save you on your insurance directly and Obama will only give you a break if you actually believe that if the cost medical care will go down if more people are insured.
The truth is that most Americans who are uninsured are not in the best health and the more people who are insured who have poor helath the costs will go up.
I want everyone to have access to affordable health care but saying McCain will cost you money is not factually supportable compared to Obama who will have to raise taxes to pay for his health care and then you will lose your job!
You will have health care but no home or food!
{"commentId":3735956,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"banopendoor"}
- 1 vote
{"commentId":3736304,"authorDomain":"thelaughons"}
Well, when you don't have a job because of Democratic tax increases, you're going to have a lot more to worry about than just having your medical benefits taxed because you won't have ANY.
Everybody seems to be so concerned about the medical benefits being taxed, but nobody seems to be concerned about losing their jobs - where they GET their medical benefits - because of corporate tax increases and such.
I think everyone needs to look at the whole picture...not just medical benefits.
{"commentId":3736304,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"thelaughons"}
- 1 vote
{"commentId":3736513,"authorDomain":"summergal46845"}
Amen! I have been working for 35 years and my future is very uncertain. If I were 25 I would not be complaining, given the amount of "working years" still ahead of me. In those 35 years, there have been times that I have worked 3 jobs to cover expenses and to get by. Looking back, I don't remember blaming anyone for that. I did what had to be done. Sometimes life is not fair. But folks, it is what it is. I wish everyone would stop blaming others for their years of having more than they need and now they don't. p.s. John Lawrence, I have never nor would I ever vote based on race or any other factor of this nature. But the truth is, this country needs fixed and for that to happen, right now, we need to at least keep a steady, experienced person in the White House. All of those Obama supporters are experts at blaming the Republicans for this mess. Fact is, the citizens of this country are to blame, and that my friend includes the Democrats as well.
{"commentId":3736513,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"summergal46845"}
- 2 votes
{"commentId":3735551,"authorDomain":"vixeneyz"}
You know I think it is funny how the company I work for now has increased their prices on all of our clients, but they refuse to give any of their employees raises! My husband & I have depleted our savings that we worked so hard to build up due to the rising cost of everything and it makes me sick! We are now barely making it going from paycheck to paycheck! I have been looking for another job, but due to the economy there really are not alot of options right now. We had a quarterly meeting a couple of weeks ago at my job and the CEO joked that he had raised the prices on our clients so he could pay for his jet fuel...I couldn't believe his audacity! It's sickening and karma is a *&%$@!
{"commentId":3735551,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"vixeneyz"}
#34 - Tue Oct 28, 2008 10:51 AM EDT{"commentId":3735557,"authorDomain":"eratobetsy"}
Why would the rise in unemployment come as a "surprise?" A downturn in the economy means that fewer people will be buying, either because they can't or because they fear the future. Lower consumer demand means lower employment, which means lower consumer demand, which means lower employment, and on and on. It is a vicious circle. At this point, it does not appear that the "people in charge" really understand this. Blaming this on a political party gets us nowhere. Both parties backed the derulation in 1999-2000. Any recovery is going to have to be from the bottom up, not "trickle down." Consumer demand s the engine that drives the economy.
{"commentId":3735557,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"eratobetsy"}
- 2 votes
#35 - Tue Oct 28, 2008 10:51 AM EDT{"commentId":3736498,"authorDomain":"leprechaun1230"}
Remember when Ross Perot was running for President a few years ago? He kept saying that NAFTA would be this "sucking sound" of American jobs going to other countries. Seems he was right. Even if you DO buy American, from companies based in America. Where do you think most of the brands are manufactured??? Sure as hell not in America. Take Unilever... Dutch Company. They make most of the toiletries and so on that people buy... Dove, Axe, just to name a few. How about Sanofi-Aventis, Novartis, Merck, to name a few more... all foreign companies doing business in the US.
Bush's hard on for deregulation has caused this mess. He seems to think business will manage themselves and do the right thing, and be honest. Well, bankers and investment companies sure as hell have proven themselves to be whores that thieves, now haven't they? four more years of King George II in the name of McShame will be the death of us all.
Health benefits, per McShame cost something in the neighborhood of $5k per year? What the hell has he been smoking? Pamela above is absolutely right. $5k won't keep you in Aspirin for a year, let alone a healthcare plan.
Obama is going to address this healthcare system, as broken as it is, and try to do something about it. McShame will NOT.
I've been reading this list of comments and I don't know where some of you get this stuff... what's with the 666 stuff..... voodoo or something? Buying American cars.... while the base corporate offices are in US, the product is made elsewhere. We are living in a time of global economy where brands, companies, economies are all intertwined. That's why OUR economic problems are the WORLD's economic problems.
Understand the basic premise. Big Businesses are run by greedy CEO's who are only concerned about making their bonuses and extravagant salaries. When a CEO has problems with his company, what does he do? He lays off the schmoes making $50k or less to fix the problems and make money. Think about it. Ever wonder why you need to worry more about your job once you hit the age of 40 or so? it's because you've worked hard and gotten raises and promotions, and began to gain equity in your retirement plans. The CEO has cash flow problems due to bad decisions, so he dumps those people in the 40 year old range. He not only dumps a higher salary, he also rids himself of any long term obligations when that group retires. Freaking Brilliant, right? Then when things get better he hires some sucker right out of school, pays them just enough to make them happy, burns them out, lets them go and the process starts all over again. i learned a LONG time ago, after 4 downsizings, right sizings, reengineering (all fancy terms for dumping your ass out of a job) that you cannot trust managers of big businesses. Like i said, they are all whores and thieves.
McShame is a proponent of the trickle down theory and it has proven not to work time and time again for the middle class. Trickle UP is how it needs to go.
I am going to give Obama/Biden the opportunity to get things right, and try to fix what 8 years of King George has totally screwed up. I can assure you all that they will NOT do anything worse than has already been done with the crooks that are now in office. That would be impossible!!!
OBAMA/BIDEN... ALL THE WAY TO THE WHITE HOUSE IN NOVEMBER!!!
{"commentId":3736498,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"leprechaun1230"}
- 1 vote
{"commentId":3736726,"authorDomain":"ls5633"}
{"commentId":3738901,"authorDomain":"JollyRogers"}
Actually Leprechaun 1230, I work for a company which manufactures a lot of product that's sold overseas to Unilever. If it wasn't for their business, several of us probably wouldn't have a job. So it works both ways.
{"commentId":3738901,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"JollyRogers"}
{"commentId":3740932,"authorDomain":"philip-c26"}
Wasn't NAFTA and the beginnings of deregulation (energy, telecom...) promoted and signed into law by Bill Clinton? We have such short memories.
{"commentId":3740932,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"philip-c26"}
- 1 vote
{"commentId":3741862,"authorDomain":"sjones34668"}
NAFTA was initially promoted by politicians in the United States and Canada supportive of free trade, led by Canadian Prime Minister Brian Mulroney, U.S. President George H. W. Bush, Mexican President Carlos Salinas de Gortari. The agreement was pursued by business interests in all three countries[7] and opposed by labor, environmental, and other business interests, in all three countries.[8][9][10][11][12] An agreement in principle was reached in August 1992 and the agreement was signed by the chief negotiators of each country in October 1992.[13] The heads of government of all three countries signed NAFTA in December 1992, subject to ratification by the legislatures of the three countries. The supplemental agreements on labour and the environment were signed in September 1993. NAFTA and the supplemental agreement came into effect until January 1, 1994
{"commentId":3741862,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"sjones34668"}
{"commentId":3742405,"authorDomain":"philip-c26"}
Sickntired-
Please give all relevant info. NAFTA was able to secure passage after Bill Clinton made its passage a major legislative priority in 1993. Clinton's Trade Representative, Mickey Kantor, was a strong advocate of the treaty.
{"commentId":3742405,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"philip-c26"}
- 1 vote
{"commentId":3742521,"authorDomain":"sjones34668"}
What relevant info is missing? The previous poster implied it was all Clinton...I corrected him/her. Bush I was the instigator. Feel free to look it up yourself and correct me where I am wrong.
{"commentId":3742521,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"sjones34668"}
{"commentId":3735586,"authorDomain":"whet2"}
TO Jayson-296839:
Listen/read closely: It is John McCain's "insurance credit" plan that will immediately push your insurance premiums (and everybody else's) OUT of the Pre-Tax side of your payroll and into the taxable side - NOT Obama's plan. Obama would leave your existing company-paid plan alone IF you choose to keep it. McCain's plan would give you an annual $5,000 tax credit to allow you to buy insurance either from your employer program or from the "free market" - a company-subsidized plan would be taxed by McCain, not by Obama. Having programmed for over 30 years in the health care industry including for health insurers, I can assure you that $5K is about half to a third of what annual premiums are for a company-subsidized family plan. Private health insurance is even much higher than that, unless you buy some very-high-deductible plan that only covers catastrophic problems and NO pre-existing conditions. And if you consider the extensive screening and DNA-based testing insurers are doing, the list of pre-existing conditions is increasing too. Pretty soon ALL but the most DNA-favored people will become ineligible for affordable insurance. IF you are young and male and single and disease-free and have a pristine family health history, you can get cheap health insurance. If you are older or female (capable of child-bearing) or have some health defect or a genetic issue or married with children, your premiums are going to be very high - simple as that.
{"commentId":3735586,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"whet2"}
- 1 vote
#36 - Tue Oct 28, 2008 10:53 AM EDT{"commentId":3736012,"authorDomain":"ls5633"}
{"commentId":3736018,"authorDomain":"banopendoor"}
5K is not about 1/2 to a rhid the cost of health insurance!
But the taxes on $15,000.00 is less that $5K and that means you pocket the difference which is about $2K per household because you no longer have to pay that amount!
These are facts! Not democrat facts of republican facts but actual facts!
{"commentId":3736018,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"banopendoor"}
- 1 vote
{"commentId":3739157,"authorDomain":"dkh4992"}
Exactly!
{"commentId":3739157,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"dkh4992"}
{"commentId":3740742,"authorDomain":"110pct"}
Hmmmm - 5k is not about 1/2 to a 1/3 the cost of health insurance??? $5k divided by 12 months is $400 a month? What planet are you from exactly? Or did you mean it was less? more like $5k is 25-50% of costs? Our Cobra benefits are $1253 a month for my frugal household of 3...(yes, my wife lost her job 7 months ago and me, being a plumber, can't get it for any less - smallest quote was $1472/mo). How about y'all? This guy is obviously out of touch with what people pay for this health "insurance" scam...
{"commentId":3740742,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"110pct"}
{"commentId":3741109,"authorDomain":"philip-c26"}
Hulk2008-
I am an insurance agent that sells individual health insurance and you are quite wrong on how much health insurance costs for a family in the private market. A family of 4 in the most expensive state (CA) actually averages about $5-600 a month. What many people pay for group coverage for their families is a subsidized premium for the employee and inflated premiums for the spouse and children. I guess some employers do not want to pay a portion of the premiums for the family members of employees.
{"commentId":3741109,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"philip-c26"}
{"commentId":3735640,"authorDomain":"frafox23"}
What are you talking about? Are you mad? You really believe the Republicans who got us in this mess are the ones to get us out. These vile people had control of the government for 8 years and brought this country to the edge of a cliff, and with McCain we will all go over. The Republicans have got us in 2 wars, huge deficits, torture, a corrupted DOJ and you say Obama will make it worse. We have listened to you people for to long. You ideologues have ruined this country now sit down and shut up and let's get back to actually having a country run by competant people. GEEEZ!!!!
{"commentId":3735640,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"frafox23"}
- 2 votes
#37 - Tue Oct 28, 2008 10:55 AM EDT{"commentId":3735829,"authorDomain":"b5611"}
I happened to agree with you. But, I'm sure it was members of both parties who got us into this mess... but sure was heightened by the Bush Administration, no doubt.
{"commentId":3735829,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"b5611"}
{"commentId":3736409,"authorDomain":"thelaughons"}
Well, we see that the Democrats have made it all better in the time they've been in power in Congress, haven't they? Give me a break! You people all need to wake up.
{"commentId":3736409,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"thelaughons"}
- 1 vote
{"commentId":3735789,"authorDomain":"b5611"}
Yes. This is happening to us too. My husband's company has completely stopped offering overtime. So, we're selling everything we can to make some extra money and are both looking for second jobs. We're barely making ends meet right now.
{"commentId":3735789,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"b5611"}
#38 - Tue Oct 28, 2008 11:01 AM EDT{"commentId":3741169,"authorDomain":"JollyRogers"}
Golden Rule of the hourly worker. NEVER assume OT is gonna last forever.
{"commentId":3741169,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"JollyRogers"}
- 1 vote
{"commentId":3735822,"authorDomain":"kpealstrom"}
Yes! I have a long-term temp job until Jan - but am making $450 less a month with no health insurance than I did previously working at a state university...still have to pay into pension funds because of AZ law - even though I am not eligible for a pension as a temp.
{"commentId":3735822,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"kpealstrom"}
#39 - Tue Oct 28, 2008 11:03 AM EDT{"commentId":3750368,"authorDomain":"karavitagina"}
Guess what arizona state retirement is not guaranteed either. As soon as you leave make sure you get out... and put in a private retirment account
{"commentId":3750368,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"karavitagina"}
{"commentId":3735869,"authorDomain":"baja-bandito"}
{"commentId":3735893,"authorDomain":"andrena1"}
Utah must be a great place to live. I don't know anyone this has effected directly. No lost jobs or cut in pay. Come live in Utah it's great.
{"commentId":3735893,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"andrena1"}
#41 - Tue Oct 28, 2008 11:06 AM EDT{"commentId":3735923,"authorDomain":"carolync-1"}
I finally reached the age (65 + 10 months) to have retired last month, but I can't now. I am losing ground b/c utilities, groceries, gas, etc. keep going up but my paycheck does not - not even enough to meet cost of living. Guess I'll be forced to work full time until I drop dead. I am just one major expense away from disaster. Doing all I can to stay in good health and as frugal as possible.
{"commentId":3735923,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"carolync-1"}
#42 - Tue Oct 28, 2008 11:07 AM EDT{"commentId":3736152,"authorDomain":"jjlemay01"}
You sound just like my parents. I feel very badly for you and them. They worked hard all their life, mom a teacher, dad for the army. Now retired and their pension / savings gone.
I wonder where my generation will be in another 20 years? My middle class family of 4 is going backwards and I have a good paying job so does my wife. We have only 6 months of savings left to draw on then what?
Keep up the fight!! Tough times dont last, tough people do. God Bless you Carolyn, and good luck to you and all of our retires. I hope you are able to weather the storm.
{"commentId":3736152,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"jjlemay01"}
- 2 votes
{"commentId":3736236,"authorDomain":"ls5633"}
{"commentId":3736634,"authorDomain":"baja-bandito"}
{"commentId":3740755,"authorDomain":"Dorothyswish"}
I wish there were more of a grass root movement to vote all of them out also. Unfortunately, it is just a minority that will vote against the incumbent. That is exactly what my family plans on doing...no matter who is running on that Congressional ticket...if they are an incumbent...I plan on voting against them. If every one did that...Congress would get a message loud and clear. That is the change we really need.
{"commentId":3740755,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"Dorothyswish"}
- 1 vote
{"commentId":3735962,"authorDomain":"karavitagina"}
Tired! of human governments. Bottom line bailouts are never for the average joe. The average middle american which makes up at least 80% or more of this country NEVER NEVER NEVER ever gets a bailout. We are the ones keeping the economy going but NEVER get the help we need. Sometimes keeping a roof over head with lights and food in our stomachs is beyond a struggle it's heart breaking. I mean the credit for most average joe is shot to hell people lost their home to foreclosure thanks to the greedy lenders/brokers.
How about this how about ever middle american making less the 100,000 a year get all of their debts forgiven and start over. Put the credit card companies out of business they are robbers anyway with their 15% or higher interest rates. Everyone can then start living within their means because thats what the majority of americans want a decent home with electricity, food, clothing and to be able to send their children to a save school. It is possible to live in this country healthy and happy and thats all that matter. Us middle american would just like a break once in our life time. Any family making more then 100,000 needs a grip because if you can't make it on that then your beyond your means count your blessings. It seems like these are the times that the rich get richer and they keep asking us "middle americans" to do more without help!! Stop putting all your trust in human governments.
{"commentId":3735962,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"karavitagina"}
#43 - Tue Oct 28, 2008 11:09 AM EDT{"commentId":3735964,"authorDomain":"andrena1"}
Utah must be a great place to live. I don't know anyone this has effected directly. No lost jobs or cut in pay. Come live in Utah it's great.
{"commentId":3735964,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"andrena1"}
#44 - Tue Oct 28, 2008 11:09 AM EDT{"commentId":3736093,"authorDomain":"missmy05gt"}
I work in the vehicle repossession industry. For my boss, business is GREAT and he consistantly makes about $10,000 PER WEEK! He has few employees (most of whom are paid on commission) and almost no overhead expenses. I am a salaried employee that was forced to take a pay cut from good pay to laughable pay due to fuel costs, and I've been with this company for years. This is a small town with not much opportunity so I had no choice. If he is taxed more with Obama in charge, he will not take the hit...his employees will. He has already demonstrated that. I have been looking for another job since July, but again, small town America is not full of lucrative jobs. And now this job isn't lucrative (for me) anymore. I am considering getting a part time job that is near my 'full time' job. Who needs sleep or relaxation right? But like I said, not much opportunity around here...and the opportunity there is the Illegals get it. It would not surprise me if this town becomes a ghost town in ten years. Hopefully all Americans will realize that with Obama at the helm we will all have to work twice as hard just to eat!
P.S.-Another business that is booming around here are gun stores...people are like wild animals...when they feel threatened the only thing that matters is self-preservation and everyone is on his/her own to survive! Maybe we should start planning a "Million Joe-The-Plumber March" soon...
{"commentId":3736093,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"missmy05gt"}
- 2 votes
#45 - Tue Oct 28, 2008 11:15 AM EDT{"commentId":3736347,"authorDomain":"sjones34668"}
William,
The lot next to my office is rented by a "repo" company. It has been filled for months! There are at least 3-5 tractor trailers filled with cars daily that have been repo'd. They range from Hummers to Fords to Impala's to minivans. We have also seen a lot of RV's and boats! And the sad part is, my ELECTED officials office is less than 3 minutes away. Oh, and BTW the local food bank is on my way to work too. Every morning there are hundreds of people trying to get food. Not homeless people, regular Mom's and Dad's who can not afford the sky rocketing price of necessities!
{"commentId":3736347,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"sjones34668"}
- 1 vote
{"commentId":3736685,"authorDomain":"baja-bandito"}
{"commentId":3737295,"authorDomain":"dd50"}
Sem - he said there weren't a lot of jobs where he is- he'd try over by his other work. Sounds like the rust belt state where most of my family has already left - Ohio. Sad.
Hope the Demos can do better in the next term. They could hardly do worse.
{"commentId":3737295,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"dd50"}
{"commentId":3737359,"authorDomain":"amfocf621"}
The last time dems had a filibuster-proof majority along with a dem president was between 77-81. There policies were unchecked and we suffered for it. Inflation was out of control along with high unemployment. Look at how bad repulicans governed with all three branches of congress. One party in power, no matter who they are, is not good for the country.
{"commentId":3737359,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"amfocf621"}
- 3 votes
{"commentId":3739189,"authorDomain":"kimberlyre2000-1"}
You complain about illegalls but don't have a problem with jobs being off-shored and McCain giving these companies tax breaks! At least the illegalls live and spend their money here. Jobs are off-shored and the money stays, guess what, off-shore. They lay off American workers as opposed to the off-shored workers because we are cheaper to lay off (don't have to give us anything unless they lay off 50% of workforce and then it is only 60 days), UK and Canada get a full years severance. Don't talk before you think about all of the issues.
{"commentId":3739189,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"kimberlyre2000-1"}
{"commentId":3739216,"authorDomain":"kimberlyre2000-1"}
P.S. See my other comment about Joe the Plumber, if you are dumb enough to feel sorry for him......
{"commentId":3739216,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"kimberlyre2000-1"}
{"commentId":3740175,"authorDomain":"amfocf621"}
Kimberly, those laws that allow for jobs to go overseas are the same laws that allow jobs to come here from overseas. Look at all of the Toyota, Nissan and Hyundai plants being built in the U.S.A. Those are American workers taking home American dollars to American homes. If you stop jobs from going overseas then jobs would not come over here as well. It would be a "wash." Also, if we decreased the corporate tax, which is second highest in the world only to Japan, then companies wouldn't go overseas.
{"commentId":3740175,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"amfocf621"}
- 1 vote
{"commentId":3741369,"authorDomain":"JollyRogers"}
You have experience. Have you ever thought of starting your own repo company?
{"commentId":3741369,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"JollyRogers"}
{"commentId":3761033,"authorDomain":"missmy05gt"}
To Kimberly, first, I never said anything about feeling sorry for Joe the Plumber-I referred to a Joe the Plumber March (parody of the Million Man March) on Washington. Pay Attention. Second, I don't have a problem with some jobs being "off-shored" because it will keep those citizens in their country instead of comming here stealing our jobs. Look under the hood of your car and there will be a sticker that says 'Assembled by parts made in Mexico'. I don't have a problem with that because it keeps Mexicans in MEXICO. Third, if you think Mexicans are keeping their money here you are sadly misinformed. They send 80% of everything they make back to their families in MEXICO! Get a clue lady!
{"commentId":3761033,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"missmy05gt"}
- 1 vote
{"commentId":3761641,"authorDomain":"missmy05gt"}
To Sickntired, what are you saying? Do you think people should not pay for financed property? You think the economy is bad now... Here's a little tip, the intrest rate you "qualify" for when you buy a car is based on how many accounts in default that bank has in your market. Thats why it will be different with each bank for the same person. Your credit is the same for each bank. Their accounts are not. Don't listen to the sales pitch or any other reason for it...that is the bottom line. 0% intrest is true for 'well qulified buyers' only which is about 1% or less of everyone in that market. I am paying 7% intrest on my car to make up for those who do not want to pay for their car with the same bank. It's even worse with 2nd rate finance companies. We repo for one who charges 27%! That is because these idiots keep financing people with horrible credit and they know the debtor will default eventually because that is their past experiences. I think you think it is wrong to repo. But you know what, people do this to themselves especially when they ignore the phone calls and letters hoping it will just go away. Sounds like you've been the victim of a repo or foreclosure. I understand bad things happen to good people. But it's when people try and scam or not take responsibility that I say they get what they deserve.
{"commentId":3761641,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"missmy05gt"}
- 1 vote
{"commentId":3761932,"authorDomain":"missmy05gt"}
To DD50, my sincere thanks for reading and paying attention to what you read, unlike other people here. It really irritates that most people don't pay attention but want to be heard. Semper-Fi and Kimberly should hook up.
{"commentId":3761932,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"missmy05gt"}
{"commentId":3817711,"authorDomain":"sjones34668"}
It really irritates that most people don't pay attention but want to be heard.
Please re-read my comments.
{"commentId":3817711,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"sjones34668"}
{"commentId":3736174,"authorDomain":"tribalgirl64"}
Why would this happen right before an election? Think about it. People keep talking about Obama's plan for taxing businesses who make over $250,000 like it has happened already. For one, it's income or capital gains and two, it is on the portion of money over $250,000. As usual, there will be credits to write off a portion of that tax. Obama's plan didn't do this to people; it's happening now and Bush is still in office. Smaller businesses that work on a cash basis and do not depend on credit to do business would thrive if consumers would get over their fears. We still have to purchase the necessities of life. If we are conscientious about where we buy and what we buy, the American people could make a stand on this issue. Purchase from locally owned stores, buy as much American goods as possible. Quit feeding other countries and quit letting only a few control the money. I recently bought a space heater from an American company. I got it home and the owners manual was misplaced so I looked for it on te internet; couldn't find the item. Come to find out, the reason I couldn't find it was because the item was under the name of the company in China that made the product for this company. All the American company really does is handle the distribution fo the product; they proudly had their company structure and their financials listed n the web, but the actual products are made by a company in China. If regulations need to be put in place to keep manufacturing in the US, it needs to be done now. Instead of companies in the US just being "paper pushers", they need to be actual producers. The 'paper pushing" needs to stop! They are the ones that created this whole mess because they have nothing to stand behind their paper. Imagine how many American jobs that $800billion could provide. This was supposed to help people keep their homes, right? How many average people have been helped? I haven't heard of single individual that has received benefit from this action. We don't have more jobs; we don't have the ability to pay, and so it's not helping the big banks either. They don't see that the average American is the key to successful business. They shouldn't have bailed the banks and mortgage companies out; they should have given the American people a way to earn the money to make their payments.
{"commentId":3736174,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"tribalgirl64"}
#46 - Tue Oct 28, 2008 11:19 AM EDT{"commentId":3736271,"authorDomain":"ls5633"}
{"commentId":3736218,"authorDomain":"nbetterton"}
I am a student and my husband works in methane gas. They sometimes have to drive two hours to get to jobs. He used to get paid one way for the drive time, now they aren't paying him ANY drive time. He drives four hours a day and works ten, he only gets paid for ten.
I am thankful that he had a job right now, it is just hard to see him work so hard and get cheated out of those hours.
{"commentId":3736218,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"nbetterton"}
#47 - Tue Oct 28, 2008 11:21 AM EDT{"commentId":3736219,"authorDomain":"gary-14"}
If anyone should take a pay-cut it's the politicians. They can point fingers all they want but all of them have dropped the ball. No matter which side of the isle your on. They like to tout proficiency reports. Well that shoe should be on their foot. If they want a raise they should be able to show merit.
{"commentId":3736219,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"gary-14"}
- 1 vote
#48 - Tue Oct 28, 2008 11:21 AM EDT{"commentId":3736524,"authorDomain":"ls5633"}
{"commentId":3736232,"authorDomain":"phila6750"}
This is becoming a familiar story. Personnally, my commissions are off about 50% from the last couple years. This leads to less purchases on my part, a snowball effect for the local economy. I agree with some that we should continue to do business as usual. I just don't have the buying power that I used to.The panic really doesn't sway me much. I didn't have a fortune invested, so I have actually lost nothing except MY STANDARD OF LIVING. Time to rebuild a real economy based on durable goods and new technology, not on criminals selling products that don't really exist (CDS).
{"commentId":3736232,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"phila6750"}
- 1 vote
#49 - Tue Oct 28, 2008 11:21 AM EDT{"commentId":3736427,"authorDomain":"timmeh5564"}
With Obama's incentives of $3000 for hiring, which won't work or taxing anyone over $250,000, which according to Paul Krugman, really means $182,000, expect more of smaller or no paychecks. If I have to adjust my expenses to make up for higher taxes, then I'm going to let people go. Way to go Obama!
{"commentId":3736427,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"timmeh5564"}
- 1 vote
#50 - Tue Oct 28, 2008 11:30 AM EDT{"commentId":3739407,"authorDomain":"kimberlyre2000-1"}
Do you hear yourself? You are telling me that I shouldn't want Obama's tax plan, because it hurts you. But you are going to save you and your family and lay off me and my family? That doesn't make sense, I guess I should trust Timmeh-414251 to distribute taxes that guess what "everyone pays". Stop complaining about yourself and realize you are complaining you don't want to do your share, therefore, I have to pick up your slack? I paid taxes at a higher percentage than guess who, Cindy McCain..
{"commentId":3739407,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"kimberlyre2000-1"}
{"commentId":3736434,"authorDomain":"hunter-5740"}
I took a part time job at Sears to help off-set the college tution I'm paying plus other bills. The nights are long watching people walk by, and we get ripped by managment for no sales and no one buing extened warrenties. Most people that come in but only what they Absolutly need and can barely afford that. The middle class is being crushed by a mess we didn't profit from but and being faulted for.
{"commentId":3736434,"threadId":"401490","contentId":"2045675","authorDomain":"hunter-5740"}
#51 - Tue Oct 28, 2008 11:30 AM EDT{"canLink":false,"threadId":"401490","isPrivate":false}
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