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Ballot security could be issue in Minn. recount

Wed Nov 5, 2008 8:29 AM EST
us-news, politics, associated-press, senate, minnesota, al-franken, democrat-barack-obama, norm-coleman, minnesota-senate, democrat-al-franken, republican-norm-coleman, louis-county, hennepin-county, anoka-county, one-senate
Patrick Condon, Associated Press
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showing 1 of 10 photos
<p>U.S. Sen. Norm Coleman, right, address well wishers at Republican Headquarters, Tuesday, Nov. 4, 2008 in Bloomington, Minn. Joining Sen. Coleman is join on stage with his son Jacob, left and wife Laurie, center. (AP Photo/Tom Olmscheid)</p>

U.S. Sen. Norm Coleman, right, address well wishers at Republican Headquarters, Tuesday, Nov. 4, 2008 in Bloomington, Minn. Joining Sen. Coleman is join on stage with his son Jacob, left and wife Laurie, center. (AP Photo/Tom Olmscheid)

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WEST ST PAUL — St. Louis County keeps election ballots in the courthouse attic. Anoka County keeps them locked in the basement. Hennepin County relies on its cities to keep ballots safe.

The lack of a uniform standard for counties safeguarding ballots after the election could come into play when those votes are recounted in Minnesota's U.S. Senate race.

The campaigns have been negotiating neutral standards for ballot security after an unsuccessful court challenge Saturday by Republican incumbent Norm Coleman to halt the counting of 32 absentee ballots from Minneapolis. Coleman's campaign questioned the ballots' legitimacy, saying it was told the ballots had been left for several days in the car of a Minneapolis election official.

A city spokesman said the ballots were never unaccounted for, and the Coleman campaign later said it accepted those assurances. But with Coleman and Democrat Al Franken separated by a little more than 200 votes out of nearly 3 million cast, ballot integrity remains an issue.

"There have been some concerning reports about strange things happening in the context of this recount," Republican Gov. Tim Pawlenty said. He said it's "important that the process be locked down and secure."

The last large-scale recount of a statewide election occurred in Washington state's 2004 gubernatorial race, which the Republican candidate initially appeared to win before losing to the Democrat after two recounts. In that case, vote totals changed several times upon discoveries of piles of uncounted ballots in several counties.

"It was an area where we thought we had good procedures in place," said Nick Handy, Washington's state elections director. "But the intense scrutiny of a razor-thin statewide recount really just brings everything to light."

Handy said overlooked ballots were the result of human error, but the oversights became a main focus of Republican Dino Rossi's unsuccessful lawsuit to overturn the election results after the second recount erased his lead. Handy said the Washington Legislature has since passed reforms to toughen the standards for handling ballots.

In Minnesota, rules enforced by the secretary of state require the municipalities that hold the elections to keep the ballots secure "until all recounts have been completed and until the time for contest of election has expired." There's no standard procedures for doing so.

Democratic Secretary of State Mark Ritchie sent a memo late Monday to all county auditors and election administrators urging any municipality with control over ballots to take certain safety steps such as making sure ballots are stored under lock and key.

Ritchie also recommended officials search their offices to make sure they've collected all paper and electronic material related to votes and voter registrations.

It's been standard practice at Minnesota county offices to collect and store ballots in a secure place. In St. Louis County, that's in a room in the attic of the courthouse; only the county elections director and the county auditor have keys. In Anoka County, only one key exists to the basement room where the ballots are held. In tiny Cottonwood County, the county auditor keeps the ballot locked in a vault in his office.

"No one is monkeying around with this. They're taking this dead serious," said Paul Tynjala, St. Louis County's director of elections. "The last thing anyone wants is someone to contend the integrity of the ballots was somehow disturbed."

In Hennepin County, the state's largest, it would be "logistically difficult" to keep all the ballots in one place because of the number of voters, deputy elections manager Kurt Hoffman said. Instead, the ballots remain in the custody of the cities where the votes were cast. "There's an understanding between the cities and the county that they're going to keep them secured," Hoffman said.

After the weekend flap over the Minneapolis absentees, the Coleman campaign proposed to the Franken campaign a uniform set of standards for securing ballots based on the system established by Stearns County.

Among other provisions, Stearns County requires ballots remain under lock and key; that only two keys to the room exist; that any time county staff enters the room, at least two people must be present; that a log be kept noting why and when any workers entered the room; and that representatives of Senate campaigns be allowed to keep "visual guard" outside the ballot storage room.

The Franken campaign suggested several modifications. By Monday afternoon, the campaigns appeared to be close to an agreement on ballot security procedures.

© 2008 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.
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  • Public Discussion (44)
DragonWoman

Awe, bummer, and I was feelin good.

Hell I still feel good!!!!

Yeah OBAMA/BIDEN!!!

  • 4 votes
Reply#1 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 8:46 AM EST
Ben Grimm

It ain't over til it's over.  That last precinct is in a county where Franken is leading 2 to 1.   Most or all of the 762 vote lead could evaporate rather quickly. 

  • 4 votes
#1.1 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 9:09 AM EST
Strath3303

I look forward to seeing the results.  There definitely needs to be a recount regardless of the results. 

  • 2 votes
#1.2 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 9:35 AM EST
Ben Grimm

In the final un-recounted tally Franken is down by 727.

  • 2 votes
#1.3 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 10:11 AM EST
Ben Grimm

CNN, oddly, disagrees with the MN SoS and has him down by 572.  Insanity.

  • 2 votes
#1.4 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 10:15 AM EST
MalamuteMan

What effect do you thing Barkley had??? If he were not in the race, would that have helped or hurt Franken???

    #1.5 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 12:27 PM EST
    Ben Grimm

    If you believe the exit polls, Barkley took more votes from Franken.   But he had higher levels of support out-state, which would have traditionally gone to Coleman.  It's a crap shoot -- both campaigns were very negative and drove voters away.  It would be nice if we had run-off elections, or instant run-off ballots.

    • 1 vote
    #1.6 - Thu Nov 6, 2008 8:54 AM EST
    Reply
    cyan412000

    sad day for minnesota...coleman is a boob and i lived in minnesota for 30 years...

    • 4 votes
    Reply#2 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 9:16 AM EST
    wonders4

    Franken is the boob who wasn't even a good comedian

      #2.1 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 10:48 AM EST
      Tim--

      Is this a thread about "boobs"?

      I thought Newsvine had its own Adult section for talk about boobies.

      • 2 votes
      #2.2 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 10:51 AM EST
      3sheets2thewind

      Speaking of boobs Ms. Bachmann won her seat.

        #2.3 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 5:49 PM EST
        Reply
        bluecollarbytes

        Plus Franken might still end up in court, having failed to win otherwise.

        He's gotta be feeling down right now, having had to move back to a cold state he shunned for decades, only to end up as the same quasi-humorist he was before.

        • 5 votes
        Reply#3 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 9:19 AM EST
        merzzzz

        Minnesotans - which I am one, will be better served with Senator Coleman. I am not a supporter of either candidate or a political ideologue, but the choice was a no brainer. Just another example of the DFL voting for anyone who holds their party designation, even a person as unqualified for this job such as Mr. Frankin.

        • 5 votes
        Reply#4 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 9:24 AM EST
        Uncommon Sensibility

        I met Coleman, and I was one of the little people in the background.  I saw him to be a surly child with a Diva complex.  Everybody in my office was a die-hard Republican, but even we didn't like him by 2 to 1.  I haven't met Al Franken, but I am truly bothered that Minnesota is going to be represented by Coleman in Washington.  Put a Mr. Yuck sticker on Normy for me.  If there is a benevolent God in Heaven, please let the counters be wrong . . . ?

        • 3 votes
        Reply#5 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 9:44 AM EST
        merzzzz

        UC, no doubt given the passion of you post that your observaton is most likely correct, however, do we judge our candidates on their personalities or their effectiveness to represent us?

        • 2 votes
        #5.1 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 9:53 AM EST
        Sgt. Pepper

        It seems that more and more voters vote depending on a candidate's personality rather than their effectiveness to lead. If Franken somehow wins the recount, I happen to think it would be because of his personality rather than specific issues.

        That being said, I'm still rooting for Franken during the recount.

        • 2 votes
        #5.2 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 10:40 AM EST
        Spikegary

        Beauty Contest Mentality.

        And Al Franken can't ge this personal income taxes right?  What will he do in D.C. with the really big bucks?

        • 1 vote
        #5.3 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 10:48 AM EST
        Reply
        RogerM

        Finally Minnesota gets something right, even if it is close.

        Franken is a hater, kind of like the radio announcer out in San Fran that said that Joe the Plumber had to die for asking Obama a question that all Americans were asking.

        For Franken to even be close shows how misguided this country is getting, thinking that the government OWES them, that Democrats are the great healers, although they are the ones that brought up race this whole election, and that they are going to take care of people, even though Democrats were the slave Party and still keep minorities in poverty to this day.

        • 5 votes
        Reply#6 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 10:00 AM EST
        merzzzz

        Roger, you are right, Minnesota has never seen a negative campaign like the one Mr. Frankin ran.

        • 3 votes
        #6.1 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 10:04 AM EST
        Ben Grimm

        There was just as much hate coming from Coleman and the NRSCC.

        • 4 votes
        #6.2 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 10:10 AM EST
        Reply
        jamiewb

        squeaking past the former comedian

        Does that mean that he's no longer funny?

        • 2 votes
        Reply#7 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 10:03 AM EST
        caroaber

        This ushers in the Not-Me decade.

        I'm vicariously thrilled that this dilettante Franken was seen for the poser he is.

        He can go back to doing Stuart Smalley in his nightclub act. Because he's good enough...

        • 1 vote
        #7.1 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 10:17 AM EST
        merzzzz

        I am sure he will give up his apartment in Minnapolis and go back to NY.

        • 2 votes
        #7.2 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 10:23 AM EST
        Spikegary

        Does that mean that he's no longer funny?

        I don't remember him being terrible funny to begin with-I remember him from SNL, but I didn't think he was hilarious then, either.  I'm a funny person too, but I don't think the qualifies me to be a Senator......

        • 2 votes
        #7.3 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 10:50 AM EST
        Reply
        BD in WI

        THE AP JUST "UNCALLED THE RACE."

        Let's see what happens

        • 4 votes
        Reply#8 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 10:37 AM EST
        Sgt. Pepper

        If the Republican wins, expect for Dean Barkley of the Independence Party to take most of the blame. I'm surprised Obama didn't take a final trip to Minnesota before the polls closed to help out Franken get out the vote.

        • 3 votes
        Reply#9 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 10:44 AM EST
        Christian Areas

        I'm guessing he didn't want to be closely associated with Franken.

        • 4 votes
        #9.1 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 10:48 AM EST
        Sgt. Pepper

        Maybe, but Obama actually did make a surprise radio message on WCCO Minn radio:

        “I will say that your candidate in Minnesota, Al Franken, is going to be an important part of a coalition that brings about change. He’s really, I think, in this to fight for working families. I’m looking forward to seeing him serve in the Senate.

        “And if people are looking for fundamental change over the next eight years, then I think an Obama-Biden ticket, Al Franken in the Senate, is going to be the best answer for working families all across the state.” (Source)

        I'm sure that if he would have visited Franken, the election would be different.

        • 1 vote
        #9.2 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 11:16 AM EST
        Reply
        Adam Kemp

        Does Minnesota use electronic voting machines? If so, then I fail to see the point of a recount. If they get a different answer then someone needs to be prosecuted for election tampering. This is why we should not have electronic voting without paper trails. Recounts should always count paper, by hand, in public.

        • 1 vote
        Reply#10 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 11:03 AM EST
        merzzzz

        Most ballots are the paper ballot with a fill in in the circle vote that are then scanned. Those in the know of the Minnesota system call it a very clean count. Likely that not much will change. Certainly not 500 votes.

        • 1 vote
        #10.1 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 11:14 AM EST
        Reply
        twosage

        While I don't think Franken would be a particularly effective Senator, I'm hoping he wins to bolster the Dem's numbers (and to get Coleman out, who is a grade A twit).

        Plus, he would certainly liven up C-Span2!

          Reply#11 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 11:09 AM EST
          jamiewb

          Plus, he would certainly liven up C-Span2!

          That's my main worry. His bitter, sarcastic attitude seems like it would only be disruptive and increase partisanship. Zingers aren't exactly useful when it comes to making laws.

          • 1 vote
          #11.1 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 11:19 AM EST
          merzzzz

          Another liberal name caller. Go through these postings and see if most of the detracting coments are personal slurs not comments of substance. Real nice. I hope you don't govern with this intolerance and poor judgment that you have emonstrated time and time again. This isn't CHANGE, its the same old thing.

            #11.2 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 11:44 AM EST
            twosage

            After John McCain's campaign literally devolved into one of name-calling... "Redistributer!"... I don't know if you should go there.  And I can't help but laugh at you, merzzzz.  In the very next comment, you called Franken a loser.  Namecalling sure is fun when it's the you doing the calling, isn't it?  But because I think you're just bitter about the results, I won't go further.

            SUBSTANCE:  Norm Coleman never deserved that seat and only won it because of Paul Wellstone's death.  He ran an incredibly negative campaign that tried to destroy Al Franken's character (regardless of who Franken is, it was not issues based).  He clearly has ethical inadequacies, and is by all accounts I've ever heard, including on this seed, an unpleasant and self-centered man.

            Al Franken has a lot of problems, and he is an exceptionally partisan person, but he is good guy.  I doubt he would be a particularly effective Senator, but I would have said that about Hillary Clinton, as well.  She is extremely partisan and polarizing, but seems to be a good rep for her state.

              #11.3 - Thu Nov 6, 2008 7:36 AM EST
              jamiewb

              So at this point, Minnesota should probably just say "Ya know what, we really don't have anybody who is going to  be helpful in DC, so we'll just sit this one out. We'll try to find somebody better next time".

                #11.4 - Thu Nov 6, 2008 10:37 AM EST
                Reply
                Gulliver Swift

                I don't know whether Franken would be an effective Senator or not. He did a fairly good job as a talk radio host and that strikes me as as difficult and demanding gig. He's a Harvard graduate and it wouldn't be the first time someone transitioned from entertainment to politics.

                Senators have staffs that do a lot of the research work on issues for them. Senators function at a higher and conceptual level most of the time. Being a Senator isn't like being a comedian but it sure seems that both professions are a bit of performance art.

                • 2 votes
                Reply#12 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 11:31 AM EST
                Whacked Man

                This is the funniest Franken has ever been. Loser.

                • 1 vote
                Reply#13 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 12:18 PM EST
                merzzzz

                Bravo, its a part he doesn't have to act for, he's a natural.

                  #13.1 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 2:05 PM EST
                  Reply
                  USMC4Truth

                  Hopefully Nasser Kazeminy will funnel Minnesota lots of money, just like he did for Norm Coleman.

                    Reply#14 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 1:13 PM EST
                    merzzzz

                    Unsubstantiated litigious comment, Al will lose his Manhattan condo for that one. Most likely cost him this race as well.

                    • 2 votes
                    #14.1 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 1:25 PM EST
                    USMC4Truth

                    http://harpers.org/archive/2008/10/hbc-90003661 Let me guess, Al wrote that article too right?

                      #14.2 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 1:33 PM EST
                      merzzzz

                      Coleman sues Franken campaign over ads

                      • 1 vote
                      #14.3 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 1:59 PM EST
                      Reply
                      merzzzz

                       See startribune

                        Reply#15 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 2:06 PM EST
                        merzzzz

                          Reply#16 - Wed Nov 5, 2008 2:08 PM EST
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