GOP officials say Dems put agenda ahead of country

But no will have a job. But hey thats ok we can live off the government.

Well not with that attitude. Have you ever had a deep, dark feeling that government could ever do something right? Don't you get your mail delivered 6 days a week?

Don't you get your mail delivered 6 days a week?

And how has The USPO managed its affairs? It IS BANKRUPT. No one argues that our post office does an outstanding job. What they have been criticizing is the fact that everything the Gubmint runs, it is teetering or completely bankrupt. How long before the gubmint bankrupts this disaster? I wager in 10 years it will be in the red and running in the red for ever more. The CBO in 1965 said medicare (patrs A and B) will be running around $12 billion/yr by 1990, its 25th anniversary. The reality? Around $107billion. Now? Just around $66 TRILLION. WOW!!!!!! Look out America!

They are stressed, but they are still here, and not charging the ridiculous rates UPS or FedEx does. We could change the whole course of these things with a little extra funding, but the only thing Republicans hate more than bad government is good government.

With Tom DeLay and Newt Gingrich and W. and company, they have been actively subverting government programs for decades; with a little TLC, we can have them all back to full strength.

The $66 Trillion listed above was Medicare's total unfunded liability.

Well at least Obama and the Democrats are TRYING to pay for the Health Care bill, we have W. and the Republicans who added Medicare Part D without any effort to pay for it because they wanted an election-year issue. All we need is a little more tax revenue, and problem solved.

Don't you get your mail delivered 6 days a week?

Sometimes.

Well at least Obama and the Democrats are TRYING to pay for the Health Care bill,

Bull@!$%#, we have Obama and the democrats trying to move this country into a complete and total dictatorship. Or are you on the record as stating you support the government being able to force Americans to purchase health care?

Well let's see... if you don't buy health insurance, and unless we intend to leave you dying on the street if you're hit by a car, you pose a significant financial risk to the rest of us, and it's not fair to have the rest of us shoulder your burden for free. We already force people to pay for national security, don't we?

A dictatorship thru a national health care plan? I might suppose you think all of the Western world are dictatorships, then, because they have even stronger health care plans.

The Republicans are merely whining and sniveling because they didn't bring home the bacon for their corporate masters. They'd cheerfully run Soylent Green factories if it meant fat contributions and trips to exotic places paid for by their CEO cronies.

Bull@!$%#, we have Obama and the democrats trying to move this country into a complete and total dictatorship. Or are you on the record as stating you support the government being able to force Americans to purchase health care?

Nothing like a fat lie to send this debate forward. Name ONE rule or piece of legislation that gives any proof towards your assertion of "complete and total dictatorship." And when you start slobbering about "forcing Americans to purchase health care," remember that for decades we've all been forced to purchase auto insurance, and many people are forced to buy flood insurance.

Instead of squalling and bawling about Obama's "dictatorship," you should spend a few years living under a real dictatorship, say in Myanmar or the Central African Republic. Then come back and tell us how similar the US under Obama is to those regimes. Or can you not find them on the map until Beck gives you a hint on his magic chalkboard?

Bull@!$%#, we have Obama and the democrats trying to move this country into a complete and total dictatorship.

Any facts to back your hysteria?

Again:

Do you believe the United States Government should have the right to FORCE Americans to purchase health insurance or face the risk of criminal prosecution?

Or are you on the record as stating you support the government being able to force Americans to purchase health care?

ABSOLUTELY I'm in favor of forcing Americans to purchase health care coverage. ALL Americans!

Sure I do.. state governments require me to buy auto insurance.. and they do with you too..

Dylan923

Again:

Do you believe the United States Government should have the right to FORCE Americans to purchase health insurance or face the risk of criminal prosecution?

Dylan, we already have a similar "get insurance or pay a fine" program here in Massachusetts, and no one is facing criminal prosecution.

Do you think I should have to pay for your irresponsibility? Suppose you get meningitis tomorrow with no health insurance... who's gonna pay?

But no will have a job. But hey thats ok we can live off the government.

We don't have jobs because the private sector has failed.

What they have been criticizing is the fact that everything the Gubmint runs, it is teetering or completely bankrupt.

The governent contracts many things to the private sector. It is private sector corruption, fraud, and inefficiency that rips off the tax payer.

Conservatives want you to hate and blame America, they do not want you to hold the private sector accountable.

ABSOLUTELY I'm in favor of forcing Americans to purchase health care coverage. ALL Americans!

Ok then...so dont complain when people stop trying to debate with words and start 'debating' with actions. Liberty and choice will NOT be tread upon.

Sure I do.. state governments require me to buy auto insurance.. and they do with you too..

You have an option NOT to drive, but to mandate a purchuse simply because you LIVE is wrong.

Lmao!

Ditto, Michael & MTH.

The Greed Over People party is simply doing what it does best - shill for Big Industry.

We already have Death Panels courtesy of the Insurance industry and the GOP.

http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2009/08/palinapproved-death-panels.html

Ok then...so dont complain when people stop trying to debate with words and start 'debating' with actions. Liberty and choice will NOT be tread upon.

What an utterly silly and immature perspective! If I am to be held accountable for your CHOICE, then I have a right to use the law to mitigate or limit that choice. If you choose not to buy health care coverage, betting on perhaps the fact that you're under 30, in apparently good health and not a sky-diver, then sign an affidavit stating that you will reject all attempts by society to provide you medical assistance in the event that you lose your bet, and maybe we can talk.

But then, no, we really can't, because you CHOOSE to live in America, a land where our social values demand that we provide at least basic health care to everyone regardless of their ability to pay. So, you're willingness to bet on your own health places the tax-payer at risk.

This tax-payer says, nope. Pay for yours, I'll pay for mine, and if we ALL pay, there's a greater chance that we'll all pay less in the long run.

If I have a accident and I cannot afford my own healthcare then I do not EXPECT others to pay for me. Nor should I feel I should have to pay for others if they cannot afford theirs.

No insurance, too bad...so sad, best of luck in the next life. No one should have to pay for your mistakes.

That said, on the other side of the coin, no one has the RIGHT or AUTHORITY to force ANYONE to buy anything. If they chose not to obtain coverage then it isnt my problem.

Do you think I should have to pay for your irresponsibility?

First, I'm not irresponsible, I'm merely contending the government needs to stay out of forcing Americans to purchase anything.

ABSOLUTELY I'm in favor of forcing Americans to purchase health care coverage. ALL Americans!

And what happens to those Americans who can't AFFORD to purchase insurance? What happens to the millions of Americans without work or those who are homeless, what should be done to them if they honestly cannot afford to purchase coverage?

What you EXPECT and what you FEEL are irrelevant DirtyRelic, someone WILL pay for you because we don't all have the attitude of an indestructible 20-year old; you WILL be admitted into an ER if you're still alive and you WILL consume the time and resources of the staff. Who's gonna pay?

We ABSOLUTELY have the right to force people to chip-in, your freedom isn't free. Roads, streetlights, weather satellites, power grids, national security, the Internet... these things cost money. I don't care how Libertarian you are, freedom isn't free.

We ABSOLUTELY have the right to force people to chip-in

The supreme court will rule upon this soon enough I suspect. However it's best to becareful what anyone tries to force upon anyone. The results can be volatile.

That said, on the other side of the coin, no one has the RIGHT or AUTHORITY to force ANYONE to buy anything. If they chose not to obtain coverage then it isnt my problem.

Do you have a Driver's license? You paid for it if you do, Did you WANT to pay for it? Do you have car insurance? Do you have liability insurance for/at you place of business? Do you have a professional license?

No one has the right or authority to force anyone to buy anything... What a naive concept and dangerous concept.

The right of government to tax is well-established, DirtyRelic, Republicans have been trying to argue along similar lines for Medicare and Social Security for years, but it hasn't gone anywhere. This country doesn't exactly pass the charity plate around to fund the military, either.

The results can be volatile? It's a chance I'm willing to take.

More Than Happy

It's a chance I'm willing to take.

...but I am not, hence the nature of the debate.

Another $1.2 Trillion in debt (probably twice that amount).

Are you concerned about the National Debt?
I looked at Obama's Federal Budget for 2010, Tables S-4 and S-14, and found that the Budget "Deficits" are estimated to total $8.549 Trillion over the next 10 years, but the National Debt will increase by $13.304 Trillion over that same 10 years, and will increase to $23.283 Trillion in 2019. THIS IS OBAMA'S OWN BUDGET PROJECTION.

Even that is totally understated because he's estimated that the interest rate on the National Debt will average only about 2.4%, but historically (and under Clinton) the interest rate has been about 6.5%, and it got as high as 8.27% under Carter.

If you put a realistic historical interest rate in Obama's budget, and he doesn't increase taxes by $7 Trillion over 10 years (which would devastate the economy), the National Debt could be over $30 TRILLION in 10 years, and the MONTHLY interest could be over $160 Billion, (It averaged only $31 Billion under Bush and $28 Billion under Clinton). That would require an increase in taxes of about $1,500 per MONTH for a typical family of 4 JUST TO PAY THE INCREASED INTEREST ON THE NATIONAL DEBT.

This out-of-control spending will bankrupt this Country and make our children and grandchildren slaves to debt as long as they live.

IS ANYBODY LISTENING?????

Another $1.2 Trillion in debt (probably twice that amount).

Are you concerned about the National Debt?
I looked at Obama's Federal Budget for 2010, Tables S-4 and S-14, and found that the Budget "Deficits" are estimated to total $8.549 Trillion over the next 10 years, but the National Debt will increase by $13.304 Trillion over that same 10 years, and will increase to $23.283 Trillion in 2019. THIS IS OBAMA'S OWN BUDGET PROJECTION.

Even that is totally understated because he's estimated that the interest rate on the National Debt will average only about 2.4%, but historically (and under Clinton) the interest rate has been about 6.5%, and it got as high as 8.27% under Carter.

If you put a realistic historical interest rate in Obama's budget, and he doesn't increase taxes by $7 Trillion over 10 years (which would devastate the economy), the National Debt could be over $30 TRILLION in 10 years, and the MONTHLY interest could be over $160 Billion, (It averaged only $31 Billion under Bush and $28 Billion under Clinton). That would require an increase in taxes of about $1,500 per MONTH for a typical family of 4 JUST TO PAY THE INCREASED INTEREST ON THE NATIONAL DEBT.

This out-of-control spending will bankrupt this Country and make our children and grandchildren slaves to debt as long as they live.

IS ANYBODY LISTENING?????

ROY WILSON-336103

I hear you loud and clear.

the voters voted for change in 2008. yes, the gop won in va and nj as far as the governorship. but they lost two congressional seats. they did not need to loose twso more congressional seats. that hurts them, assists the dems. as far as spending, where was the outcry when bush was in office? the gop spent as if money would last forever, and part of the national debt is from their spending, which spiraled out of control

Do you have a Driver's license? You paid for it if you do, Did you WANT to pay for it? Do you have car insurance? Do you have liability insurance for/at you place of business? Do you have a professional license?

Yes we are forced to have insurance if we drive. Why not force car insurance companies to pay for my oil changes, tune ups and everything else? Ah yes the premiums would skyrocket. Why not "force" Americans to pay for ALL non catastrophic health care and save the insurance for catastrophes? And why should I pay for a right? IS there now a price to be paid for citizenship? That's insane.

Uh, OOOOOkay...

Well at least Obama and the Democrats are TRYING to pay for the Health Care bill,

Not really. I think they intend to extort it from us taxpayers.

Or are you on the record as stating you support the government being able to force Americans to purchase health care?

ABSOLUTELY I'm in favor of forcing Americans to purchase health care coverage. ALL Americans!

How are you going to force it? Let's go back to some things covered. First of all, states may force people who drive to buy auto insurance. It is a condition to drive not to merely exist. It is also a power delegated to the states and to the people. As to Massechussetts and what they require, it is indeed legal for them to do so as that is one of those undelegated powers reserved to the states and to the people. On the other hand it is not legal for the federal govenment to force somebody to buy either a commercial product or something from them. It is also not legal for the government to levy a tax on somebody for choosing not to buy something nor can the commerce clause empower the feds to fine somebody for simply existing and doing nothing. There are two US Supreme Court cases where the Courts threw out federal law where the commerce clause was abused. Fairly popular laws too. There was a violence against women ruling and a gun free school zone near schools ruling where both were reversed. Those laws were fine if a state passed them but were not among the Federal governments enumerated powers. You can bet that the mandates at least and likely more of any final health care bill will be taken into federal court at the district level and the law stayed until the USSC makes a final decision on the matter dealing with its own precedence above and the 9th and 10th ammendments.

I'm no lawyer, but I'd bet that even if all that you say is accurate, there are ways in which the fed could incentivise the states to enact such requirements.

The Republican party accuses "liberals" of putting an agenda ahead of the interests of the nation?

I guess when the Republicans wanted to place social security in the hands of Wall Street they only had the best of intentions then, right?

Can you imagine the fallout if we had let the G.O.P. have their way??

It's been said before but bears repeating: "Thank God McCain lost!"

The Republican party accuses "liberals" of putting an agenda ahead of the interests of the nation?

Why yes they did. Do you remember the libs politicising the war on terror for their gain? How quickly we forget that by dems demonizing our war on terror they were attempting to get votes. This is worse by far than anything the libs can accsue the GOP of doing. Putting our soldier's life at risk just so you can gain votes from antiwar activists is just plain wrong.

The results of the recent gubanatorial elections in NJ and VA have been ignored. I am an independent so I do not care about parties but I'll tell you this - the Democrats have nailed themselves into their own coffin.

They can not say they were not warned. It's OK with me too. I never wanted Obama as the President. He'll be voted out next term and things will go back to semi normal.

The blame is smack dab in the middle of the Democrats. It's a shame too because rich people should pay more in taxes but Obama even back tracked on that.

How do gubernatorial elections, with exit polling results showing that those voters weren't thinking about Obama in their vote "nail Dems in their own coffins?" Makes no sense, unless you are a Repub looking for anything to feel positive about.

More Than Happy; and I ask you.....at what cost? The Democrats rammed this down our throats, and mark this day....you liberals will change your mind once the collection plate begins to pass around. But, they'll have you right where they want you then. Pay up, or else! If they wanted to do this, then allow the Conservative to opt out of the program....both in participation and in paying for it. But the states still have to pay or I should say each states' tax payers still have to pay, even if they opt out. Sounds like oppressing my freedom of choice to me? And that's OK with you folks?

or I should say each states' tax payers still have to pay, even if they opt out. Sounds like oppressing my freedom of choice to me?

I have to pay for wars that I don't agree with, for schools and childrens' benefits I will never use, as I am childless.

I dare any governor to opt-out. They will be opted out of a job in the next election.

1.37

Ummm....the "libs" politicized terror?? You're kidding, right?

I guess the "libs" whipped out the multi colored terror alerts whenever it could help Bushco, huh?

Get real....

GOP 'officials' say all kinds of ignorant things....their problem is, they live in a different 'country' than most of Americans....they're the business party, and they make no apologies for that....the people are defined as taxpayers at best....sentient beings, never...

Sounds like oppressing my freedom of choice to me?

Rita, if we had true freedom of choice with health care, we'd choose not to get sick or injured in the first place. But @!$%# happens, doesn't it? If your 'choice' is to simply be irresponsible and ignore the financial risk you at which you place society, it's society's right to get a few extra dollars from you; you're not exempt.

The only place where you'll every find absolute freedom of choice is on a deserted island. Even there you might find that you have to reach 'agreements' with the monkeys over the food and the komodo dragons over whether or not your butt is food!

Absolute freedom of choice is usually available only when choices are limited.

The Democrats rammed this down our throats,

No, the majority wanted and needed reform. They way our system works, majority rules & we voted a year ago for president w/health care reform as an issue remember?

1.42

To add to that comment:

"Rummy and the amazing technicolor terror alerts!"

Rummy and the amazing technicolor terror alerts!"

...now, there was an 'agenda'.....war wins republican votes....700 billion yearly to the pentagon...now, there's an agenda....?? or, have we made so very many enemies that we NEED such a military ?? agendas....

700 billion taxpayer dollars, going to the war machine....and nobody's home to complain on behalf of those just trying to stay healthy.... enough to be productive and feed that war machine????? Where's the down-side?? WAR WAR WAR...still in the mix...I'm hardly thinking our demise would be brought about because of health care.... so long as we're voting for war...none of it matters...live by the proverbial sword....yaddah,yaddah...

BTW, the AP, parroting the goper lines does not a reality make...

I will make a mental note..again...of this behaviour though...you can't trust the AP with the truth....it's all conjecture and speculation....bad job of reporting... good job, keeping your job, Mr. author of BS.....I'm sure of that....

Conservatives have suffered the biggest embarrassment in American political history with the advent of the Bushco administration.

The bigger insult is to the nation and our military with the manner in wich our military men and women were used as pawns in a domestic political power grab by a president with a proven inability to lead.

To add to that biggest insult, conservatives now attack our newly elected ( legitimately ) president with total disregard for the greedy, unprincipled assault that we have suffered at the hands of the G.O.P.

It will be many election cycles till the G.O.P. regains the White House.

...never forget, AZpaddy...

Less government control means MORE industry control, more faceless bureaucrats in ivory towers telling us what kind of health care we can have. At least with government, people have a vote.

Less government control means MORE industry control, more faceless bureaucrats in ivory towers telling us what kind of health care we can have. At least with government, people have a vote.

Private cooperations are exactly that, private. They get themselves into trouble they will fail and should be LET to fail, no bailouts, industry will carry on, learning from the mistakes made. It's a bit like evolution. The goverment should stay out of it.

At least with the goverment you have a vote...right so when graveyards full of people are registered to vote, then investigations into that are stifled by those in political power you think that's legitimate say? Or thousands incorrectly listed as felons right before time to vote, blocking them from a voice, Or how about when thousands march on washington DC with legitimate concerns and the white house and others in political power ignore them? That's a say in affairs?

Right..

They get themselves into trouble they will fail and should be LET to fail, no bailouts, industry will carry on, learning from the mistakes made.

That's a wonderful theory, but sometimes when a company fails it'll drag down the entire industry and maybe the entire financial world along with it, like what happened with Lehman Bros. in September 2008.

It'd be nice to live in a fantasy utopia where people suffer only the consequences from their own actions, but we don't live in anything like that world. We live in a world where good ol' fashioned bank runs will make everyone suffer thru no fault of their own.

This "fantasy utopia" is what Republicans call the "deregulated free market," never mentioning how quickly they scurry to regulate the populace to protect their fatcat "free market" cronies from their own excesses at our expense.

@Max- I am a libertarian, but nice try anyway. We need a much smaller goverment, much less regulation. Problems will sort themselves out, we do not need big brother looking over our shoulder at every aspect of a individuals life.

Let me repeat it, most people WANT healthcare reform, but we want it done the RIGHT way.

Not to beat a dead horse from what I said below, but most people favor a public option. If you're going to argue that the government has a responsibility to enact the will of the people, then you logically have to argue that the public option should be included. It's as simple as that.

Personally, I don't believe in the populism theory. Sometimes the government needs to make decisions based on what is legally or ethically consistent, and sometimes that runs counter to what the people want. Doing away with segregation, for example, or the current issue of gay rights. It's indefensible, to me, to use the populism card when the majority agrees with you, and to conveniently ignore it when they don't, so I just don't go down that path to start with. But for those of you who do, be warned: the people aren't with you on this one. That alone makes your argument dead in the water before you begin.

Problems will sort themselves out, we do not need big brother looking over our shoulder at every aspect of a individuals life.

I don't want big brother looking over our shoulder constantly, either, but I also want to know that if I get sick or injured I'm not going to be gouged by a hospital that charges me several hundred dollars for gauze.

"Problems will sort themselves out"?! God helps those who help themselves, Relic.

Problems will sort themselves out

It's magic, I tells ya, magic that will save us!

Problems will sort themselves out

Is that the same thing as "Let go and let god"

DirtyRelic

To proclaim yourself a libertarian, while simultaneously posting ultraconservative talking points gives libertarians a bad name.

I'm amazed at the number of "libertarians" in the last year.

libertarians...I'm thinking they're just GOPers trying to claim some semblance of the high ground....I mean they've obviously been taught well how to hate their government...It's all about more, more for me, me, me....not an egaltarian among them...

I challenge the libertarians as well as the GOPers to define 'egalitarian'. then, I'd further challenge them to try, for once in their lives, to find one enemy (human being)made in pursuit of its premise....

I like that. I may steal it.

I may steal it.

Why not? Liberals love to steal what's not theirs. I think I'll use that one.

Liberals love to steal what's not theirs

Any real proof of that statement?

Liberals love to steal what's not theirs

They prefer to call it "redistribution"

FrJack - I would be honored if you used what I wrote. Anytime!

Mike - It's called sharing and playing nice in the sandbox. A lesson from kindergarten most of the wing nuts forgot.

"Liberals love to steal what's not theirs"
"Any real proof of that statement?" The vote of 220 members of congress last night was all the proof anyone would need that the top statement is correct.

How is that an different than money being used to invade Iraq?

Any real proof of that statement?

Of course. Taxes come to mind. They love to steal my money from the hard work that I perform and apply it for projects that never financially work, ie Medicare, the USPO, Dept. of Ed. to name a few. Mike says it spot on: its called redistribution.

They love to steal my money from the hard work that I perform and apply it for projects that never financially work, ie Medicare, the USPO, Dept. of Ed. to name a few.

Have a kleenex to blot up that slobber while I enumerate.

• Unless you're filthy rich, Medicare is going to be the only thing keeping you alive once you turn 65.
• The Post Office does for a relatively small amount of tax dollars what it would cost private companies three to four times the same amount to do.
• The Department of Education keeps the funding for public schools flowing, which keeps your kids in school five days a week, leaving you free to work or watch Fox News all day without worrying about spending tens of thousands of dollars on your kids' education from a private school.
• Let's name a few other things the government makes possible: the Social Security that is going to keep you eating something besides cat food once you retire, the clean water you drink, the roads you drive to work on, the electricity that flows into your home, the Internet that you use to snivel about how your government is wasting your tax dollars....

Max Black

The Department of Education keeps the funding for public schools flowing, which keeps your kids in school five days a week, leaving you free to work or watch Fox News all day without worrying about spending tens of thousands of dollars on your kids' education from a private school. Let's name a few other things the government makes possible: the Social Security that is going to keep you eating something besides cat food once you retire, the clean water you drink, the roads you drive to work on, the electricity that flows into your home, the Internet that you use to snivel about how your government is wasting your tax dollars....

PD will not be moved to the side of reason, though you've made excellent points!

The Failin' Palin enthusiasts, still call Dubya and The Dick heros!

So, the rethuglicon leaders can piss on them and tell them it's raining: they'll buy it lock, stock and gun barrel!

Someone should tell them to stop watching FOX noise!

So, the rethuglicon leaders can piss on them and tell them it's raining: they'll buy it lock, stock and gun barrel

You libbies and demotards are eating up the Obamessiah b.s lock, stock and barrel. Spending trillions when we are broke is a good thing or dithering over sending troops isn't killing more US troops. Let the Chosen One talk for himself, sans telepromter. You libbies are so cute the way you eat up BO's talking points. I think I'll take some of you home and treat you like pets. I know I'll have to toilet train the most of you but it'll be worth it. Cute little pets you are!!!

3.8

I'll bet you complain about these institutions while you get the letters from the local school from your mailbox that the mailman/woman delivered while driving down your well maintained road, right?

next....

Communists? get real. socialist? you have not a clue.

Kerry

Where Oh where were you conservatarians when Bushco was spending us broke in Iraq in the first place??

communists?? that's so olde school.... our biggest trading partner, China...?? ring any bells?? Yeah, they're communists....get real...they're holding together while we fall apart....getting any clues as to why??

Yeah the Dems have an agenda....egalitarian....and, yes they can, and, yes they should....SOMEbody should...all our socialistic programs like the interstate highway system....our infrastructure is crumbling, and you're worried about raising taxes to fix it... China=new infrastructure....US=50 year-old infrastructure....care to defend the status quo....?? Seems the greedy just want to hunker down....move, rather than renew America....

There's a better chance that you'd turn into a human being (odds currently at slim and none at all).

Nancy Pelosi's face makes me want to gouge out my own eyes!

Go with that feeling, mike. Don't let a little pain stop you from making your point.

Fair enough.

There's a better chance that you'd turn into a human being (odds currently at slim and none at all).

Not interested if that's what Nancy claims to be.

Nancy can bite me...... ok maybe just nibble on me a little.

Is there any chance that Nancy Pelosi could get knocked up and have to take about 9 years maternity leave so I don't have to see her anymore?

As saggy as she is, her uterus is probably getting kicked around by her own two feet as she strolls the capitol. She might pick up a pregnancy off the floor.

The tragedy is that we'd have another Pelosi.

I'll take another Pelosi over another Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rove, Ronald "Stateside"Reagan, Tom "Delay Delay"Delay, Ashcroft, Gingritch, Stevens, Larry "Widestance" Craig, Alberto "Helluva job" Gonzales, ( pauses to catch breath ) Sarah "failin'" Palin, etc. etc. etc. etc. etc,.

The list could go on indefinately, but you get the point....

The tragedy is that we'd have another Pelosi.

There might still be some Clinton DNA on the carpets, drapes, chairs, books, pictures, statues, magazines, flags, walls, and ceilings around there, so it could happen. Wouldn't a Clinton-Pelosi child be cute?

There might still be some Clinton DNA still on the carpets, drapes, chairs, books, magazines, flags, walls, and ceilings around there, so it could happen. Wouldn't a Clinton-Pelosi child be cute?

Wow, poor taste and a complete lack of understanding of how pregnancy works.

I know, I know. I left out the stork part.

How do you know how it tastes, anyway?

Reported as Inflammatory. Though, admittedly, that's mainly because Newsvine hasn't put in a "Report as 13-Year-Old Jackass" button.

Though, admittedly, that's mainly because Newsvine hasn't put in a "Report as 13-Year-Old Jackass" button.

Try pulling your knob.

Donkey, get your head outta your pants.... you got nothin' of value...

I put D.R. on "ignore" a long time ago. He rarely has anything of substance to add.

nobody's on ignore, where I come from, that's my judgement call, wherin I feel all of us can't help but modify our contentions eventually....I bothers me, knowing that when we get away from politics, we are mannerly and dignified towards one another...that must not depart us...we all know we're in this mess together, and we're not half as unreasonable as we contend....the exploited divisive issues have been thrust upon us unmercifully, though their factual premises are for the most part unknown, and a lot of them are unknowable...those issues really don't deserve our discussion....waiting on the truth takes the patience of Job...... as they say in Lala land...it's okay not to wait...

The Democrats who ran as progressive Democrats won handily. The Democrats like Creigh Deeds who ran as Republican Lites got their tails handed to them. People might not trust the Democrats, but with the exception of the Beck extremists, they are sick and tired of hateful, corrupt Republican rule.

Of course they are. They'd cheer another 9/11 attack if it happened on Obama's watch.

And by "they," I mean the Washington Republicans and the Beck/Bachmann crazy extremist fringe. Most regular Republicans are hard-working, patriotic Americans. They are not represented by these screaming hatemongers that "lead" the GOP and populate the "teabagger" rallies.

They'd cheer another 9/11 attack if it happened on Obama's watch.

You got that right!

Most regular Republicans are hard-working, patriotic Americans. They are not represented by these screaming hatemongers that "lead" the GOP and populate the "teabagger" rallies.

Then lets see them vote them out of office next time around

Then lets see them vote them out of office next time around

More like let's see them vote out the Democrats next time since they are the majority.

The Democrats arent being obstructionists just to have the president fail, no matter how bad it is for the country

More like let's see them vote out the Democrats next time since they are the majority.

If ~20% of the country is a majority, then yes, the GOP is in the majority.

I guess when I talk to liberals, everything has to be spelled out for them. THE DEMOCRATS ARE THE MAJORITY.

I guess when I talk to right wingers, everything has to be spelled out for them.
The Republicans are the obstructionists!

Obama failing is success for America. Obstructing Obama, Reid, and Pelosi is noble, just, and an absolute necessity. America is under attack by Marxist radicals and Islamic radicals in an unholy alliance. The good people of America must keep up the fight on both fronts.

The Republicans are the obstructionists

Well, duh, aren't they supposed to be? I don't know if you know this but the party that wins the election is called the ruling party and those that lost are called the opposition. Show me where the opposition is to blindly follow the ruling party. Just because you see BO as the Messiah where he can do no wrong, the reality of it BO does lots wrong and needs to be told no.

Well, duh, aren't they supposed to be?

No they are suppose to be working with the Democrats for the good of the country. Your kind of thinking is what's wrong with the far right: they would rather see the country go down the @!$%#ter than for Obama's plans to work.

they would rather see the country go down the @!$%#ter than for Obama's plans to work.

ABSOLUTELY 100% CORRECT. I WANT BO AND HIS PLANS TO FAIL ... miserably; however, I wish my country only the best and for the best, BO's policies must BE DEFEATED. Spending trillions when we are broke? Stimulus bills that can't go to where it is needed the most? Promising 250 miilion H1N1 doses and can only produce 30 million, 10.8% enemployment when 8% tops was promised if the stimulus got ram roaded through, Cap and Screw that will cost families of 4 upwards of $6,000, handicapping US manufacturing with Cap and Screw while ignoring China? I despise what the demotards are doing and I hope they fall flat on their face. In the demotard's failure America will then be allowed to prosper and grow. Fail dems fail!!!!! Can't wait until 2010 when the majority of Americans will rejoice the dems failure so that this country can back on track. Go GOP!!!!!

5 stars for Patriotic Dissenter!!! Keep up the good fight against the radical Marxist attacks on America by their commander-in-chief Obama.

ABSOLUTELY 100% CORRECT. I WANT BO AND HIS PLANS TO FAIL

Exactly and when it takes the country down with it you can feel really good about the fact your hate for Obama screwed everyone.

There is not one American whose success or survival depends on Obama, excepting his punk self and our military that he is abusing. You guys really do think he is your saviour. Man what a weak life you must have.

There is not one American whose success or survival depends on Obama

The success and the survival of the US is always dependent on our leadership.

The success and the survival of the US is always dependent on our leadership.

Aha!!! the $50,000 question: WHAT LEADERSHIP HAS BO SHOWN? The stimulus? He ran away and delegated everything to congress. And then he showed his complete ignorance when he didn't even read the bill to see Dodd giving AIG execs bonuses. Health care? What has he done? He just blabs and blabs and for what? If not for Pelosi, this entire thing would still be debated. To that witch's credit, it was her and her alone that got this fiasco passed. BO and leadership are synonymous like liberal and hard-worker.

The success and the survival of the US is always dependent on our leadership.

Aha!!! the $50,000 question: WHAT LEADERSHIP HAS BO SHOWN? The stimulus? He ran away and delegated everything to congress. And then he showed his complete ignorance when he didn't even read the bill to see Dodd giving AIG execs bonuses. Health care? What has he done? He just blabs and blabs and for what? If not for Pelosi, this entire thing would still be debated. To that witch's credit, it was her and her alone that got this fiasco passed. BO and leadership are synonymous like liberal and hard-worker.

WHAT LEADERSHIP HAS BO SHOWN?

PD the economy is getting better after 8 years of total failure.
The SS is more respected around the world than when baby Bush was in office.
That is just two of many accomplishments.
You really need to follow the news and keep up.

What country are you in ?

"the economy is getting better after 8 years of total failure." Do you see the numbers of unemployed still increasing, war still going on and the people getting screwed not just us now but or grandchildren will be to. Wake the hell up !

USA.

Dow at new one-year high as stocks jump worldwide November 9, 2009 | 11:04 am

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/money_co/2009/11/dow-new-52-week-high-stock-market-surge-health-care-gold.html

PD the economy is getting better after 8 years of total failure.

Yes for now. I'd dare you to make that assertion here in Detroit and see if you make it out alive. I have seen more and more of my patients using their own money to pay for Cardiolite Stress test, around $2,000/test becasue their insurance no longer exists.

But seeing that BO's administration cooked the books by using the Cars 4 Clunckers in 3rd Q rather in the 4th where they belong, let us see how the 4th quarter goes. And what leadership, specifically, did BO demonstrate to get the economy back on track? He never seems to get in there, roll his sleves up and get dirty. Rather he delegates away all his responsibility just like a man would who has never been an executive or project leader in anything he has ever done. Just as Hillary wisely stated, "The POTUS is not a place for on the job training." I'd wager that if he was on The Apprentice, The Donald would have yanked his ass within the first 3 weeks. "BO, You're Fired."

Tiredofit-946833 Unemployment is a lagging indicator, and the wars were started by Bush.

PD:

Yes for now.

So you are psychic and know what will happen.
I bet you are one of those people who hopes things gets worse just so you have a justification for all your hate.

So you are psychic and know what will happen

Not psychic, sceptic. By putting the cash 4 clunkers in the 3rd Q. it gave a not-so-accurate figure. Just waiting as you know it takes, what, 2 or 3 consecutive gains in the GDP before a recession is said to have made a recovery. Remember "Mission Accomplished?"

If the auto sector was the only one doing better you might have a point, however if you watch the money channels you would see a lot more than just that area is getting better.

Did you think that 8 years of total failure could be fixed completely in a few months?

Did you think that 8 years of total failure could be fixed completely in a few months?

Of course not and that is why when just one Quarter of GDP growth is recorded it is hearaled at the start of a brand new day just seems disingenuous to me. When we see consecutive quarters of growth than we may bring out the champagne flutes and toast each other.

Of course not

Enough said.
It will take time and the market shows things are getting better across the board.

Top forecasters are growing more confident the U.S. economy has embarked on a sustainable recovery, a survey released on Tuesday showed.

The Blue Chip Economic Indicators newsletter for November found forecasters had raised their 2010 projections for gross domestic product for a fourth straight month. However, they still expect the pace of growth to fall short of the typical post-recession bounce.

The U.S. economy should expand 2.7 percent next year, the newsletter said. That marked an upward revision from the 2.5 percent pace the survey panel had expected a month ago.

http://www.reuters.com/article/gc04/idUSTRE5A90RH20091110

markets...@!$%# the markets...only the rich get attended to....

Ah, but that's just it Steve.. it's the Republican way.. (and Fox's too)..

When they understand it is a government option they can't refuse, support goes to near nill, just a few irresponsible detached liberal stragglers who won't pay for any plan still support it.

When they understand it is a government option they can't refuse

Sure they can. Just go with a private insurer. If the government plan is going to be prohibitively expensive, the free market dictates that some savvy businessman will see the value in offering a lower price. Unless of course, you're arguing that the free market is unable to compete with government, which contradicts the other common argument that the government can't do anything efficiently.

Republican opposition really needs to get on-point with their opposition here. Their arguments are often self-refuting.

Unless of course, you're arguing that the free market is unable to compete with government, which contradicts the other common argument that the government can't do anything efficiently.

Well lets see if the free market requires participation, shall we? **Checking Data Banks**

Nope, the free market does not mandate everyone participate or face fines and/or prison time fromt eh IRS. You lose.

And if you're okay with mandating coverage which is to say there will be now a price for U.S. citizenship, how could you say no to mandating military service as they do in Israel? I mean if the SCOTUS says price for citizenship is constitutional, why would it not seem fair to force military service on Americans as price for citizenship? If a precedent is set with healthcare I would expect conscription be a price for citizenship as well. Is this healthcare nonsense a precedent we want the SCOTUS to set?

Patriotic Dissenter said: "there will be now a price for U.S. citizenship"

Sorry, but that's just plain stupid. There has always been a "price for citizenship". It's called taxes. Don't pay them, you go to jail. You just don't like taxes going to this particular expense. Fine, whatever. I didn't like my taxes going to the war in Iraq. Both were expenses approved by Congress, so you just have to suck it up and deal with your taxes going toward healthcare, just like I had to suck it up and deal with my taxes going to Iraq. Personally, I'd rather my tax dollars go toward keeping people alive in this country rather than killing people in other countries, but hey - we each have our priorities, I suppose.

StephenToo made good points, but I should also point this out:

If a precedent is set with healthcare I would expect conscription be a price for citizenship as well.

It already is. If you're a male U.S. citizen, you sign up for selective service at age 18. The government doesn't use it, but you are basically volunteering for conscription at that point.

There has always been a "price for citizenship". It's called taxes. Don't pay them, you go to jail.

I would simply like to know if you can cite a UNITED STATES FEDERAL LAW that REQUIRES Americans to pay an income tax? And I'm not talking about the Tax Code, I'm speaking very specifically about a FEDERAL LAW, as in Title 18 of the United States Code? Not trying to be argumentative, I'm just curious is all.

Huh? Not sure what you mean by that. The Tax Code is part of the US Code (it's Title 26 of the US Code) - these are not two separate things, and it is federal law. A quick google search gave this page, if you want more info: http://docs.law.gwu.edu/facweb/jsiegel/Personal/taxes/JustNoLaw.htm

The government doesn't use it, but you are basically volunteering for conscription at that point.

Well then, get used to serving in the US military at 18 as there will be no way out (unless medical).

Don't pay them, you go to jail.

Earth to stupid (you): What? Are you on crack? When my son is born he is to pay taxes or go to jail? Please, wake up.

Stephen Too

Please show me where it is written in the IRS tax code that upon the birth of my child that he/she is required to pay any taxes? What taxes are you referring to that a new born must pay to become a citizen? Waiting. However, when my child is born under this healthcare fiasco, I am to insure him or face jail time.

Right now you get a tax break if you have a child. You get both an extra exemption and a child tax credit. Do you have a problem with that modification of taxes based on someone having a child? In a way, it's an incentive with the government saying "we'll make it easier for you to have a family by reducing the financial burden on you somewhat." So what this new bill is saying is that if you don't live up to your responsibility with regards to supporting that child (including your tax break), then you'll lose some of that break by having an additional tax added. It's somewhat of an ugly solution (like pretty much all of the tax code), but the gist is the same in both cases: rewarding or penalizing your impact on society depending on whether you are responsible or irresponsible.

Rant and rave all you want. You don't like it. That's pretty obvious. But it's also completely legal, and voted in by people that the voters put into office. Deal with it.

However, when my child is born under this healthcare fiasco, I am to insure him or face jail time.

Part of having a child is ensuring their good health and safety. And part of that is having health insurance, government-mandated or not. If you have a child born, plenty of expectations are put on you. You have to feed and clothe them. You have to send them to school. You have to provide a safe home environment. All of these cost money.

If you can somehow afford out-of-pocket the prohibitive cost of inoculations, regular medical and dental check-ups, eye exams, hospital visits, and the myriad of other bump-and-bruises health situations that will inevitably come up during a child's life: congratulations, you are richer than God. A slight bump to your taxes will not kill you.

If your problem is the government intruding your "right" to neglect your child, this health care thing is the last of your worries, and Child Protective Services has been around a lot longer than this legislation.

Sure they can. Just go with a private insurer.

The Pelosi bill phases out private insurance. There will be no private options, just the lone government option. That is the plan, single payer, government only payer, governmetn only insurance, and the Pelosi Assault on Health Care Bill accomplishes the phase out of private insurance.

And part of that is having health insurance, government-mandated or not. If you have a child born, plenty of expectations are put on you. You have to feed and clothe them. You have to send them to school. You have to provide a safe home environment. All of these cost money.

Yes they do cost money. But for it to be made as part of US citizenship is just unbelievable. Children born 100 years ago did not have insurance as their parents most likely did not have health insurance as well. Did that make them less of a citizen? Of course not. How about those of a religious mind that they would want to opt out of medical insurance? Are they less of or in no way a US citizen? Of course not. Bad parents maybe but not a US Citizen?

And you said something quite revealing. Yes, expectations are put on you NOT MANDATES. There is a huge difference.

But it's also completely legal, and voted in by people that the voters put into office. Deal with it.

Please show me the where the SCOUTS has ruled on mandated health insurance's constitutionality. Some legal experts say it will be while others have said it is questionable.

That is the plan, single payer, government only payer, governmetn only insurance, and the Pelosi Assault on Health Care Bill accomplishes the phase out of private insurance.

Of course it is as it was always to be single payer. BO dropped the single payer mumbo-jumbo because he is too spineless to argue for it. Why did BO nominate Tom Daschle as HHS Director? Because Daschle has always been for single payer. BO knew that getting single payer through the front door was a losing solution so he, like the spineless man that he is, proffers this Obamacare b.s through with the intention of legislating private insurance out of existence. Why can't the libs see this? By having health care under his thumb, BO can institute regs on private insurance to make it so punitively expensive that no one will ever opt for it. Instead we will be forced to choose Obamacare and give the gubmint 16% of the GDP and much more when there is no choice but gubment run health care. Think of all the power and might the WH will have when 40-50% of its revenue is from Health care. Money equals power equal votes in Washington, DC and BO won't be happy until he has every last dime of it under his thumb.

But for it to be made as part of US citizenship is just unbelievable.

I've been overlooking your poor choice of words, but seeing as it's now apparently your entire point, I might as well be blunt: that statement is pants-on-head stupid. It's not required for U.S. citizenship. People who break the law are still U.S. citizens. If you've gone 65 in a 35 mph zone, maybe you got pulled over, maybe you paid a fine, but you were still a U.S. citizen. Requiring health insurance, or a fine if people refuse to get health insurance, is not the same as a requirement for U.S. citizenship.

If I had known your argument boiled down to something so clearly factually incorrect, I would have addressed it a while ago. Here I thought you were just being hyperbolic for the sake of argument. I never for a moment thought that such a ludicrous statement was something you literally believed.

The Pelosi bill phases out private insurance. There will be no private options, just the lone government option.

Excellent, we've reached the Big Bad Conspiracy portion of our discussion. A little later than expected, but better late than never, they say. Thank you.

It's not required for U.S. citizenship.

Okay, so if I am from, say, Cuba, and I just got off a boat in Miami and I refuse to obtain coverage, ever. Then I can stay any ways? They wouldn't deport me back to Cuba? If that is not the case than you are correct and I am wrong; however, if, under obamacare a Cuban exile (or any other) that comes here, after Obamacare has passed, and refuses to ever get health coverage than he still can become a U.S. citizen, assuming he is compliant otherwise? If that is the case this would be an example of healthcare being a prerequisite for citizenship, no? Would this Cuban be even eligible for a green card?

Okay, so if I am from, say, Cuba, and I just got off a boat in Miami and I refuse to obtain coverage, ever. Then I can stay any ways?

That's an idiotic standard. Let me rephrase your example to point out why:

"Okay, so if I am from, say, Cuba, and I just got off a boat in Miami, and I refuse to pay taxes. Then I can stay anyways?"

Let's try another one.

"Okay, so if I am from, say, Cuba, and I just got off a boat in Miami, and I refuse to promise not to murder strangers. Then I can stay anyways?"

One more, just for kicks.

"Okay, so if I am from, say, Cuba, and I just got off a boat in Miami, and I refuse to keep my clothes on. Then I can stay anyways?"

Of course not. You're not agreeing to adhere to U.S. laws. The fact remains that a U.S. citizen does not lose his citizenship by failing to do it. A U.S. citizen can evade taxes, murder people and run around naked, and they are still a U.S. citizen. The same applies here. If you fail to follow the law, you are a lawbreaker, but a citizen nonetheless. When someone applies for citizenship, they are expected to follow this law just as they are expected to follow any law. Citizenship has absolutely nothing to do with it, and your argument is getting hilariously strained.

That's the reality, mikey. The privateer wealth insurance cartel did such a ream job on the American people that that's what it comes down to. Blame your beloved private sector for this, not the American people. Even your own elderly teabaggers were out there demanding that the government "keep [its] hands off [their] Medicare." Didn't that tell you something about the level of understanding the issue of the problem in that benighted group.

You obviously haven't dealt with private insurance companies during a hospital visit, mike. There is also the enormous, bloated, patchwork bureaucracy of the private industry to deal with, and those crooks THRIVE upon weak government.

FrJackHackett

elderly teabaggers were out there demanding that the government "keep [its] hands off [their] Medicare." Didn't that tell you something about the level of understanding the issue of the problem in that benighted group.

Those people are idiots. I get your point though.

More Than Happy

You obviously haven't dealt with private insurance companies during a hospital visit,

No, but I have dealt with the VA, and worked in hospitals and nursing homes, so I have seen just how bad things can be. That's precisely why I don't want more government in health care. The govt. can screw-up anything!

And, again, mike, you'd be hard pressed to find any senior willing to give up Medicare. As for the VA, it sure does have its problems. But even when the Obama admin. floated the idea of billing some of the medical costs to the private insurers that vets have, vet groups from all sides of the political lines rose up in one loud voice so fast and furiously against that idea that it disappeared almost immediately. Apparently vets are "idiots," too?

No, but I have dealt with the VA, and worked in hospitals and nursing homes, so I have seen just how bad things can be.

You and I must be seeing two different VA's, then. My grandfather lost his hearing on a battleship off of Iwo Jima, and he's never had to pay a cent to have some of the best practical care that there is. He's as old-school Republican as it gets, and he's never said a bad word about them.

Pessimism isn't realism, mike, not about the government nor anything else. Despite the hype, a lot of good people still work for the government.

FrJackHackett and More Than Happy

Both excellent points. The VA can be great (which I have seen) and the VA can be terrible (which I have seen).

For me, the choice is simple. Govt. involvement helped create the current health care dilemma, and more govt. involvement has all of the potential to make it much, much worse.

Pessimism isn't realism, and neither is optimism, but just like any gamble, you have to go with the odds. I've been witness to the worst of socialized medicine, and it's not a gamble that I would want to take.

And all of America has been the victim of the worst of privatized medicine. That's why this change is happening! That should be obvious. Something I wish could have been discussed was continuing to provide health insurance coverage via private companies and through private hospitals which were, by strict federal mandate, non-profit organizations. Any profits from the health insurance companies should be paid as dividends to 'the owners', and 'the owners' are anyone who owns a policy. Let them compete by making their CUSTOMERS happy and keeping operating costs to a minimum like any other business. But no one should PROFIT off of the illness of others.

I think doctors SHOULD be rich, they work HARD. Nurses do very difficult work as well. But they should be paid good salaries, not get paid for piece-work like a factory worker.

Mike, not only do I not want more government in my life, the government I have I want on my side. The Republicans are the party which grows government. They are the party which takes away my civil liberties. They are the party in bed with Big Business, placing power, and control, in the Boardroom, where I have NO voice whatsoever. Republicans crave wealth and power: that wealth and power comes at the expense of the majority. This is simply how it is, spin and self-deception do nothing to alter this history. "But America, it will be different this time, we promise." Bull puckey.

Returned to power, the Republicans will grow government, spend money like drunken sailors, take more of our freedoms, and work to entrench themselves in power WITHOUT accountability. The next time it will be "no more Mr. Nice Guy," too. We will have to pay for our sins for electing Democrats. Retribution will be taken. We will have to suffer for our lack of devotion. All this is so, all this will come to pass, if they ever return to power: the Republican is powerless over him/herself.

PDeuth

I hear Ya'!

And don't confuse me with a GOP supporter, because I am not. I am a libertarian, hence, I am always for civil liberties and against big govt., no matter who is pushing it. Otherwise, I can't disagree with anything you've said.

pdeuth, I hear yah too.....you're absolutely right...it's war they're fighting...against the people....they don't care about us...they de-fund all the social programs, then let that stew for a while, then us it as example for why big government fails...sneaky crooked bunch....cover ass at all costs...if nobody learns anything then they still 'win'

Without the truth, there is no freedom... without love, there is no care for the truth...no hope for freedom.... keeping it real, don't forget the fundamentals, that unless we work together, our futures will remain entangled and nullified of any power to overcome those who would design us to fail....

GOPers have a history of accusing the 'other side' of the very things that they themselves are trying to do.....crazy, that they are not called on it more often....DEms...how can they tolerate this crap, that's what I'd like to know...

I chose 60% because that number represented a rough average of the support among a large number of polls for the public option (and not one with triggers or "opt-out" provisions, either). So, I'm left to wonder about what kind of majority you'd think we should have in order to get things accomplished in this country. If 60% of the people want something, and the Constitution does not expressly forbid that something (e.g. even if 100% of the population wanted to reinstitute slavery, it would still be unconstitutional without abolishing the 13th amendment) that's a pretty stong majority. If politicians win elections with that kind of vote, we call it a landslide victory. We elect presidents on even a plurality of the vote, and in fact, as you well know, some get elected even if they lose the majority of the popular vote. Getting 60% of the country to agree on anything is quite a major feat. What is it about representative democracy that you don't like? That sometimes you lose?

Getting 60% of the country to agree on anything is quite a major feat. What is it about representative democracy that you don't like? That sometimes you lose?

Oh snap.

in fact, as you well know, some get elected even if they lose the majority of the popular vote.

Double snap!!

A lot of people are actually watching "news", or cartoons (which are as close to reality as most programming on FOX).

Thank Dog, that's not how laws are made in this country. Is that the way you'd establish yours?

"""Fox Noise has about 4m viewers per day...that leaves about 265m that don't view Fox Noise...why is that?""" 4m a day? Where do you get numbers like that. They usually get that in a single hour at 8pm. Fox gets about 1.6m per hour 24 hours a day. That's about 38.5 m a day.

Nothing is too preposterous for those mopes to say these days. They are frightened to death of this health care reform because they know it will be popular. That and an economy that starts creating jobs before next year's election will be poison to their hopes of bringing Obama down. Never has it been so clear that what's good for the country is bad for a political party but the Republicans have managed to put themselves in exactly that position.

Excellent point!

Doncha love it when reichwingers make up inflated numbers projected into future "unfunded mandates?" It's fun (weak pun here). Let's do it with wasteful military spending on weapons we'll never need. That "unfunded" (the taxes to pay for it have not been collected so far, right?) mandate (it might as well be since most of the of Congress treats it like a welfare program for weapons makers) for what we laughingly call "defense" spending is now $4 quadrillion (might as well make up the big sounding latin-based unit number as well, eh?) over the next 50 years. You can do this with highway spending and farm subsidies, too. It's a great way to create strawman arguments.

t's simply amazing; no matter how many on the right have fallen over the cliff economically due to hard times, they are still willingly being led down the path of destruction by the former administration of crooks and liars who caused the fall in the first place.

And when the other choice is the Democrats? You gotta be joking? That is like choosing death by gunfire or hanging: either choice leads to death. The liberal view of spending trillions during a time when there ain't no money is got to be the dumbest idea since the word dumb was first used by describing a democrat. So voting for the demotards is hardly the next best choice. I'll stick to the GOP.

PD chooses the party of NO. NO ideas. NO solutions. NO path forward, only FOR the way things never were. Brilliant.

So voting for the demotards is hardly the next best choice. I'll stick to the GOP.

HUH?? Like a bad odor or a spreading cancer...,you'll stick it out 'til the bitter end. I'm so sorry.....for you.

PD is willingly led by the heartless party of NOthing but NOise!

They are so proud of their little "drinking the Obama koolaid" shctick, that they fail to see that they are chuggin' down the rethuglicons endless, bitter swill of deception.

Don't you know that if you're not rich, ya' ain't invited to the party?? You are just the shill that they use in their game of divide and conquer, so that "We The People" will be distracted from the fact they they are doing all that they can to turn America into a two-class system: the rich and the poor.

It shines a glaring light of irony when any "proud" rethuglicon follower (the gang that couldn't shoot straight), would point fingers, or call any party other than the Nophers "dumb" or "retarded".

It not only makes obvious a complete break from reality, but shine o' so brightly on the three fingers pointing back!

PD is willingly led by the heartless party of NOthing but NOise

!

Says you. And you are? Another Obamabot zombie with his hands outstretched that says, "And what's next my master." No thanks. I'll stick to the GOP. I heard Gatorade is the antidote for Obama Sheeple Syndrome. Try it.

If I may lend a quote to the debate:

"What are you here for"

"To get money"

"what money"

"Obama money"

"And where did he get it"

"I dunno, from his stash"

Another Obama voter speaking from the heart.

Want some tissue? Or some cheese with that whine?

you'd support a party that would rather dither over Afghanistan while troops die

The Party Lie, again??? What was it called when request for troops sat on the desk of the DICK for 8 months while the unjust war recieved all of the military funds?? Reasonable thought? Grow up!

You answer dissent with so much petty name calling: You are the obvious face of the ReTHUGlicon Party, and it's why their popularity will continue to drop like a stone.

All that will be left in the party of Lying Liars Who Lie, are the sheep who'll follow the "party lie" to their demise.

You are the obvious face of the ReTHUGlicon Party, and it's why their popularity will continue to drop like a stone.

Empty, baseless rhetoric that Obama's WH puts out and all of his faithful, mindless Obamabots continue to blather. Get a new talking point, please.

You first!

You first!

Pee Wee Herman is that you! Thought so, how's Dottie?