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Lawyer: Prof. accused in Ala. slayings remorseful

Fri Feb 12, 2010 5:54 PM EST
us-news, us, shooting, university, ala, amy-bishop, massachusetts-state-police, university-shooting, joseph-leahy, ray-garner
Desiree Hunter, Associated Press Writer
Former Braintree police chief John Polio says there were definite flaws in his department's handling of the 1986 shooting involving Amy Bishop.
< PreviousNext >
showing 1 of 27 photos
<p>Two shooting victims are taken from the Shelby Center on the campus of the University of Alabama to an ambulance after multiple people were shot in Huntsville, Ala, Friday Feb. 12, 2010. Officials at the University of Alabama's Huntsville campus say three people have been killed and another injured in a campus shooting. (AP Photo/The Huntsville Times, Robin Conn)</p>

Two shooting victims are taken from the Shelby Center on the campus of the University of Alabama to an ambulance after multiple people were shot in Huntsville, Ala, Friday Feb. 12, 2010. Officials at the University of Alabama's Huntsville campus say three people have been killed and another injured in a campus shooting. (AP Photo/The Huntsville Times, Robin Conn)

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HUNTSVILLE — The Alabama university professor accused of shooting six colleagues has a genius-level IQ, yet wonders whether she has been fired from her job — a clear sign that she has trouble relating to the world, her attorney said Friday.

One week ago, the Harvard-educated Amy Bishop was accused of opening fire at a faculty meeting at the University of Alabama in Huntsville, killing three co-workers and injuring three others. She is remorseful, but doesn't recall pulling the trigger, said her attorney, Roy W. Miller. She exhibits signs of mental illness and needs evaluations, he said.

"Something's wrong with this lady, OK?" Miller said, laying the groundwork for a potential insanity defense during a news conference.

Later, Miller lectured Bishop's husband James Anderson in front of the media for more than five minutes, pleading with him to quit talking to reporters about his wife. Miller said Anderson might hurt Bishop's case.

Anderson has said he and Bishop went to a shooting range in the weeks before the killings and has given varying accounts of where she might have gotten the handgun used in the shootings.

Anderson has called his wife a "dedicated, loving mother" and said they fell in love over similar interests of science, music, reading and writing. But he said he doesn't know his wife's birthday.

"You never ask a woman her age and you never ask her her weight," Anderson said.

Court records say Bishop is 45; school records have her as 44.

Bishop is being held without bond on charges of capital murder and attempted murder.

District Attorney Robert Broussard said prosecutors have not decided whether to seek the death penalty if Bishop is convicted. Under Alabama law, the only other possible punish for a capital offense is life without parole.

Miller said Bishop breaks down and cries during their talks in the county jail. She wants to see her four children and was worried about her position at the university.

"She said, 'Do I still have a job out there?' She asked me that yesterday," Miller said. "She said, 'Do you know if I have a job? I assume they fired me. Did they fire me?'"

University officials have said she remains on the payroll, but her $83,000-a-year job was ending at the end of the semester because she was denied tenure.

Miller said he hasn't discussed the tenure decision with Bishop at length, but during an earlier interview with The Associated Press he said she was "very distraught and concerned over that tenure."

Bishop, who has a doctorate from Harvard and has taught at the University of Alabama in Huntsville since 2003, apparently was incensed that a lesser-known school rejected her for what amounted to a lifetime job.

Anderson told ABC's "Good Morning America" he also thought the failed tenure battle was involved.

"Only someone who has been intricately involved with that fight understands what a tough, long, hard battle (it is). ... That I would say is part of the problem, is a factor," he said in an interview aired Friday.

Broussard, the district attorney, said his office had yet to review Bishop's troubled past, including when she shot her younger brother to death in 1986. Authorities in Massachusetts ruled that killing accidental, though State Police officials said Friday they will review their agency's investigation.

Since the Alabama shootings, questions have been raised about why Bishop did not face any charges a quarter-century ago after she fled the house after killing her brother and allegedly pointed the gun at people at a nearby car dealership's body shop.

In Bishop's only public comments since the Alabama shooting, the professor told a reporter after her arrest that her university colleagues were still alive. Miller said Bishop now knows three people were killed.

"It tears her up. She's eaten up about what she's done," he said.

___

Associated Press writer Jay Reeves contributed to this report.

© 2010 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.
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  • Public Discussion (79)
Jump to discussion page: 1 2
JanayB

Not again....

What in the world is wrong with people?

  • 5 votes
Reply#1 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 7:14 PM EST
diversity

They had the chance to lock her ass up when she murdered her own brother but nooooo.....that was an "accidental" death, even though the shot gun was fired 3 times and she was found hiding behind the car with another slug in the chamber......uh...hello ...nothing "accidental" about it.

I also think that soup bowl haircut should give her an extra 10 years in prison.

  • 2 votes
#1.1 - Wed Feb 17, 2010 3:42 PM EST
Reply
4real?

wow, first time I think I have heard of a woman on a rampage (insert sexist joke here)

  • 3 votes
Reply#2 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 7:14 PM EST
Dennis270

That was the first thing that caught my attention, too.

    #2.1 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 8:00 PM EST
    JmetheSad

    Same here. Shocked and impressed (not in a good way) that a woman has gone on a shooting spree. Not to make a joke, but did the department not give the lady a biology research grant she wanted or something?

    edited: Noticed space guy's comment below that she was denied tenure. eek. That would make someone snap in this economy.

      #2.2 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 8:55 PM EST
      Sean Boi

      I fully expected it to have been a man that did the shooting. What is wrong with people today? Some people just don't seem to have any coping skills or common sense for that matter.

      • 2 votes
      #2.3 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 9:42 PM EST
      usa1

      yes a women and first I heard of a school school shooting with a faculty member behind the barrel.

      wonder if this is going to effect her tenure. Most tenures are bullet proof excuse the pun

      • 1 vote
      #2.4 - Sat Feb 13, 2010 12:28 AM EST
      Tony Wlliams

      usa1

      If you only heard of the one here is a link to another that happened this week.

      world-news.newsvine.com/_news/2010/02/10/3878103-2-shot-at-tenn-elementary-school-arrest-made

      • 1 vote
      #2.5 - Sat Feb 13, 2010 1:26 AM EST
      usa1

      thanks tony!!

      Whats going on with all these teachers??? Remembered a few years back it was postal worker hence the term going postal. Today the term for going nuts and shooting is going to be teaching some one a lesson?

      • 2 votes
      #2.6 - Sat Feb 13, 2010 3:59 AM EST
      Vincent Bartning

      It says she studied at Harvard. Does that mean she graduated from there. Main-stream media needs to be more realistic with academic credentials.

      • 1 vote
      #2.7 - Sat Feb 13, 2010 9:55 AM EST
      TOM PA.

      Vincent Barting-2.7- Something like this looks bad on anyones resume.

        #2.8 - Sat Feb 13, 2010 12:29 PM EST
        Tony Wlliams

        Just read a follow-up and looks like she really loves to shoot people and that includes family members.

        • 1 vote
        #2.9 - Sun Feb 14, 2010 1:33 AM EST
        mike lonkouski

        Yeah, she "accidentally" shot a 12 gauge shotgun three times, and managed to shoot her 18 year old brother in the chest, and apparently they had just fought, but the Mass. Sheriff decided to just send her home!

        Great police work!

        • 4 votes
        #2.10 - Sun Feb 14, 2010 1:35 AM EST
        Smelly FishDeleted
        Reply
        space guy

        I just heard from the Huntsville Times that the woman had been denied tenure earlier today and walked into the meeting and open fired.

        http://blog.al.com/breaking/2010/02/three_dead_in_university_of_al.html

        I worked at UAH for ten years. This sucks.

        • 3 votes
        Reply#3 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 7:52 PM EST
        tyler

        I worked at UAH for ten years. This sucks.

        Do you know if you know anyone involved?

        The university posted a message on its Web site Friday afternoon telling students the campus was closed Friday night and all students were encouraged to go home.

        The emergency notification points out no students are involved.

        • 4 votes
        #3.1 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 8:20 PM EST
        TezInDenver

        Maybe she didn't get tenure because they realized she was an unstable nut-job.

        • 5 votes
        #3.2 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 8:28 PM EST
        space guy

        Do you know if you know anyone involved?

        I have an ex girlfriend that is a staffer in that department. Trying to find out if she was there.

        • 1 vote
        #3.3 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 8:29 PM EST
        Dennis270

        There is a comment at the bottom of the link you provided, space guy, that says something about it being over a dispute of intellectual property rights to some breakthrough the suspect made. Don't know how valid it is, but interesting to note.

        • 1 vote
        #3.4 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 8:55 PM EST
        space guy

        Here is an email from Dr. John Christy to Anthony Watts from WUWT on his status.

        We’re OK. Evidently a biology professor essentially shot the entire
        department at a faculty meeting after learning she was denied tenure.
        At the time, I was being taped at a TV station across town by John
        Coleman (remotely from San Diego) when they came in with breaking news
        about a shooting at UAH.

        John C

        Dr. Christy has a certain level of fame from his role as the only scientist to refuse his part of the Nobel prize for the now discredited Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change.

        • 6 votes
        #3.5 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 8:56 PM EST
        space guy

        Here is a 9:00 pm update from local Huntsville news. They give out the names of the deceased and wounded faculty and staff members.

        http://videos.al.com/huntsville-times/2010/02/9_pm_uah_briefing.html

        • 1 vote
        #3.6 - Sat Feb 13, 2010 1:17 AM EST
        Vincent Bartning

        It's a woman, Tyler! Maybe you should allow censorship of the article!

        • 2 votes
        #3.7 - Sat Feb 13, 2010 9:56 AM EST
        space guy

        A NY Times article

        http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/14/us/14alabama.html?pagewanted=2&hp

        • 1 vote
        #3.8 - Sun Feb 14, 2010 3:17 PM EST
        Reply
        BJK-798627

        The shooter was in custody... Local television stations reported she is a faculty member.

        A terrible shock.

        And of all people, a faculty member. Insane.

        • 1 vote
        Reply#4 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 7:55 PM EST
        TezInDenver

        OMG! I'm stunned! What a horrible tragedy!

        • 2 votes
        Reply#5 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 8:16 PM EST
        Shub Tnediserp Remrof

        Wonder if there is a connection with the high school shooting. doubtful, but it is possible. Feel sorry for the families of the victims and the family that has to suffer watching a relative shoot innocent people.

        • 2 votes
        Reply#6 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 8:27 PM EST
        space guy

        Wonder if there is a connection with the high school shooting. doubtful,

        No, apparently this idiot woman was pissed that as a Harvard graduate that the faculty tenure committee at piss poor little UAH would have the temerity not to give her tenure.

        • 5 votes
        #6.1 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 8:33 PM EST
        Judge-574295Deleted
        TezInDenver

        Judge-574295

        Excuse me? Did I understand you correctly, or are you just being sarcastic? Are you really saying that if you have the Bible (meaning Jesus Christ), guns are okay? Or are you saying that Christians with guns are somehow safer or more responsible?

        • 2 votes
        #6.3 - Sat Feb 13, 2010 10:22 PM EST
        Judge-574295Deleted
        Dennis270

        Yeah, because when you have guns AND Bibles, you wind up with pillars of the community like Scott Roeder.

        • 2 votes
        #6.5 - Sun Feb 14, 2010 12:23 AM EST
        Judge-574295Deleted
        mike lonkouski

        But I have guns and don't own any Bibles, so am I breaking a law or a commandment?

        • 2 votes
        #6.7 - Sun Feb 14, 2010 12:58 AM EST
        Judge-574295Deleted
        mike lonkouski

        Damn, and I've been working on my doctorate thesis for three years.

        • 3 votes
        #6.9 - Sun Feb 14, 2010 1:25 AM EST
        TezInDenver

        So you're purporting that the Christian "holier than thou" argument is correct? Maybe they should put those little fish on their guns like they do on their cars so we can all feel safer.

        Correlation does not prove cause.

        • 1 vote
        #6.10 - Sun Feb 14, 2010 1:03 PM EST
        Dennis270

        But its time to open minds

        Agreed, and opening minds involves realizing that religious belief, or lack thereof, along with basic political ideology (lib v con) and educational level are not indicators of the ability of someone to commit violence and/or suffer from extreme mental instability. All groups have their troubled members. Translation - quit stirring up sh*t. Everybody.

        • 2 votes
        #6.11 - Sun Feb 14, 2010 1:25 PM EST
        Reply
        Neesy08

        i just new it would be a man. watch and see her attorney cop a insanity defensed

        • 1 vote
        Reply#7 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 8:48 PM EST
        Bec30

        *sigh*

        Geez... in 230 years we've gone from the Age of Reason... to the age of insanity!

        • 1 vote
        Reply#8 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 8:51 PM EST
        Marcel Villa

        perhaps I will get hammered for this but this is case whereby people loses their sense of security because the present government failed to give them that kind of job security. For a period where lots of people loses their job some may think that not getting that tenure is prelude to losing that job altogether. If the family has financial problems, then the aura of total frustration can easily rule the day. Had the government made their move early enough to stem this tide of job losses then probably the lady will shrug her shoulders and say " I don't care", I could get a job anytime. But at present this is not the case. The fear is there and unless this government move faster and make solid and effective action to create long term if not permanent jobs instead of duct tape short term temporary job placements then more of the same will occur again and again.

          Reply#9 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 9:42 PM EST
          Sean Boi

          Marcel Villa

          The fear is there and unless this government move faster and make solid and effective action to create long term if not permanent jobs instead of duct tape short term temporary job placements then more of the same will occur again and again.**************************************Actually, the government doesn't usually create jobs the private sector does that. This president has tried to help by giving assistance to those companies that needed it. General Motors was given stimulus money which helped save perhaps millions of jobs counting the suppliers etc. Rush Limbaugh said that GMC, FORD, AND CHRYSLER should have been forced to close rather than the government helping them. I wonder how many jobs that would have cost.

          This has nothing to do with President Obama anyway. Geesh!! You guys can turn this on him with no proof. If a dog pisses against the wall it somehow becomes the president's fault. How stupid.

          She was angry because she had just learned that she was not to receive tenure. Read the story before commenting PLEASE. You make yourself seem dumb when you go on such a rant without suficient facts.

          Where are you from anyway with a name such as Villa? Any relation to Poncho Villa?

          • 3 votes
          #9.1 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 9:55 PM EST
          JmetheSad

          Although the situation you describe is true, what happened to common sense? I understand freaking out and stressing over a possible job loss, but really killing people does not get the job back or secure the position. Sure, I could logically go through the errors of thinking prior to the killings, but as most would say the shooter was not sane at the time. But getting up to that point, stressing about the possible job loss, where in the logical thought process prior to "going insane" does a person not start planning for what outcome they are scared of. Now with no job, legal fees, and possible imprisonment, I'm pretty sure a loss job would have been WAY better. Which it wasn't even a job loss, but didn't get job security. People need to cope better with stress, she's not the only one facing these hard times, many others are and are working hard to try to survive.

          • 2 votes
          #9.2 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 9:56 PM EST
          RR98411

          No, not hammered but how about some responses for you instead...

          ...present government failed to give them that kind of job security.

          It is not the governments responsibility nor the civilian market to provide job security. She was denied tenure... does it ever occur to anyone that she may simply be bad at her job, hence why she was denied tenure.

          more of the same will occur again and again.

          Recent FBI statistics show that the murder rate as well as other violent crime rates have fallen to their lowest level since the late 80's early 90's. Though this situation is tragic for those killed and injured. The world may be stressed but nor is it coming apart at the seams...

          • 4 votes
          #9.3 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 9:56 PM EST
          space guy

          perhaps I will get hammered for this but this is case whereby people loses their sense of security because the present government failed to give them that kind of job security.

          This woman was a Harvard PhD, this has nothing to do with job security of the type that you are describing. The government cannot give you job security, no matter what it did. Those of us who live in the real world understand this.

          • 5 votes
          #9.4 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 11:29 PM EST
          GA GUY

          Marcel,

          This is simply a tragic occurance on one college campus.

          This thread is NOT a very good place to start painting dubious political associations onto the current subject matter at hand.

          Wow! I had not seen the other off topic posts below...guess it's a trend then;...

          Detracked.

          • 3 votes
          #9.5 - Sat Feb 13, 2010 12:38 AM EST
          mike lonkouski

          Holy @!$%#!

          Now, as this story comes-out, it's looking like a political cover-up let her off for murdering her brother, and then destroyed the records.

          This may get so ugly that you won't want to believe it.

          If they can find-out who is responsible for letting her off the hook, they are going to fry for what she went on to do.

          • 1 vote
          #9.6 - Sun Feb 14, 2010 2:06 AM EST
          Reply
          Raised In the South

          Where do I began, stress and isolation plays tricks on the mind. There has to be more to the story and it will all come out as her background is fully explored. My heart aches for those families that has lost a love one. Now the question is, "Where will this happen next?"

          Terrorism is alive and well and as the quote goes "We have met the enemy and it is us" All institutions need metal detectors at all entrances, law enforcement cannot be everywhere, nor should it be. We have to police ourselves, we are crumbling around the edges.

            Reply#10 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 9:50 PM EST
            ARodg

            Carrying firearms is prohibited on the University of Alabama's campus. Good to see that gun control laws are having an effect.

            Somebody, quick, blame Bush...5...4...3...2...1...

            • 2 votes
            Reply#11 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 10:16 PM EST
            JmetheSad

            Bush is to blame.

            Did I make the time limit for that one?

            • 2 votes
            #11.1 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 10:19 PM EST
            Dennis270

            Hey, way to turn a tragedy into a political statement. Classless and tacky in 5...4....3...2...1.....

            • 2 votes
            #11.2 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 10:22 PM EST
            JmetheSad

            *Does a jig*

            Did that get high score on classless and tackiness?

            • 1 vote
            #11.3 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 10:23 PM EST
            ARodg

            so if not Bush, maybe its the teabaggers fault? Palin? Zionists?

              #11.4 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 10:26 PM EST
              JmetheSad

              DON'T TALK ABOUT MY TEABAGGERS LIKE THAT. SHAME ON YOU.

              ARodg

              Ok, I'm really done adding to you, I had my fun, but we shall not derail the seed any longer with irrelevant things. Leave your condolences and move on.

              • 1 vote
              #11.5 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 10:30 PM EST
              bonos_rama

              ARdog, too late. Some right wing radical already blamed Obama above.

                #11.6 - Sat Feb 13, 2010 1:10 AM EST
                Reply
                mike lonkouski

                Female shooter, that's novel.

                • 2 votes
                Reply#12 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 10:18 PM EST
                Tony Wlliams

                Alrighty then.

                Stay away from the school water fountains because it must be something in the water. This is the second shooting at a school in 3 days. They say trouble comes in 3's so now that we have a female shooter, a male shooter, and student shooters I'm wondering whats next.

                • 1 vote
                Reply#13 - Fri Feb 12, 2010 11:53 PM EST
                Al 616

                I'm wondering whats next.

                Planet of the Apes.

                • 2 votes
                #13.1 - Sat Feb 13, 2010 1:11 AM EST
                Tony Wlliams

                To late we already have that one going on. You ever watch the Senate in session? Looks like a children's playground on steroids.

                • 2 votes
                #13.2 - Sat Feb 13, 2010 1:29 AM EST
                Reply
                Smelly FishDeleted
                kevinkendall

                Why try to come up with reasons for cause?

                The woman was a nightmare rage scene just waiting to happen, from what I've read & if what I read is true. Bishop was mentally ill, to pin the cause very specifically down. VERY mentally ill, to eliminate the lives of 3 people, 3 co-workers, on the spot. Which may have been planned, unless she had a permit to carry a concealed weapon and for whatever reason, did carry a handgun in her purse or wherever she might have.

                Here's a clue for those of you who didn't read the story fully:

                While being led away, it is reported that she said out loud, over & over, "No, they're still alive! They're still alive!"

                Apply rational explanations to someone who says things like that in response to the consequences of their irrationally destructive behavior?

                Are YOU so-minded people out of YOUR minds?

                3 people died because though Bishop may have been recognized as being a nutcase, apparently any recommendations which were made (I would hope) that Bishop be psychologically evaluated at the very least, as an employee of that school, was not carried out. And so 3 people died. The criminally insane mind recognizes no limits, no mores or morals, nor gender. THAT is the cause of the tragedy. Had it not been the redaction of her tenure, it would have been something else, sometime, her mental health left unexamined. An isolated case, made super-public. Let's not get hysterical now. She was & is a mentally extremely ill individual, and that, in my opinon, is all that needs to be said as far as the determinations of "cause" are concerned.

                  Reply#15 - Sat Feb 13, 2010 4:27 AM EST
                  Vincent Bartning

                  Everyone needs examination? I suppose I'd side with that, but that would mean you and I would also need the same evaluations, Kevin.

                  Yeah, it's crazy, but we're human, not robots, right?

                  It sounds like she deserved tenure besides. However, some tenured professors should have theirs taken away--at least in my experience at least one of the public schools I attended as an undergraduate.

                  Best regards!

                  • 1 vote
                  #15.1 - Sat Feb 13, 2010 10:07 AM EST
                  StephenToo

                  It sounds like she deserved tenure besides

                  What do you base that on?!?

                    #15.2 - Sun Feb 14, 2010 12:28 AM EST
                    Smelly FishDeleted
                    Reply
                    Marcel Villa

                    Sean Boi, Ga Guy,

                    Under normal circumstances both of you are right. The private sector mostly provide the job along with some government jobs. The problem is this is not normal circumstances. The private sector can't get credit to expand. The bank themselves is in sh$#@it hole and quite a number of them have declared chapter 11 bankruptcy. Even the big three (GM.Ford and Chrysler) is reeling from no sale with excessive drain on finances. Even cities are reeling. The real problem is there is not enough money to go around. The stimulus money is being given to banks to prop them up. The auto industry is being lent billions to soften the blow of monetary drain in their coffers and to pay off supplier to reduce the collateral job loss damage if these companies were not paid. Now, where did the money go--- Most of the banks used the money to pay off bonuses, pay off shareholders, maintain employee benefits and overall pay off salaries. What was expected: The banks to ease off credit by lending out more money. The Auto industry -to retool to produce high mileage cars and to lend money to prospective new car buyers. It is a duct tape solution. How can a bank loan money to people who is already having financial difficulties making both ends meet. How can people buy new cars when they can't even afford to pay the mortgage and the car loans. So with hundred of billions of dollars doled out the outcome for job creation falls way below expectations..Way way below. Up to the present time millions are still on the unemployment line. Therefore, the hands of the private sector is tied. What they needed is not just capital infusion. What they really need--very sorely needed --are people who will buy their product so they can hire people on a long term or permanent basis. The private sector as of the present is incapable of doing this. The time has come for government intervention to provide assistance in this respect. Granted, they did something but unfortunately as I have stated most of the projects are duct tape solution. Short term placement jobs that after a year most will go back to the unemployment line. Banks declaring quarterly bonuses in billions even if their situation is not yet stable. When the crunch comes back they will be back to get stimulus money because they will claim that they had repaid part of the total that they owe. Thus the circle will go on like a Ferris Wheel. The government must create a project that will generate income for the people that is going for the loan thus the bank will surely lend them the money because they will have the secure feeling that their money will be repaid with interest. The government can do this but they keep on using eggheads whose IQ goes over the roof but whose exposure to real life hardship and common sense application falls way below the standard needed to face this kind of problem. The government must get tough. One way to create job is to implement high mileage gas consumption. A 35 miles/gal city driving has already been achieved and so if the government will impose penalties for not achieving such a standard the Auto industry will have to respond. New hirings will be done for retooling. New designs will be done for fuel system. New research and development throughout the car industry will occur such as the search for lighter metal/plastic components. Research on bearings and movable parts to lessen friction. Research and development on car seats to make it more comfortable. It will generate new buyers because tax exemptions for use of non compliance will be removed. Thousands upon thousands of doctors. lawyers, sales people, executives will be forced to purchase new cars to avail of tax exemptions. these are people who can afford to buy new cars and will be forced to dole out their money. It will create jobs everywhere-from engineers, mechanics and line people. Companies will be forced to buy new fleet of cars to conform to the standard instead of paying off excessive bonuses.

                    This is just one example. Another would be to force homeowners to go to the bank to install an equipment that will save them so much in energy usage that it will be enough to pay off the borrowed money from the bank. The government can act as guarantor for the loan to the bank as long as they will offer a long term loan repayment to the homeowners. The money stays with the government and will not be doled out unless the homeowner does not pay his/her dues which would be nil because the equipment will generate the payment and will not necessarily come out of their pockets. Incidentally, the money actually at present is money being paid by homeowners to utility companies except that this time, the homeowner will generate the saving long after the loan is repaid. If this is initiated and implemented thousands upon thousands of homes will avail of the loan (4-5K) creating thousands upon thousands of credit loans and jobs. The beauty of this is that it will be a long term solution, creating permanent jobs and instill a sense of security back to the taxpaying public. By the way with respect to the car mileage, the government can put in a clause that purchases of non confoming vehicles up to the time the law is passed will be deferred from paying the penalty surcharge of approximately $3000-$5000 everytime their license is renewed every year for lets say a period of ten years but still lose the tax exemptions which will not be deferred immediately upon passage of the law.

                      Reply#16 - Sat Feb 13, 2010 2:09 PM EST
                      mike lonkouski

                      Sorry Marcel, but some of the things you have advocated are not only insane, but bordering on inhumane and evil.

                      As a matter of ideological experiment, some of the things you talk about are interesting case studies in how good intentions can evolve into total tyranny and disgusting corruption of fundamental human ideals.

                      • 2 votes
                      #16.1 - Sat Feb 13, 2010 4:26 PM EST
                      Reply
                      space guy

                      The private sector can't get credit to expand.

                      The private sector can get money to expand. This is a myth. However, since our wealth is draining away to the tune of hundreds of billions per year for foreign oil, we are all becoming poorer every day and poor people cannot afford to spend money, that would provide the demand that would drive the business cycle.

                      Another would be to force homeowners to go to the bank to install an equipment that will save them so much in energy usage that it will be enough to pay off the borrowed money from the bank.

                      Force me to get a loan? Are you serious? These energy savings that you are talking about are a myth as well. It takes ten years for a solar power system to pay back its cost, and that is if you do not consider the cost of the loan, which if you do doubles the time to pay back.

                      The amount of economic ignorance in your post is astonishing.

                      • 3 votes
                      Reply#17 - Sat Feb 13, 2010 4:14 PM EST
                      mike lonkouski

                      space guy

                      Force me to get a loan? Are you serious?

                      I don't think some of these people understand what they are saying. The think they are Mother Theresa, but they speak like Stalin.

                      Sometimes, it blows my mind when I hear what some people consider acceptable, it clearly demonstrates just how every single terrible thing in history was sold to the ignorant public.

                      Sometimes, these simpletons are scary with their ignorance coupled with their willingness to enforce that ignorance with force!

                      What some of these people suggest, is absolutely insane, and dangerous.

                      • 4 votes
                      #17.1 - Sat Feb 13, 2010 4:22 PM EST
                      Reply
                      Marcel Villa

                      mike and space guy,

                      I'm sorry about the wording. Wrong choice of words. I did not mean to force but literally to influence the homeowners to get loans. I unfortunately thought that everybody might read between the lines and get the message but everytime I forget that people at times are so busy that they don't have time to look at it passively. I am fully aware that forcing people to do things will certainly bring back reprisals so again I would like to reiterate, it is just a wrong choice of word. I'm mighty glad that you guys pointed it out. Show's how at times people could make a mistake by not being a linguist. As for the 35 miles/gal city driving, I know it is achievable. Hyundai had done it and if they could do it, I do not at anytime nor place believe that american ingenuity could achieved perhaps even surpass it. As to the penalty-long have I found that people if not given the incentive will always opt out of a problem by taking the easy way out. In essence, it prolongs the predicament until it is too late to solve it or it would create far more hardship than what it is really needed. The purchaser of old cars will have ten years to make up. The savings in gas consumption would defray the cost of buying new cars every 5 - 7 years since a high mileage car will not last as long as a high powered low mileage cars. Anyway, the benefits far outweigh the sacrifice. Gasoline will come down, oil consumption will come down, environmental concerns will diminish, people will have more money to spend, oil dependency from foreign countries will decrease and it will give time for american scientist to provide new source of safe energy and to dispose of its waste like nuclear energy, solid propulsion and hydrogen powered engines. There will also be time to research and reach possible solution to conserving sun's energy into batteries small enough to drive a 250 hp engines. To this I believe can be done because of the inane capacity of man's ingenuity to solve problems. Remember that way back in 1965 a company will need at least a 20 ft by 40 ft room to house a computer capable of storing 30 GB of information. Now it takes a laptop size computer to store 420 GB and still growing to store information aside from doing other programs at the same time. What is the backside of it. Oil and automotive industry will suffer a short period of transition. Auto indusry will rebound in less than 3 years of its implementation with more workers on the assembly line because more people can afford to buy cars. The oil industry will suffer the loss of off-shore drillings which will be good for environment but it will also remove the american dependence on foreign oil. The increase in domestic manufacturing will far outstrip the job loses from the oil industry because their numbers is miniscule as compared to the entire manufacturing industry. Americans will have to be inconvenienced by driving probably at most 100 miles per hour but that is all. Family numbers can be accomodated by bigger car once improvements on body frames and engine blocks weights are lowered. I know it can be done because I used to teach Power Plant and Machine Design. I also have extensive experience in Petrochemical processes in the oil industry. The problem is, my knowledge is basic and does not involved intimate research in both propulsion and body design. Also , to achieve most of the above you need a bunch of eggheads to work with, a physicist,engineers of various discipline, mathematician, an expert in nanotechnology and computer geeks all of which I might add is way beyond my comprehension. The government has to provide MIT and all those involved in Science enough seed money to dwelve into this. Some people can only advance opinions but others has to work on it to make it real. Just like an engineer can design a workable engine but once it starts to fail then a mechanic would far surpass him in making it work again. I know this for a fact because there are instances where it takes me hours to find a fault which a mechanic can do in 15 minutes.

                        Reply#18 - Sat Feb 13, 2010 10:32 PM EST
                        Marcel Villa

                        Mike and space guy,

                        I forgot to mention that the mileage standard is applicable only to personal vehicles but not vehicles needed to transport goods and manufacturing products. Trucks and military vehicles. Police and emergency vehicles. It would however include cars used for services only like taxis, company vehicles to transport personnel only and executive and sales personnel cars. Anything that is used to transport flowers in large quantities, carry tools of the trade like Oxyacetylene tanks and others should be included but people who are using personal computers can not be exempted or any other vehicle whose carry on will not exceed 200 lbs. which can easily fit inside the baggage compartment.

                          Reply#19 - Sat Feb 13, 2010 10:44 PM EST
                          space guy

                          I did not mean to force but literally to influence the homeowners to get loans. I unfortunately thought that everybody might read between the lines and get the message but everytime I forget that people at times are so busy that they don't have time to look at it passively. I am fully aware that forcing people to do things will certainly bring back reprisals so again I would like to reiterate, it is just a wrong choice of word.

                          No, you meant what you said, and you should defend it. All of the rest of your post is in the same vein and thought pattern. This would work in Soviet Russia but not here.

                          • 2 votes
                          Reply#20 - Sat Feb 13, 2010 10:46 PM EST
                          mike lonkouski

                          Marcel Villa

                          I forgot to mention that the mileage standard is applicable only to personal vehicles but not vehicles needed to transport goods and manufacturing products. Trucks and military vehicles. Police and emergency vehicles. It would however include cars used for services only like taxis, company vehicles to transport personnel only and executive and sales personnel cars. Anything that is used to transport flowers in large quantities, carry tools of the trade like Oxyacetylene tanks and others should be included but people who are using personal computers can not be exempted or any other vehicle whose carry on will not exceed 200 lbs. which can easily fit inside the baggage compartment.

                          But those are the one's doing most of the driving.

                          I respect you for re-stating your position.

                          I saw a guy describe a secret police force under the sole command of the President Obama, with pre-signed statements of Presidential Immunity to combat terrorism, and he didn't realize that he had just advocated for the SS.

                          Now, if you believe in advocating your stated ideals, through the same evolution as we have used to past to regulate emission standards and the like, then I will fully support your advocating for those changes.

                          Where I find ALL government directives offensive is when they find every crime is an excuse to generate revenue.

                          • 1 vote
                          #20.1 - Sun Feb 14, 2010 1:05 AM EST
                          Reply
                          Marcel Villa

                          Mike,

                          With regards to the high mileage standard. The first person who will suffer if this law is implemented is yours truly. I drive a 5 year old gas guzzler, a 20 MPG behemoth of a van in the city driving. It is capable of going places but as of now I just drive it in town. ergo, my need for the car is not sufficient enough to purchase a new one. I have calculated how much money I could save by buying a new high mileage car and relative to my age I found that I will never be able to recoup whatever money I will dole out before I conked out. So there is no incentive whatsoever for me to buy a high mileage car. However, I need a car to move around but if there is a surcharge of $3-5K every year that I want to put it out then I would not hesitate even for a minute to go to bank and make a loan to purchase a high mileage car. Why? Because it does not pay to keep the old gas guzzler. Until then, I will keep my old gas gussler until it dies down to its natural death or it makes it too dear to maintain. I believe this is what you call as looking after yourself and others may find it unnerving and improper but the truth is and I am not quizzy about it, I am not an angel just your everyday human being trying to survive with whatever is available and try to help out only if it possible.

                          With reference to the Germans: What they did to the jews is intolerable and they deserved to be castigated and chastised about it. And there are other things that they did that is not acceptable. But, in all instances, there are always some good things that people has done. Their economy is bankrupt because of the reparations they have to pay for WW1 but inspite of this, they were able to recover and become one of the strongest economy before the start of WW11. That is before they carried out unforgivable atrocities. The German people took the nazis government actions and literally followed it at great hardship for everyone to lift themselves up out of poverty. This and other character traits that they have like going to their death with dignity for whatever harm they did is something to admire. What they did is not acceptable but they carried their heads high even after they lose the war and again look at them now. They are one of the strongest economy ever known considering all their loses. I am not a german and possibly if I live during WW11 I and my family would be the first to be put on the wall and machine gunned. Why? Because I am not of the Aryan race nor am I blue eyed with blond hair. Thus, there is no reason for me to care or feel something for them. I look at these things on the basis of the good things that they did and the results. Their perseverance, their willingness to accept hardship for the faults of their government, their willingness to accept penalties and indignation of the world with their heads held high because they were looking into the future. A future which as you and everybody else know now is a Germany that abhors war and actually prosecute those of their own kind who have permitted atrocities to happen. So, if these good things that they did has originated from the SS or the Nazis or whatever else, do we then just junk and dispose of it as garbage or do we try to use it to benefit mankind. The past is past but the lessons of the past should not stop us from using whatever is good and junk whatever is bad. Let us not go forward with a narrow vision and just consider the bad things that happen. There is a lot of good things that we can harvest from History.

                          • 1 vote
                          Reply#21 - Sun Feb 14, 2010 12:05 PM EST
                          Deprece

                          It's an unforunate situation. Never heard of a woman going on a rampage. Now, back to 1986. She was 19 years old. Girls are not curious about guns. She didn't recall putting additional bullets in the weapon, but needed it check to unload it just in case. She said her brother, who was trained on how to use a weapon at the Rifle Club told her to point the gun up. She probably did know how to use a gun at that time afterall.

                            Reply#22 - Sun Feb 14, 2010 2:10 PM EST
                            Ash2010

                            This was an tragedy waiting to happen. The BrainTree ex-Police Chief needs to investigated and put behind bars. Imagine a 19-year old killing her brother point blank with a shotgun and attempting a car-jacking at gunpoint (with a witness in tow!) and the Police dropping all charges immediately and all traces of the car-jacking expunged with the entire records of the case missing since 1998! And I thought this sort of thing happens only in the South and the Third World!

                            This is shameful.

                            • 1 vote
                            Reply#23 - Mon Feb 15, 2010 10:14 AM EST
                            Craig19

                            I dont suppose that Janet Napolitano had her on her "list".

                              Reply#24 - Mon Feb 15, 2010 12:21 PM EST
                              Mare-1087762

                              Hogwash-let's see how her grip on reality is when they throw the switch. Or maybe let the families use her as target practice. Oh and don't forget to invite the poor woman she attacked at IHOP.

                                Reply#25 - Fri Feb 19, 2010 6:02 PM EST
                                space guy

                                From what people have told me here in Huntsville, she sat in the meeting for 40 minutes and then pulled her gun out and methodically pointed at the heads of her victims and pulled the trigger.

                                • 1 vote
                                Reply#26 - Sat Feb 20, 2010 12:43 PM EST
                                mike lonkouski

                                Well, I've spent a few hours in meetings where I would have preferred to eat broken glass, so it's not hard to believe.

                                  #26.1 - Sat Feb 20, 2010 1:14 PM EST
                                  Reply
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