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Future hiring will mainly benefit the high-skilled

Sun Sep 5, 2010 1:32 PM EDT
us-news, business, us, jobs, employment, future, apfn
Christopher S. Rugaber, AP Economics Writer
< PreviousNext >
showing 1 of 3 photos
<p>In this Sept. 2, 2010 photograph, Rev. Mark Hallinan, left, joins former janitors Martha Escobar, second from left, and Elva Polanco, both from Los Angeles, as they deliver a letter intended for J.P. Morgan Chase CEO Jaime Dimon to Patrick J. Bradley, V.P. Global Security and Investigations J.P. Morgan Chase, during a demonstration to call on Dimon to create jobs, not destroy them, in New York.  (AP Photo/Mary Altaffer)</p>

In this Sept. 2, 2010 photograph, Rev. Mark Hallinan, left, joins former janitors Martha Escobar, second from left, and Elva Polanco, both from Los Angeles, as they deliver a letter intended for J.P. Morgan Chase CEO Jaime Dimon to Patrick J. Bradley, V.P. Global Security and Investigations J.P. Morgan Chase, during a demonstration to call on Dimon to create jobs, not destroy them, in New York. (AP Photo/Mary Altaffer)

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— Whenever companies start hiring freely again, job-seekers with specialized skills and education will have plenty of good opportunities. Others will face a choice: Take a job with low pay — or none at all.

Job creation will likely remain weak for months or even years. But once employers do step up hiring, some economists expect job openings to fall mainly into two categories of roughly equal numbers:

— Professional fields with higher pay. Think lawyers, research scientists and software engineers.

— Lower-skill and lower-paying jobs, like home health care aides and store clerks.

And those in between? Their outlook is bleaker. Economists foresee fewer moderately paid factory supervisors, postal workers and office administrators.

That's the sobering message American workers face as they celebrate Labor Day at a time of high unemployment, scant hiring and a widespread loss of job security. Not until 2014 or later is the nation expected to have regained all, or nearly all, the 8.4 million jobs lost to the recession. Millions of lost jobs in real estate, for example, aren't likely to be restored this decade, if ever.

On Friday, the government said the August unemployment rate ticked up to 9.6 percent. Not enough jobs were created to absorb the growing number of people seeking work. The unemployment rate has exceeded 9 percent for 16 months, the longest such stretch in nearly 30 years.

The crisis poses a threat to President Barack Obama and Democrats in Congress, whose hold on the House and Senate appears to be at increasing risk because of voter discontent.

Even when the job market picks up, many people will be left behind. The threat stems, in part, from the economy's continuing shift from one driven by manufacturing to one fueled by service industries.

Pay for future service-sector jobs will tend to vary from very high to very low. At the same time, the number of middle-income service-sector jobs will shrink, according to government projections. Any job that can be automated or outsourced overseas is likely to continue to decline.

The service sector's growth could also magnify the nation's income inequality, with more people either affluent or financially squeezed. The nation isn't educating enough people for the higher-skilled service-sector jobs of the future, economists warn.

"There will be jobs," says Lawrence Katz, a Harvard economist. "The big question is what they are going to pay, and what kind of lives they will allow people to lead? This will be a big issue for how broad a middle class we are going to have."

On one point there's broad agreement: Of 8 million-plus jobs lost to the recession — in fields like manufacturing, real estate and financial services — many, perhaps most, aren't coming back.

In their place will be jobs in health care, information technology and statistical analysis. Some of the new positions will require complex skills or higher education. Others won't — but they won't pay very much, either.

"Our occupational structure is really becoming bifurcated," says Richard Florida, a professor at University of Toronto. "We're becoming more of a divided nation by the work we do."

By 2018, the government forecasts a net total of 15.3 million new jobs. If that proves true, unemployment would drop far closer to a historical norm of 5 percent.

Nearly all the new jobs will be in the service sector, the Labor Department says. The nation's 78 million baby boomers will need more health care services as they age, for example. Demand for medical jobs will rise. And innovations in high technology and alternative energy are likely to spur growth in occupations that don't yet exist.

Hiring can't come fast enough for the 14.9 million unemployed Americans. Counting part-time employees who would prefer full-time jobs, plus out-of-work people who have stopped looking for jobs, the number of "underemployed" is 26.2 million.

Manufacturing has shed 2 million jobs since the recession began. Construction has lost 1.9 million, financial services 651,000.

But the biggest factor has been the bust in real estate. The vanished jobs range from construction workers and furniture makers to loan officers, appraisers and material suppliers. Moody's Analytics estimates the total number of housing-related jobs lost at 2.4 million. When you include commercial real estate, the number is far higher.

One of them is Martha Escobar, who last month lost her $13.50-an-hour job cleaning an office tower owned by JPMorgan Chase & Co. in Century City, Calif. She was one of 16 janitors, mostly single mothers, who lost jobs as part of the real estate crunch that's squeezed landlords.

Some of them traveled to New York on Thursday to try to pressure JPMorgan to get its cleaning contractor to take them back, given that the bank earned $8.1 billion during the first half of this year.

"I don't know what I am going to do if I can't get my job back," Escobar, 41, said.

JPMorgan Chase spokesman Gary Kishner said the bank has no say over the layoffs, which he said are handled by the building's cleaning contractor.

On top of real estate-related job losses, manufacturing is likely to keep shedding jobs, sending lower-skilled work overseas. Millions who worked in those fields will need to find jobs in higher-skilled or lower-paying occupations.

"The big fear is the country is simply not preparing workers for the kind of skills that the country is going to need," says Gautam Godhwani, CEO of SimplyHired.com, which tracks job listings.

Sectors likely to grow fastest, according to economists and government projections, are:

— HEALTH CARE

The sector is expected to be the leading job generator, adding 4 million by 2018, according to Labor Department data. An aging population requires more doctors and nurses, physical therapists, home health aides and pharmacists.

Many of these jobs will pay well. Physical therapists averaged about $76,000 last year, according to the department's data. Others pay far less. Home health care aides earned an average of just $21,600.

Home health care and personal care aides are expected to add about 900,000 jobs by 2018 — 50 percent more than in 2008.

Jennifer Gamboa of Body Dynamics Inc., an Arlington, Va.-based physical therapy firm, says the drive to reduce health care costs should benefit her profession, which can treat pain less expensively than surgery. Gamboa plans to add two employees in the next year.

— INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY: Technology could be an economic elixir as computers and online networks expand ways to automate services, distribute media and communicate.

Companies will need people to build and secure those networks. That should boost the number of programmers, network administrators and security specialists by 45 percent to 2.1 million by 2018, the government forecasts. Most of these jobs will provide above-average pay.

Technology pay averaged $84,400 in 2008 — nearly double the average private-sector pay of $45,400, according to an analysis of the most recent full-year data by the TechAmerica Foundation, a research group.

— NEW INDUSTRIES: Deepak Advani, an IBM executive, has a title he says didn't exist five years ago: "Vice president of predictive analytics."

Companies and government agencies have amassed data on behavior ranging from shopping habits to criminal activity. Predictive analytics is the art of determining what to do with that data. How should workers' time be deployed? How best to target customers? Such jobs could grow 20 percent by 2018, the government predicts.

Still, economists say more will be needed to boost job growth. The answer may be some technological breakthrough akin to the personal computer or the Internet.

"Most big booms come from a particular sector that moves the rest of the economy," said Richard Freeman, a Harvard labor economist.

Technology spurred job growth after the 1982 and 1991 recessions. The PC became revolutionary in the early 1980s. Internet use exploded after the Mosaic Web browser was introduced in 1994. Housing eventually lifted employment after the 2001 dot-com bust.

"There's a lack of clarity on what the next big thing is going to be this time," said David Card, an economics professor at the University of California.

Until there is, many people will have to lower expectations and living standards as they enter fields with less pay and less job stability, said Dan Finnigan, CEO of online employment service Jobvite.

"People who are unemployed have to embrace this future that they are going to have many jobs," he said. "We will always be working on the next gig."

© 2010 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.
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Jump to discussion page: 1 2
Davy-755715

My God, I feel sorry for the kids today: Adjusted for inflation, average middle class pay is lower than it was for many years, and costs are in the stratosphere.

  • 11 votes
Reply#1 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 2:10 PM EDT
RI Mom

Not EVERY High School kid takes the SAT exams for college.

The rest of those kids need technical training that will benefit them for future employment.

Anyone in manufacturing will tell you that the skill set of HS grads here in the US is frighteningly slim.

We are lagging in 21st Century Math & Science classes for the GOOD service sector jobs.

High Schools need to be re-tooled for ALL the Vocational Training labs.

Educators need to realize that the salt of American prosperity, industry and self reliance goes way beyond the system we have now.

A good plumber, electrician, hospital lab technician, is a life saver.

Even those kids with SAT scores that earn them a spot in a college are having to take remedial courses.

SCARY

  • 13 votes
#1.1 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 3:17 PM EDT
Stop the ignorance.

Anyone in manufacturing will tell you that the skill set of HS grads here in the US is frighteningly slim.

We are lagging in 21st Century Math & Science classes for the GOOD service sector jobs.

And to think that one of the Republican/TPM biggest talking points is to get rid of the Dept. of Education!

Stupid is as stupid does.

  • 9 votes
#1.2 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 4:26 PM EDT
Davy-755715

In the mid 70's I started working in a union manufacturing shop at about $5.50/hr; adjusted for inflation, the same wage would be a little over $24 today. The gasps you heard were from investors and executives, who now want to keep more of it than ever, for themselves. So today, the same class of jobs (that haven't been exported to foreign countries) have gone to union-busting states, or only pay "globally competitive" wages, and/or often to those working for a pimp ("contract" employee).

From time to time we see articles like the above, about a "frighteningly slim" shortage of (fill in the blank). But the pivot point is the wage/benefits to be paid. Similarly, there is a severe shortage of business executives, stockbrokers, politicans, etc, willing to work for $60K with corresponding bennies; but tip the can like they've done, and any shortage magically disappears! Wouldn't it be neat if we could take the "work harder, get more education" approach, along with lower pay, for those on top, as well as those on the bottom?

  • 8 votes
#1.3 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 4:33 PM EDT
George-369262

Why should people take low-paying jobs, when they can be on the dole for life ? And have health-care.... a person doesn't even need to be an American citizen..... It is a no-brain[r]

As long as Americans allow the public sector unions, and their political allies, to control the K-12 public education, the outputs will continue to decline.... where I live, we spend the most per-pupil in the country, and have the lowest outputs in the entire western world....

  • 1 vote
#1.4 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 5:15 PM EDT
redball6072Deleted
blazera

"when they can be on the dole for life ? And have health-care"

I'm sorry, source please?

  • 4 votes
#1.6 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 5:42 PM EDT
photoguy69

George, Nevada has the lowest graduation rate and spends the 3rd least per pupil. On the flip side New Jersey spends the 3rd most and graduates the most pupils. Sometimes lack of money is the problem.

I think our schools do a pretty good job with the pupils that are sent to them to educate. Many have no parental supervision, not ready to learn, parents that don't see the value of education, and prospects for good jobs even if they do graduate.

You can blame unions all you want, but it is a red herring when it comes to our educational system.

  • 4 votes
#1.7 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 5:51 PM EDT
Ron Christman

The problem is here now in western Pennsylvania. Our unemployment is higher than what we want but not as high as the national average, but the real problem is finding people qualified to do the jobs. . . and it's not all jobs requiring college degrees. We have tens of thousands of Texans, Oklahomans, Louisianans, West Virginians and others from Ohio, Wisconsin, et al working in the Marcellus Shale gas fields. Texas based Range Resources is building a 180,000 sq. ft. regional headquarters and planning on adding more space. EQT is another big player. . . but a lot of Pennsylvanians don't have the skill sets to work these jobs in the field or in the office.

I've seen auto dealers advertising jobs in TV ads because they are having a hard time filling the jobs through normal channels. I know a doctor's office manager who received 45 job applications in the first wave of trying to fill a medical office position but only 5 were close to being qualified. She had to recruit more applicants. I can go on for quite a while but the bottom line is finding qualified people.

BTW - A major reason that I supported and continue to support President Obama is that, like the leaders of virtually every industrialized nation in the world, our president recognizes that for us to be competitive in the 21st century we need a healthy and educated workforce. That's why you see this administration and the Democrats in congress are working so hard on health care reform and education reform. They actually get it.

It's unfortunate that the Republicans and the fat cats at the top of the right wing have just the opposite agenda. Keep the middle class unhealthy so those at the top continue to make money even though we aren't manufacturing anything anymore, and keep the rank and file dumb so we continue to vote in right wing politicians who will maintain the status quo for the fat cats.

  • 3 votes
#1.8 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 7:38 PM EDT
Don Smith-973482

I think these articles are really missing-out on something here.

Companies have shut their doors to new workers. The ones they have kept have become incredibly productive just to keep their jobs.

We have a huge number of highly skilled workers who are aging... and quickly.

There are entire skill sets that are not being passed along. These folks are going to need years to transfer knowledge to the next generation and NO ONE is prepared to do that.

If this keeps up, there's going to be something of a "lost generation" coming, as Baby Boomers retire and there's no one capable of filling their shoes.

Corporations are killing themselves

  • 3 votes
#1.9 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 11:52 PM EDT
photoguy69

Don, I agree with that. I have seen it first hand with the telephone industry. All of the old timers that knew the systems have been bought out or layed off. Now it's darned near impossible to find someone that knows a lot of the plant equipment and special circuits.

I thought than when they allowed the cable companies to get into the phone business, it would make them improve customer service. However, the opposite has happened, the phone companies now are as bad as the cable companies are.

  • 1 vote
#1.10 - Mon Sep 6, 2010 12:07 AM EDT
California Militia

are you ready to give up on free trade and go back to fair trade?

  • 2 votes
#1.11 - Mon Sep 6, 2010 12:35 PM EDT
Davy-755715

Er, George? Be on the dole with health care for life? Couldn't be Social Security and Medicare, could it? With AARP as the union? I realize, it can be unnerving to go looking for the source of the problem, and see yourself in the glass.

  • 1 vote
#1.12 - Mon Sep 6, 2010 1:27 PM EDT
photoguy69

I've aways been for Fair trade. I thought Clinton caved too easily with the terms of NAFTA and did little to protect American interests.

  • 4 votes
#1.13 - Mon Sep 6, 2010 1:41 PM EDT
Reply
Dale95

Yep, it's coming to the point where you'll need a college degree just to flip hamburgs, just the right way of course, cause everybody else will have just disappeared, off the face of the earth, sort of speak.

I'm not laughing, I'm jacking one in, if you know what I mean!!!

  • 6 votes
Reply#2 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 3:09 PM EDT
RebootIt

You dont need a college education you just need a skill and be good at it. High school dropout here. I received 2 raises in 2009 and 1 in 2010. Unless you're set on being a doctor or lawer there are plenty alternatives to a formal education.

  • 3 votes
#2.1 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 3:50 PM EDT
Don Smith-973482

The trouble is that the college degree is a requirement just to level the playing field.

With the degree, you're even with everyone else.

No matter what you know, without the degree, you don't even get to play

Then, it takes lots of years of experience to get even, but you can't get ahead without that degree

  • 1 vote
#2.2 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 11:57 PM EDT
Dale95

It's a 'pay to play' scam.

  • 1 vote
#2.3 - Mon Sep 6, 2010 6:35 AM EDT
RebootIt

Don,

There are other ways to enter the playing field. I joined the military and got a solid background in IT. No degree, high school diploma or even any real certifications. But in the small to medium business world they do not really care. They only care about if you can do the job or not. Will I ever work for Qualcomm or IBM? No. Public companies treat techs like slaves, underpay and make you work weekends. No thanks. If I wanted to make real money I would open my own business. All you need is $16.00 for a business license and a good idea. But if someone wants to work for me they will need a degree. Got to love the system.

    #2.4 - Tue Sep 14, 2010 2:51 PM EDT
    markpup

    Rebootlt - you're correct I think but in my experience large especially Fortune 500 companies are slavish about the college degree. It's kind of stupid I've been in IT for over 25 years and I can say without doubt a 4 year degree is not required to be good at it. If you have the talent I can get you 100% marketable in 4 months and have you productive in 1 month. I have a college degree so I know I'm not biased about this. I've often seen highly qualified people not getting promoted because they don't have the degree and total morons get promoted because they do. When I interview I couldn't give a rat's butt about the degree I don't even ask technical questions my one question is what are some problems you had and how did you solve them? I can figure out my candidates by how they answer that.

    You're right about how techs get treated but there are a lot of jobs out there that aren't so slavish you have to learn to find them. One exception is the H1-B they are slaves by definition - I don't like H1-B but I hate it when the people aren't at least treated with respect I've seen them abused horribly in some cases and that's not right.

    Starting your own business - most businesses fail it's a hard life I did it and got out. 16 for a business license? What state do you live in I know it's not California!!

      #2.5 - Tue Sep 14, 2010 3:06 PM EDT
      Reply
      Head-Negro

      that why they dont want to extend employment benefits those old jobs are not coming back

      the new jobs are being shipped overseas or will be outsourced

      • 9 votes
      Reply#3 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 3:28 PM EDT
      roketboy

      The GOV even now outsourcing military base security during wartime, dosen't end.

      • 6 votes
      #3.1 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 6:47 PM EDT
      Don Smith-973482

      Yeah, roketboy.. that's really crazy. It shouldn't be happening

        #3.2 - Mon Sep 6, 2010 12:02 AM EDT
        Reply
        Pretorian

        This is the kind of thing that makes one wonder if they are better off laying down their tools, and picking up an education degree to teach these kids some skills that will pay the bills. It was a big mistake to shut down the auto shops and metal shops in high school. So long as there are automobiles you will need mechanics, so long as there is electricity you will need electricians etc. There are a few trades out there that are needed hands down. The issue is whether or not there is going to be a glut of these folks driving down price and by default wage. I use the term Computer Nerd with affection as my brother is one, and he makes more than what I make owning my own shop working for someone else with far better hours overall. That said so long as my customers are happy my job is secure, I do not have to put up with the insane whims of others so to speak.

        The times are a changing, and people will be struggling to find a place. This is neither the first time nor the last. It is going to come down to individual reliability, flexibility, and dogged determination to make it. At the end of the day no one owes anyone a job or an income. It is a harsh fact but it is the truth.

        • 3 votes
        Reply#4 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 3:33 PM EDT
        Pretorian

        This is the kind of thing that makes one wonder if they are better off laying down their tools, and picking up an education degree to teach these kids some skills that will pay the bills. It was a big mistake to shut down the auto shops and metal shops in high school. So long as there are automobiles you will need mechanics, so long as there is electricity you will need electricians etc. There are a few trades out there that are needed hands down. The issue is whether or not there is going to be a glut of these folks driving down price and by default wage. I use the term Computer Nerd with affection as my brother is one, and he makes more than what I make owning my own shop working for someone else with far better hours overall. That said so long as my customers are happy my job is secure, I do not have to put up with the insane whims of others so to speak.

        The times are a changing, and people will be struggling to find a place. This is neither the first time nor the last. It is going to come down to individual reliability, flexibility, and dogged determination to make it. At the end of the day no one owes anyone a job or an income. It is a harsh fact but it is the truth.

          Reply#5 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 3:34 PM EDT
          AlphaDogReporter

          The U.S. high school dropout rate is at 30%. This comes from parents who don't give a rat's rear if their kids get an education or not. A lot of countries have high school dropout rates of less than 10%. People that cannot even muster up a high school diploma are most likely going to be stuck in low-paying jobs permanently. There may be a few exceptions but not many. There is no fix to this in my mind. A huge segment of American culture has shifted too greatly into a mindset of embracing ignorance and will most likely stay there from now on.

          • 2 votes
          Reply#6 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 3:54 PM EDT
          Brad-436809

          I remember when the advice to every kid in the late 80's/ early 90's was to get a career in high tech....then the tech bubble burst and most of the tech jobs were outsourced to India and now China. You have to take these predictions with a grain of salt. I agree with Pretorian about the importance of learning a skilled trade. College is not for everyone and it shouldn't be considered a sign of failure to go for a skilled trade. AlphaDog made an important point as well.....seems these days that kids who are not college bound just give up ( along with their parents) with their education. Learn a trade and the reading and math skills skills required to succeed in that trade.

          • 3 votes
          #6.1 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 4:31 PM EDT
          Brad-436809

          I would raise the legal age to drop out of school to 18 nationwide or 16 if he or she can pass a GED or some other standardized test proving they can function in society as an adult.

          • 1 vote
          #6.2 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 4:36 PM EDT
          checkerbattery

          You can't force someone to learn, plus the biggest problem today is too many kids who aren't there to get an education. The problerm is high school and even college to a large degree offer little true value in the job market. If high school offered the skills to at least get a good entry level job you'd have no trouble keeping kids there.

          • 2 votes
          #6.3 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 7:16 PM EDT
          RebootIt

          Correct.

          By the age of 15 I was so depressed and had a terrible relationship with my parents I simply gave up on life. My dad or mom would drop me off at school and I would just walk off campus and head to the mall right in front of them. My dad would literally beat me for it but I did not care and would do the same thing the next day. I ran away at 16 and joined the Navy at 19. Luckily the military showed me how to respect myself and I have a great life now. No formal education but I have a damn strong skillset in IT thanks to the Navy. After I got out I had no issues finding a well paying job.

            #6.4 - Tue Sep 14, 2010 4:47 PM EDT
            markpup

            RebootIt when I look at resumes to me having military training in IT is a plus. One guy here used to be in a submarine and his training was almost 2 years but down there it's extremely focused and his skills are first rate. I also tend to look for someone that doesn't just code or network they can take control of a whole app and group of business folks and run with it really take ownership. Ex-military folks have great training in taking charge even when they're young and making it happen I like that.

            Also a big plus for military training to me is you have life experience outside of school so your expectations are realistic. I regard it much more highly than a college degree.

            • 1 vote
            #6.5 - Tue Sep 14, 2010 5:00 PM EDT
            RebootIt

            "Bubble Heads" are for the most part very sharp. Not many of them can fit inside a sub so you have to wear many hats.

              #6.6 - Tue Sep 14, 2010 5:40 PM EDT
              Reply
              Angry Left-532262

              I have little sympathy for the people complaining about the illegal immigrants "taking their jobs"....if you can be replaced by a migrant worker with no skills and that barely speaks english, to me it sounds like you should go get some education and get a better job.

              • 4 votes
              Reply#7 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 4:00 PM EDT
              vol fan in chatt, tn

              ah, the compassionate left, ... Well, I have a college degree, and guess what? They aren't hiring. Nobody is hiring, so yeah, I work two and three crapola jobs just to pay the bills - it is a far cry from what I was making 3 years ago.

              • 2 votes
              #7.1 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 4:26 PM EDT
              Angry Left-532262

              Maybe you should move out of Chatt TN...Seattle has tons of jobs......

              http://seattle.craigslist.org/jjj/

              Or are you like the rest of the "pull yourself by the bootstrap hardworking Americans that will work any job" and expect the jobs to come to you.

              • 7 votes
              #7.2 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 4:42 PM EDT
              Dog_Blue

              Seattle has plenty of jobs? Doing what grinding coffee beans at starbucks?

              • 1 vote
              #7.3 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 4:54 PM EDT
              Angry Left-532262

              Not hardly....look through the craigslist....or even check out NWJOBS.com

              Just don't bring any right wing baggage with you....we are a blue city.

              For an unskilled person

              LANDSCAPER $16 hr. SOUTHEND (Kent)

              for computer types

              ASP .NET C# Software Engineer # 254521 w/ housing allowance (Richland , WA)

              for science types

              Research Lab Technician (VA Medical Center Seattle)

              or

              Microbiologist (Shoreline, WA)

              • 4 votes
              #7.4 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 4:56 PM EDT
              markpup

              You can make 16 an hour as a landscaper with no prior experience?? Really?? I suspect to make that you do need some prior experience - but I could be wrong.

              If what you say is true I'm sending my nephew just outside of Portland up there.

              On Starbucks - my friend's daughter works there and now she's one of the store managers and making pretty good $$ if you show some interest in becoming management they're great and have lots of opportunities for that!!

              • 1 vote
              #7.5 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 5:12 PM EDT
              Angry Left-532262

              http://seattle.craigslist.org/sno/lab/1933333652.html 10-15ph

              http://seattle.craigslist.org/sno/lab/1916822559.html

              http://seattle.craigslist.org/see/lab/1925004669.html 15ph

              http://seattle.craigslist.org/est/lab/1916412582.html 12ph (at a golf course I know...very nice)

              http://seattle.craigslist.org/see/trd/1914075121.html 10-12ph

              The refernced 16ph is here but reading it they want 2 years exp. http://seattle.craigslist.org/skc/lab/1937869502.html

              • 3 votes
              #7.6 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 5:16 PM EDT
              George-369262

              Angry Left-532262: Good to know there are jobs available anywhere.... as far as being a 'blue city', nobody is perfect...

                #7.7 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 5:27 PM EDT
                markpup

                Thanks for the listings!! Most of these look like good starter jobs some of these even have health benefits which is pretty cool. I know a lot of guys like to work outside instead of in an office.

                Over the years I met a lot of young people from the South who come out here (I'm in southern CA) to work and appreciate our job availability, dynamic lifestyle and the pleasant climate. I just hired a young man from Alabama and he's working out really well!

                We're at over 12% unemployment right now but I think most of it is because lots of people that earned big 5 years ago can't handle being cut way back but there still are a huge number of opportunities for young people just starting out also I'd warn it's very expensive to live here but a lot of young people ride public or take the bike and have roommates to cut back on rent. And for recent college graduates a huge number of companies out here offer internships they don't pay that great but they're wonderful starting experience.

                  #7.8 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 5:33 PM EDT
                  Angry Left-532262

                  I think we are blue enough to "chase" most really red people away (at least to eastern washington). That leaves alot of jobs open for people that can at least "accept the blueness".

                  You do see some W stickers here and there......You will very rarely see a McCain one...Dino Rossi does kind of have a following but he can't win....he's run for governor a few times now and can't win....even against Gregoire...and she's a moron.Not to mention most people really like Patty Murray......she is one of the few who will actually answer her emails personally (sometimes).

                  We do have the solstice (gay) parade, where they ride through town on bikes naked, and we do have the worlds largest pot/hemp celebration every year. Capitol Hill is gay/junkie/whatever oddness you can imagine centralized, but you can go a couple miles out of the city and have things like Mt. Rainier or the rainforest on the peninsula....enough for any sportsman/outdoorsy type for a lifetime. .....you certainly have to be a certain type to be happy here though.

                  • 4 votes
                  #7.9 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 5:37 PM EDT
                  vol fan in chatt, tn

                  Angry Left, I can't leave where I am - I am a caregiver for my elderly mother. Maybe you should quit painting with such a broad brush, like you know the intricacies of somebody eles's life.

                  BTW, one of my current part times job came off craig's list. 2 years ago the local paper had 8 pages of job listing- today's paper - 1 page.

                  • 1 vote
                  #7.10 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 11:26 PM EDT
                  Dreama

                  When I moved back to Florida, I was on craigslist looking for a job. There are hundreds of job listings on craigslist... the problem that I found was that over half of them were some type of scam. for instance, they want you to apply online and send you to a "secure" webpage to do so, only to find out that they need to do a credit check and of course need your credit card to do so... You can't just say "look at craigslist, there are plenty of jobs" because no there aren't.

                  BTW in case you were wondering I ended up going through a temp service which has been great :)

                  • 1 vote
                  #7.11 - Mon Sep 6, 2010 10:51 AM EDT
                  Angry Left-532262

                  Fine like I said check http://www.nwjobs.com/

                  or http://www.indeed.com/

                  There are jobs here....I'm sorry Chattanooga Tenn, Duluth Minn, Clearwater FL and tookiedoo SC and other small towns are not hiring...those small towns will probably never hire again.

                  People can't sit in their little one stoplight towns and expect to have jobs just show up there. The Piggly Wiggly, Wal-Mart, the gas station and the pawn shop can only hire so many people.

                  You can believe there are no jobs out there anywhere....I say you are wrong....just at my job alone we are looking for tons of people....https://erecruit.fhcrc.org/Erecruit.htm

                  155 jobs open this AM. At least 4 of those are in my department.

                    #7.12 - Mon Sep 6, 2010 1:56 PM EDT
                    vol fan in chatt, tn

                    I have done the indeed site, too. Pretty good site, actually.

                      #7.13 - Mon Sep 6, 2010 4:58 PM EDT
                      Reply
                      Bighorn

                      This is nothing new in the business world. If a employer is looking for a well qualified educated professional to fill a position the employer wants to hire the most qualified person that can be found for the then going salary rate. Just because you are a highly skilled professional does not mean you are home free. You better look employable, long term residents of the state you are in that have a college degree from a well named college or university located in your state usually are preferred over people from other states. Be sure that you can politically connect with the firm you want to work for. A law firm will not hire a conservative republican and most high end government jobs go to democrats. Do you home work when looking for a job.

                        Reply#8 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 4:26 PM EDT
                        photoguy69

                        Bighorn, i take issue with you assesment that you need to be politically connected with your employer. I am quite skilled and my current employer doesn't care if I were a communist, they want results and that's what I give them. It may be harder to get your foot in them door but it can be done.

                        The most important thing we look for when hiring is attitude. We want people that are able to think for themselves and have an honest work ethic. Our engineers and technical staff have to work by themselves often and with no direct supervision.

                          #8.1 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 5:31 PM EDT
                          Ron Christman

                          Bighorn, I agree with photoguy. I coach and teach as a small Christian university (that doesn't have national name recognition) and I can tell you that if you get good grades, find a decent internship, and can add a few (legitimate) things to your resume like mission and service work, leadership in campus organizations and/or athletics, and even attempt to develop mentors before your senior year; you will get a good job in your chosen field or get into the grad school of your choice and then a good job in your field. Virtually 100% of my graduating student-athletes do it every year.

                          • 1 vote
                          #8.2 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 7:52 PM EDT
                          Reply
                          ADad-1477522

                          So in other words, druggies (high)ly or prostitutes (skilled labor)

                          • 2 votes
                          Reply#9 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 4:29 PM EDT
                          blazera

                          so we're just utterly at the mercy of the top class.

                            Reply#10 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 4:37 PM EDT
                            markpup

                            Wow I'm curious what's being done to stop the new skilled jobs from being outsourced or compromised by H1B.

                            Bighorn - good advice!!! I'm an IT guy and I often interview candidates for positions. My additional advice is do some research on the company you're interviewing at if you show an interest and some knowledge in the product the company makes or how they make their money, that will be a real standout!!! I'm amazed how few people do it.

                            • 4 votes
                            Reply#11 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 4:40 PM EDT
                            RF373Deleted
                            redball6072Deleted
                            photoguy69

                            What i would really like for someone to explain to me is, how are we going to grow as an economy as a service sector dominated economy? If we are not exporting products, then we can not offset the finished goods imports we are getting. This will cause us to continue to increase the debt we owe to the rest of the world. This is not sustainable in the long run.

                            • 1 vote
                            Reply#14 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 6:00 PM EDT
                            Jackie-2303788

                            so often getting advice on how to deal with the lack of job opportunities is so frustrating and makes me angry when it comes from those who are retired and living off their investments and pensions or who haven't had to live in the real world because they are set up by trust funds or fore fathers. I have been in the same industry for 30 years...worked all my life, ten more years to retirement (well maybe not now), 401K and stocks went to the toilet, paid for two children to be educated after I sold my home. I rent a home because it is more affordable, I earn 50% less than I was making in the last ten years. I am doing what most former "middle class americans" are doing, living very modestly..barely surving and watching my credit become that of the "lower class" and being treated accordingly by creditors. I am learning to cope with "you better get used to this economy because it is not going to get better anytime soon, and by the way can you donate money for one the national disasters.."

                            Here is my advice for a job source...Network!! Word of mouth ! talk to your friends and former co-workers and people in the industry. Craig's list and worksource are the poor mans route, or at least you will be poor by the time you do get an interview and that is only if your application makes it past the paper shredder because they are overwhelmed with applications.

                            In some cases my friends have preferred unemployment as the benefits are often better than the wages being paid these days. Collect benefits, do cash jobs here and there, go to the local food bank, get on the local power budget plan, ride a bus and apply for low income housing. It's the American way!!

                              Reply#15 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 6:47 PM EDT
                              John Haskins

                              Oh, this Bitter Earth.....Behold, we are on the edge and the beginning of the ' Brave New World '. All things fictional, eventually become reality. For those who never read the story or know of it's content. There will only be three classes. The elite, the workers, or drones [ blue collar ] and the normal humans left, which are cast out of society. Today's name for these classes are the Rich, Middle Class and the Poor. Tomorrow as we have come to know it , is dead...Get use to it, weather you are democrat, republican, independent, liberal, Far Right or Far Left or anything in between. Too the old, your only hope of survival until you die, from this day forward, is Social Security, and to the youth of America, there is no Hope, Black or White, elite or poor. Corporations now run America and control even our President, Congress and all of the American society. A civil War of the classes, is a worthless idea, as it has become too late. This is the fruit of progress and the change can not be stopped. They want you to believe as today's media minds try hopelessly to interpret these events and changes, that 2014 will be different, only to know that the 5% unemployment rate will represent the specialized professionals having jobs while 95% of the regular folks will either have no jobs or will work for survival in trying to stay alive. Today we have well over a 1000 different occupations, but imagine in 2014 and beyond, we will probably have roughly 100 employable occupations which will be very selective. Your best bet and only choice is to get re-educated, and do it now, while this government will pay the cost of a free education, as your present financial qualification to obtain these grants are available. You have no other choice, and I mean seriously..No other choice. Stop wasting time and auguring on who's fault it is and who to blame. It will be your fault if you do not act now. All the lies and mis directions in these articles, and finally, this article is the secret released in plain and simple terms, and it is the truth. There are more than 15 million people out of work and those in the service and manufacturing fields, which they say is over 8 million workers, will NEVER be called back nor offered a job again in those related industries, and those occupations represent 900 of the available 1000 occupations on record. I am 58 years of age and I have been unemployed for nearly two years, and I have a degree and a many viable skills and the only hope presented to me, is I must live to be 62, and hope they do not increase the eligibility year to 63 or 64, or I will be better off if I just Die first. There is no more time to laugh, or guest or be ill prepared. It is not a recession or depression to use as an excuse. This situation was deliberately created, and if you sit back and B.I.T.C.H and cry...Well it will not be the faults of who you want to blame, but it will be all yours......

                              • 1 vote
                              Reply#16 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 7:16 PM EDT
                              BLOGER-486140

                              This is why the stimulus didn't produce the jobs it was suppose to produce in the United States. Every Time someone bought something we got a retail/service job in the US and Asia got a manufacturing job. Half the stimulus employment went overseas.

                              • 3 votes
                              Reply#17 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 7:35 PM EDT
                              photoguy69

                              I agree that a good deal of the stimulus tax breaks did go overseas. However the infrastructure improvements were a good investment in our economy IMHO.

                                #17.1 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 7:43 PM EDT
                                Reply
                                kanyiDeleted
                                john-482021

                                If we were not so overpopulated, every life would be important and the corporate leaders would see to it that each individual would get a good education. As it is now, the successful people love to talk down to the poor and say they are just lazy and no account and that is the reason they are where they are. It would be nice if each life was important to us but it will never be.

                                • 2 votes
                                Reply#19 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 8:33 PM EDT
                                Nostracomas

                                I've seen these so called specialized skills - These skills are also called the 'Peter Principle' (look it up). Most of the ones with the 'specialized skills' are responsible for the high unemployment figures we now have so what's the difference if they hire more of them. S O S - goodbye middle class, hello big money. I say don't take that low paying job - let the 'suits' sweat for a while - most of them would have a stroke if they had to get off their a$$e$ and actual earn their salaries.

                                • 2 votes
                                Reply#20 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 8:48 PM EDT
                                writer21177

                                Very quickly those highly skilled speciality jobs will become saturated with applicanst and they will be in the unemployment lines with everyone else. It is already happening with nurses. I know people who have received nursing degrees and can't get a job because they don't have experience. Welcome to China.

                                • 2 votes
                                Reply#21 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 10:32 PM EDT
                                Bob-970091

                                The reality is the amount of education and experience increases with each generation. If we expect a wage/salary premium, and we expect it to increase faster than other nations', well hello..we are increasing the premium for our services which means we best be widening the gap in what we offer versus other nations.

                                  #21.1 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 10:44 PM EDT
                                  photoguy69

                                  Bob, once again you have posted something that not ony doesn't make sense, but it isn't a replay to writer's post.

                                    #21.2 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 10:53 PM EDT
                                    Bob-970091

                                    What is a "replay" to a writer's post?

                                    LOL-You mean reply.

                                    It's a global economy, pal, and we need to constantly be increasing what we have to offer.

                                    Up to the challenge?

                                      #21.3 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 10:59 PM EDT
                                      photoguy69

                                      Bob, I have prospered during this economic downturn, my specialized skills and the fact that I am good at my job ensure that I will have a job. I spend a great deal of time getting more educated every year to stay competitive with my peers and outwork people half my age. I have worked my whole life, since 15 and have only been without work twice in my life, never collected unemployment or welfare. Worked for as little as $1 hr a couple of times. Yeah, I think I'm up to the task.

                                        #21.4 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 11:13 PM EDT
                                        Bob-970091

                                        Good for you. It's been a superb decade for me as well, and the 90s were pretty good, too.

                                        Now hopefully the environment for the next several generations will be better than todays.

                                          #21.5 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 11:34 PM EDT
                                          photoguy69

                                          As long as there are criminals and terrorists, I will have work. Guess I am safe unless everyone decides to play by the rules, not a good bet though.

                                          As long as we do not address the trade and job imbalance, we will go from bubble to bubble and will continue to see our earning power as a country deteriorate. If the GOP does take the house, they had better take on these issues or they will be at the mercy of the electorate in two years. Things will only get worse if they don't.

                                          • 1 vote
                                          #21.6 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 11:49 PM EDT
                                          Bob-970091

                                          I suspect the percentage each 2 years who fall will continue to increase, and that's good. Long-term Congressmen were mainly skilled at bringing the pork home, a deficit problem up the road.

                                          As for trade, we;ll rise and fall largely based on how weak or strong the dollar is. What is made here has, by and large, been examined for whether sourcing here makes sense or not. In other words, if avoiding losing sock manufacturing were your goal, the horse left, and you are late closing the barn door. I'm a free trade fan, as to be frank, what is made here has been made more efficiently diue to free trade. Competition makes us stronger.

                                          But there will be ebb and flow to the stuff that stays here marginally (meaning cost gap is small given freight costs or just in time concerns), and that ebb/flow will be currency based. The slam dunk decisions of sourcing won't be modified due to currency fluctuations.

                                            #21.7 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 11:57 PM EDT
                                            photoguy69

                                            As long as year after year we import more than we import, there will be more and more influence of our policies by the country's that own our debt. When was the last time we ran a trade surplus? 1975. Every year since then we have bought more than we have sold.

                                            Free trade is good if you are at the top but this has caused us to become a nation that has exported wealth building manufaturing jobs in favor of cunsumption based retail and service sector jobs. This is an unsustainable model just as a company that loses money year after year finds itself in bankruptcy court. As a result of the free trade movement, we are begining to see wages reach an equiliblrium with country's that used to lag us. It's not that they have come up, we have lost.

                                            I am not the only one that feels this way, Jeff Immelt CEO of GE has indicated that we have outsourced too much of our manufacturing base. If we don't reverse the trend, we wil have nothing but consumers and no producers leaving us vulnerable to wild economic swings.

                                            Currency ebbs and flows wil move the needle some but even through times when the dollar is stong or weak, we have lost exports.

                                            Compitition is good as long as the field is level for all players. We should not be shipping jobs off to country's where enviromental laws do not exist. What right do we have to use another people's health to further our "live better at a lower cost" lifestyle?

                                              #21.8 - Mon Sep 6, 2010 12:39 AM EDT
                                              Bob-970091

                                              "What right do we have to use another people's health to further our "live better at a lower cost" lifestyle?"

                                              How are we doing that? To think we are implies that if we did not source from those nations, their lives would be better.

                                              Give other nations some credit. Not all Chinese are in rice paddies now, and 25 years ago, Indian IT professionals would be an oxymoron.

                                              Unfortunately, millions of Americans did not upgrade their skills, and as any astute businessman can tell you, "Those standing still are falling behind". The reason the group who failed to upgrade matter is socks were not going to stay here long-term, yet working in a textile factory was as good as it gets for them. I picked one industry, but we had millions of unskilled jobs that were destined to leave.

                                                #21.9 - Mon Sep 6, 2010 12:46 AM EDT
                                                photoguy69

                                                Does Bopahl strike a cord? The factory was located there specifically to avoid enviromental regulations of the surrounding countries and we certainy would not stand for the things that went on there to happen here. Do you really think there are no companies moving just across the border to Mexico to avoid the enviromental laws?

                                                The textile industry was always a largely low skill, low pay industry so moving it off shore really had limited effect. However, with every job shipped outside the country, there is one less job here.

                                                Upgrade skill set? Not everyone is capable of comprehending high tech job skills. What do we do with those people, just tell them sorry, you are no longer needed so go away because not only do we not need you but we will not give you any of our money either. We only need so many garbage haulers and other low skilled people.

                                                The problem I see with your outlook is that you see people as just a business commodity, like a piece of machinery, to be used and then tossed aside if a cheaper version is avaiable.

                                                • 1 vote
                                                #21.10 - Mon Sep 6, 2010 1:01 AM EDT
                                                Bob-970091

                                                "Upgrade skill set? Not everyone is capable of comprehending high tech job skills."

                                                And there are always jobs requiring minimal skill, which reap what they deserve-pay based on skill sets required.

                                                There is a fair market value for every job. Yes, labor is a commodity; it is up to the individual to personally do all in his/her power to EARN a price premium based on differentiating what he/she brings to the table.

                                                  #21.11 - Thu Sep 9, 2010 12:15 AM EDT
                                                  photoguy69

                                                  Bob, at a young age worked in a couple of low skill factory jobs. They were very boring and terribly monotenous. I would argue that some of the higher skilled jobs shouldn't be paid as much because of the pure drugery that many low skilled persons endure in their jobs. Before we had outsourcing, those jobs paid better and allowed for the middle class to expand. If we throw those that fall at average or under average intelligence under the economic bus, what are we to do about them and the few er jobs that are available to them? The simple fact is, we do not have jobs for all of the people that fall into those catigories. We only need so many manual laborer, gardeners, plumber's assistants, and parking attendants. We can not survive as a nation of service sector jobs in the long run. We either have to start producing something of value to export or get rid of all the one sided trade deals we have signed ove the last twenty years.

                                                  • 1 vote
                                                  #21.12 - Fri Sep 10, 2010 7:02 PM EDT
                                                  markpup

                                                  Hi photoguy69 - totally agree I remember in the 60's and 70's we always assumed if a young person was willing to work (well to be fair - at that time we're talking men not women) , you could have a middle class lifestyle and support a family. Today that's not possible you either need to be very well educated or able to start a successful business.

                                                  But besides the outsourcing, I think Americans are very much more wasteful and spendthrift than they were back then.

                                                  • 1 vote
                                                  #21.13 - Fri Sep 10, 2010 7:37 PM EDT
                                                  Reply
                                                  WatchTheOtherHand

                                                  By 2018, the government forecasts a net total of 15.3 million new jobs. If that proves true, unemployment would drop far closer to a historical norm of 5 percent.

                                                  Is this the same government that forecast that the unemployment rate wouldn't rise above 8% after the stimulus was passed?

                                                  As long as their are progressives in power, the unemployment rate will remain around 10%. Even in the global economic boom times, those progressive driven European economies had 8-10% unemployment. They keep people unemployed so that they are beholden to the government for their means of living. This gives the progressives a nice little voting block that will always be in their corner.

                                                  There will always be poor people because progressive politicians use them to keep themselves in power. The politicians promise them free money and the poor keep voting for them. The free money never comes of course, because if they were no longer poor they couldn't be counted on to vote for the politician that holds their leash.

                                                  • 1 vote
                                                  Reply#22 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 10:42 PM EDT
                                                  Bob-970091

                                                  Bingo, WatchTheOtherHand. If Social Service agencies were true to their mission, their goal would be to eliminate the need for their own jobs.

                                                    #22.1 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 10:46 PM EDT
                                                    Reply
                                                    bkoz

                                                    Ten yeas ago, I set down with three of my grandsons and ask, "where do you see yourselves in ten years? I ask the same question five years later. Fortunately none of them are in any financial problems today, they are all employed and doing well. They made a plan and worked a plan, it's that simple to succeed.

                                                      Reply#23 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 10:56 PM EDT
                                                      Bob-970091

                                                      That is the best gift you could ever give them-the knowledge that one cannot get where they wish to get,without planning over a long period of time.

                                                        #23.1 - Sun Sep 5, 2010 11:00 PM EDT
                                                        Reply
                                                        Tony Wlliams

                                                        The scary thing I'm seeing in the Technology field is that even when jobs are created they get out sourced. Companies are still getting a tax break for doing that. Kill that break and keep the jobs here where they belong. I trained the guy who replaced me and the only way he was able to do that was by moving back to India and taking a 15hr pay-cut.

                                                        • 3 votes
                                                        Reply#24 - Mon Sep 6, 2010 12:09 AM EDT
                                                        Bob-970091

                                                        I understand why that feels awful, and we should not offer a break on it, but the reality is even w/o a break, any job that can be done via the net will relocate unless a premium skill set is not available elsewhere, or face-to-face interaction is required.

                                                        From personal experience, though, most in the IT field, do seem to bounce back. I assume there was additional severence compensation tied to traing the new guy, so between that, and having a 21st century skill set, I'd bet you will end up ok up the road.

                                                        • 1 vote
                                                        #24.1 - Mon Sep 6, 2010 12:16 AM EDT
                                                        photoguy69

                                                        Bob, I know IT people that have been without work in their field for over two years because of outsourcing. I hardly think of that as bouncing back. Once agian we are reducing our standard of living to the lowest common denominator.

                                                        • 1 vote
                                                        #24.2 - Mon Sep 6, 2010 12:43 AM EDT
                                                        Tony Wlliams

                                                        Well I started my own contractor company after a short deal in buying and selling foreclosed homes. I also have an on site monitoring service for those contracts. I got lucky but I see a lot of people everyday that didn't. There is a guy working at Walmart who speaks 4 languages and has a Masters degree in engineering. He was my supervisors boss.

                                                        • 1 vote
                                                        #24.3 - Mon Sep 6, 2010 12:44 AM EDT
                                                        markpup

                                                        I'm an IT guy and have been for over 25 years.

                                                        Our middle/upper level management likes promotions and they know they can get it by "cutting costs" but the biggest lie they tell themselves and others is IT is cookie cutter and you can do it with little disconnected deams of people all over the world and all the little modules will just magically come together at the end - it never works. IT is not modular it is by nature custom - just like building a custom house or a custom surfboard everyone needs something special and different to get a good return on investment.

                                                        I've literally never seen a major IT outsourced project really succeed (but justified somehow in spectacular fashion by teams of management desperate for success). For any project to succeed it takes a team of real people working together - physically near each other - able to agree. The real devil on any major IT project is the little but endless details that need to be worked out you can't do that with groups 11 time zones and different languages apart . Spending 500K on an IT project that's worthless (then chasing it with 2 million because management won't admit it's a failure) is a lot worse then spending 1 million for a project that works.

                                                        One thing I do see is - slowly- I think we're starting to get it and a lot of the outsourcing is coming back. Strangely, despite the ugly economy IT is a bit of an island that's doing a little well.

                                                        And it would greatly help if the Feds penalized companies that outsource compared to companies that don't - and kill the H1B program.

                                                        • 2 votes
                                                        #24.4 - Mon Sep 6, 2010 1:48 AM EDT
                                                        Tony Wlliams

                                                        mark

                                                        I agree. Most of today's contract services just preform the install but it's equipment they have never seen before. Just having a basic understanding of the equipment but no working knowledge. Before all the out sourcing the installer was also trained on how to commission the equipment and how to trouble shoot it if something failed. Now the trouble shooting is done by remote when it should be handled on site.

                                                        • 1 vote
                                                        #24.5 - Mon Sep 6, 2010 2:18 AM EDT
                                                        Reply
                                                        Bob-970091

                                                        I know some who bounced back inside 1 year, with severence covering most of that year. In general, I suspect they will bounce back better than much of mfg and construction-which have been crushed for 2.5 years now.

                                                          Reply#25 - Mon Sep 6, 2010 12:49 AM EDT
                                                          Ferrari5k

                                                          No surprises here. The Left has created one of the most expensive education systems in the world with special attention paid to the Teachers Unions, and not the student. They have continually lowered the standards down to the lowest common denonimator in an attempt to "push the cattle through" without aquiring the necessary skills to move forward if a student does graduate. Most cities have a 40% drop out rate.

                                                          To those who blame either the students or the parents, it was the Teachers Union and DHS who made it clear they were in charge of raising the nations children, silencing parents concerns about questionable carriculums with threats of DHS or legal involvement.

                                                          We have the worst performing and most expensive Teachers Empire in The Western World thanks to these socialist and anyone who allowed their children to only rely on government education to prepare for life's financial needs deserve kids that will never make twice their age, which is considered the minimum amount needed to support a family comfortably.

                                                          As sub-standard as our government education is, it is free for most, through college for many of minority status, and so there is no excuse for not taking full advantage of what it does offer in order to learn enough to make your children marketable. It is extremely important the student and parent don't allow the Teachers to demonize success or somehow convince students that failure is acceptable or may even be rewarded.

                                                          • 1 vote
                                                          Reply#26 - Mon Sep 6, 2010 12:49 AM EDT
                                                          DJ-867199Deleted
                                                          q1111Deleted
                                                          Sgt America

                                                          Good Morning America, I'm glad that you finally all woke up. KIDS NEED EDUCATION!!!! Trust me, my time in the military has shown me a couple things about our young adults in America (myself included). First, they have the POTENTIAL to be smarter than any of you could ever imagine, but they are not challenged in todays schools. My personal oppinion as a father is that we all need to pick up where the schools lack and (i know this is a crazy idea) educate our children ourselves outside of the school environment, this would help us and the children. The second, is that the fact that our young adults are lacking in some skills when compared to their parents and just people older than them, isn't neccesarily a bad thing. These young people have communication skills (not traditional writing, but more in the sense that they can literally communicate with anybody in the world) that people even 10 years older will never have. These kids also have tech skills that they've grown up with that they can build upon like no other generation before them.

                                                          Trust me, as a 23 year old, I see a future of opportunity for a lot of my generation and the ones coming up through high school today. I think that we will take this world to places, and allow it to see things that it can't even imagine right now. For all the sceptics I want you to try to do the jobs that the young people that I work with are doing today around the world.

                                                          • 2 votes
                                                          Reply#29 - Mon Sep 6, 2010 4:38 AM EDT
                                                          q1111Deleted
                                                          sansan7Deleted
                                                          robertgiz

                                                          Every body say`s go to school get moore education well if you have no income and no job at all or one that does not pay the basic bills and there is no job training,schooling or help for the real people that need it ,so when are they going to round us up and eather enslaves us and make us work just for food,and that will be only what the want to give you and only if they fill you worked hard enough for it, the wealthy are creating this problem they sent jobs away so they only would have to pay people any were from 25cents ahour to1.25$ a hour so they could keep playing GOD with the real workers in america.

                                                          • 3 votes
                                                          Reply#32 - Mon Sep 6, 2010 10:28 AM EDT
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