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Job openings jump to near a 3-year high

Tue Feb 7, 2012 10:27 AM EST
business, politics, us, united-states, job-openings
Christopher S. Rugaber, AP Economics Writer
< PreviousNext >
showing 1 of 3 photos
<p>In this Feb. 2, 2012 photo, an auto worker assembles parts on the 2013 Dodge Dart at the Chrysler Plant in Belvidere, Ill. Sergio Marchionne, Chairman and CEO Chrysler Group, announced that Chrysler will add a third shift at the Belvidere Plant to begin production of the Dart. The number of available jobs jumped in December, nearly matching a three-year high reached last fall, a hopeful sign that January’s large job gain may continue. (AP Photo/Charles Rex Arbogast)</p>

In this Feb. 2, 2012 photo, an auto worker assembles parts on the 2013 Dodge Dart at the Chrysler Plant in Belvidere, Ill. Sergio Marchionne, Chairman and CEO Chrysler Group, announced that Chrysler will add a third shift at the Belvidere Plant to begin production of the Dart. The number of available jobs jumped in December, nearly matching a three-year high reached last fall, a hopeful sign that January’s large job gain may continue. (AP Photo/Charles Rex Arbogast)

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WASHINGTON — The number of available jobs in the United States jumped in December to near a three-year high, supporting other data that show a brighter outlook for hiring.

Companies and governments posted 3.38 million jobs in December, the Labor Department said Tuesday. That's up from the 3.12 million advertised in the previous month and nearly matches the three-year high reached in September.

Job openings in the private sector reached the highest point in almost three and a half years.

Still, overall hiring slipped, and the number of people who quit their jobs also declined. That suggests the job market still isn't as dynamic as it was before the recession.

Manufacturers, retailers and professional and business services all posted gains. Professional and business services include temporary jobs. But they also include high-paying positions, such as architects, engineers and accountants.

The report on job openings follows Friday's optimistic employment figures. Those showed employers added 243,000 net jobs in January, and the unemployment rate fell to 8.3 percent.

December was also a big month for hiring, but there were still 13.1 million people unemployed that month. That means an average of 3.9 people competed for each open job in December, the first time in four years that ratio was below 4 to 1.

In a healthy job market, the ratio is usually around 2 to 1.

It generally takes one to three months for employers to fill job openings. December's big jump in postings is likely one reason January's jobs report was healthy. But it also suggests job growth may continue in the coming months.

Job openings have rebounded since the recession ended in June 2009, rising 39 percent since then. But they are still far below the pre-recession levels of roughly 4.5 million.

And hiring hasn't kept up with job openings. It's risen only 11 percent since June 2009.

The slow recovery in hiring may be one reason the job market still seems sluggish to many people, particularly those out of work, even as the unemployment rate has fallen for five months straight.

The key issue is how the monthly net job change is calculated: It's additions to company payrolls minus subtractions. That net figure normally rises as hiring strengthens. But it can also rise even if hiring is weak— as long as layoffs and quits are relatively few.

Tuesday's report shows that most of the improvement in December's net gain of 203,000 jobs stems from lower layoffs and quits, rather than a pickup in hiring.

Layoffs dropped to 1.6 million in December, below the pre-recession monthly average of about 1.9 million. Last year, layoffs fell to their lowest annual total in the 10 years that the government has tracked the data, Tuesday's report showed.

At the same time, the number of people quitting their jobs, while rising, is also far below pre-recession levels. That's not such a good thing. Workers tend to quit when they find another job, usually with better pay.

A higher number of "quits" tends to signal a strong labor market, with lots more jobs and higher pay. With pay levels stagnant, not many jobs offer better opportunities. The result: a low-turnover labor market, with few being laid off, few quitting and moderate numbers of hires.

"It's kind of like when a musical chairs game comes to a halt," said Jason Faberman, a senior economist at the Federal Reserve Bank of Chicago. "Even with decent job growth numbers, it can still feel to the average worker like a stagnant labor market."

Any net job gains are still, of course, a good sign. They mean payrolls are growing, and consumer spending can grow. So can the economy.

But the low turnover helps explain why the job market may not feel much better to many people. Especially those without a job.

© 2012 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.
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  • Groups: Rational Progressive Party
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  • Public Discussion (72)
AlphaDogReporter

R.I.P. GOP

  • 17 votes
Reply#1 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 10:48 AM EST
LasVegasRocks

Yep, the Party of NO that has fought to discourage jobs and job growth should be eliminated from political discourse.

Except their attempt to destroy America, the republicans have done nothing to be in a position of governing.

  • 16 votes
#1.1 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 11:38 AM EST
Jenni-Oh

Obama victory party.

Solidified.

  • 14 votes
#1.2 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 11:51 AM EST
ValdeziscomingDeleted
mountainmike-1199289

Mitch McConnell must be flipping out right now. All that Republican obstruction of jobs legislation, then their downright sickening jobs legislation proposal to grossly overindulge "job creators" as if there has ever really been "trickle down" in human history. Have a cow Mitch. Flip out. Blow a gasket. Be sure to do it in front of a camera so people will see for themselves how sickening Republicans have become on this issue.

Here is the logic of my position in a "nutshell." If you are going to blame Obama for the lack of jobs during hard times, to be consistent you must credit him when employment bounces back. Otherwise you are a flaming hypocrite. You can't blame Obama and then turn around and now say the credit goes elsewhere. Especially to Republican governors when the factual evidence lines up generally behind Democrat governors. And extra especially when numerous Republican governors have taken office and laid of thousands of fire department, law enforcement and school personnel.

I don't think presidents have much impact on the employment, although presidents like Obama trying to pass legislation repeatedly is effort that should get full credit. The largest and richest corporations are the ones that control the employment and they have been raking in profits in America hand over fist, refusing to reinvest in American jobs, and outsourcing jobs to places like China where workers typically work 12 hour shifts for $17 a day while living in dorms between shifts. The definition of "sweat shops." The one and the same largest and richest corporations are paying little or no income taxes due to tax loopholes. So lets please call it for what it really is, ECONOMIC TREASON AGAINST AMERICA.

How Our Largest Corporations Made $170 Billion During The Great Recession and Paid No Income Taxes

http://www.forbes.com/sites/rickungar/2011/06/01/how-our-largest-corporations-made-170-billion-during-great-recession-and-paid-no-taxes/

  • 7 votes
#1.4 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 11:58 AM EST
mstanley2265

Valdez, extension of the Bush & Congress companies tax cuts ....only added to the deficit, it doesn't and didn't create jobs. Other aspects have entered into it, the fairly recent Free Trade to Asia for instance that President Obama pushed and other issues that the Administration is addressing, without the help of most of Congress..

  • 10 votes
#1.5 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 12:10 PM EST
Davy-755715

Maybe the extension of the Bush tax cuts was indeed a good decision!!

Snicker... (indeed)

    #1.6 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 12:54 PM EST
    judi fermanich

    Several companies with which I interact, either because I buy from them or because my friends do still are aware that middle income openings are in the Phillipines and elsewhere in the east because when calling customer service those are the persons answering the phone.

    Middle America is still on the hook. The tax break we got only increased the cost of mortgage by instituting a very small "tax" that we have not had a chance to vote on either for or against. It increases our mortgage payment approx. 1700. a year. So where is the tax break going? It sure isn't coming to you or me.

    The Senate came up with this "compromise" and the House agreed.l Once again the taxpayer takes it in the shorts and we had no opportunity to say nay. No politician should be in office for more than two terms. No officeholder should be allowed to receive lifetime benefits after screwing us no matter their lengh of time in office. Jeez, are we stupid or what?

    So jobs notwithstanding, no one in Washington seems to have our real interests in mind when passing these so called tax breaks and jobs bills. One takes money from one of our hands and the other "creates" jobs which go to quasi government employees, ie: works projects where government pays its own workers to fix roads and bridges. We give our money back with the other hand to that very government. Crooks in suits, or in windbreakers, I wish they were all in jail.

      #1.7 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 12:54 PM EST
      Brian-497171

      Maybe the extension of the Bush tax cuts was indeed a good decision!!

      I thought you all were calling them the Obama tax cuts, now.

      • 9 votes
      #1.8 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 1:06 PM EST
      ozzwald

      Valdeziscoming

      Maybe the extension of the Bush tax cuts was indeed a good decision!!

      It only took them 10+ years and trillions of dollars! You just keep telling yourself that this is from those old tax cuts.

      • 4 votes
      #1.9 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 1:11 PM EST
      Daniel A. Hallo

      Rock on America!

      It's not where you are, it's the direction you're going.

      So now that the Democrates steered us iin the right direction we can take Bushs advice and hold the course.

      • 5 votes
      #1.10 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 1:18 PM EST
      Canadian Dave

      C'mon folks. Cut out the "Obama" crap.

      We ALREADY know that it's the Republican governors who are REALLY responsible for good job news.

      • 3 votes
      #1.11 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 1:23 PM EST
      HappyToSeeYa

      Of course, the job improvement outlook belongs to teapublicants [sarc]

      Damn! What can teapublicants do to sabotage the jobs outlook so that they can have economic doomsday campaign talking points? They have to torpedo this positivity fast. They will probably figure out how to stop this forward jobs momentum this week at the annual CPAC this week.

      Plus, Fox News will be screaming that the positive jobs numbers really is a conspiracy.

      • 5 votes
      #1.12 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 1:59 PM EST
      judi fermanich

      How full time are the jobs? Janitors, line workers, telephone operators, customer service. Where are they and what goes with them. Keep in mind we are talking December and the holidays. Are those still employed?

        #1.13 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 2:49 PM EST
        echo82

        judi: please learn how these numbers are determined...

          #1.14 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 3:33 PM EST
          Reply
          Beebobby

          Waiting for a troll to post that good news for America is really bad news.

          • 11 votes
          Reply#2 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 11:35 AM EST
          More Than Happy

          Once they get their stories straight, the GOP will try to claim credit for this. It'll be just adorable, I bet!

          • 11 votes
          Reply#3 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 11:40 AM EST
          Thinknaboutit

          They will for sure, but they will be very careful as to how they do that. They know that next months numbers could be bad and they need to remain flexible so they can shift the blame right back to the Democrats.

          • 6 votes
          #3.1 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 11:42 AM EST
          Reply
          tesla013

          Jumped in December as lots of retailers looked to hire tempoaray help for the holidays. Bogus spun bull@!$%#. Lets talk in March.

          • 1 vote
          Reply#4 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 11:43 AM EST
          RebootIt

          Learn to read.

          Professional and business services include temporary jobs. But they also include high-paying positions, such as architects, engineers and accountants.

          • 6 votes
          #4.1 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 11:57 AM EST
          tesla013

          Uh huh sure they did. I can read and that would be the problem.

            #4.2 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 12:00 PM EST
            RebootIt

            Do you have a source that says otherwise or are you just taking your opinion as fact without any reasoning behind it? The top talent in my industry (computer engineering) are fleeing to new jobs they are being offered. I have 2 interviews for higher paying positions next week.

            • 4 votes
            #4.3 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 12:11 PM EST
            tesla013

            First of all any source that did not jive with your POV would not be credible so why bother to share it with you. And apparently your individual situation is your only source besides this article. You stop once you find material than agrees with your POV. That is fine at least one is only blind in the single eye. I look at it all and none of it agrees, and is in fact polar opposites, making all of it suspect. But hey if you wanna high five your boys don't let the truth get in your way.

              #4.4 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 12:17 PM EST
              bonos_rama

              Tesla, bring proof to the contrary. Right now your argument is a foolish one.

              • 3 votes
              #4.5 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 12:33 PM EST
              Brian-497171

              tesla013

              You stop once you find material than agrees with your POV.

              link it up, buddy.

              • 3 votes
              #4.6 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 1:08 PM EST
              HappyToSeeYa

              tesla013

              Jumped in December as lots of retailers looked to hire tempoaray help for the holidays. Bogus spun bull@!$%#. Lets talk in March.

              Shouldn't the holiday layoffs be reflected in the numbers for January employment/unemployment reports?

              • 1 vote
              #4.7 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 2:03 PM EST
              Nicey-1026620

              Uh huh sure they did. I can read and that would be the problem.

              It's almost wrong to have that name and not be able to back it up.

              If you look at employment reports from December/January 2009, and 2010 you will find these weren't strong months at all compared to the numbers within the years that followed.

              Also, *that's* already what many expected in January. Which is why the consensus number was 125-150,000 jobs. Because many expected it to drop off. Which it didn't.

              And even further, there were more than temp holiday jobs. 50,000 in manufacturing, 20,000 in construction, 30,000 in healthcare, 10,000 in mining, etc, etc, etc.

                #4.8 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 2:28 PM EST
                Chuck1968

                Well in just a few weeks I'm sure the GOPers and Libertarians will all be taking credit for the economic improvement even though they've done nothing, and in fact did everything they could think of to prevent any growth. They are teetering on the fence now waiting to see the reaction of the general public.

                In Mconnell's words , " He's not going to do anything that will get Obama re-elected." In other words whatever Obama wants will be good as it will get him re-elected, and the GOP knew it.

                • 1 vote
                #4.9 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 5:21 PM EST
                Reply
                Yearning

                Wow... unemployment down.. we're down to one war... gas is getting cheaper... Must be an election year!

                I love election years. Things get going really well. They've even stopped harassing the medical marijuana folks here in Washington state.

                I'm kinda sure Obama will get a second term.

                I do dread the post election thing... you know... more wars, higher prices, lower employment.. but what can you do?

                We can't stop voting the DemocratsandRepublicans into power... We'd rather eat glass. But hey, these things are the price we have to pay in order to have a docile and obedient electorate.

                ...and we all know how important it is to have docile and obedient voters.

                • 1 vote
                Reply#5 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 11:47 AM EST
                tesla013

                Ya know the true beauty of this presidential election is that no matter whom one votes for(Obama or Romney) we will get the same result.

                • 1 vote
                #5.1 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 11:52 AM EST
                Thinknaboutit

                You might find this interesting.

                • 1 vote
                #5.2 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 11:55 AM EST
                More Than Happy

                We can't stop voting the DemocratsandRepublicans into power...

                There is strength in numbers, Yearning. Thoughtful, disorganized voters will get steamrolled every single time in elections.

                • 1 vote
                #5.3 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 11:55 AM EST
                ValdeziscomingDeleted
                Palmquist1

                Gas prices are going up so will see if they blame Obama this too, they all know the trouble with the middle east is where problem is.

                  #5.5 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 12:01 PM EST
                  tesla013

                  Thinknaboutit you are truly funny. I guess when you just have nothing of value to add to any conversation, regardless of topic, you do what you must do. Evolve will ya. We have been walking on two legs for quite some time now, join us.

                    #5.6 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 12:03 PM EST
                    Thinknaboutit

                    I guess when you just have nothing of value to add to any conversation,

                    Seriously? You admit it was "truly funny" and then try to claim I have nothing of value to add to any conversation? I sometimes get tired of pointing out the irony and hypocrisy of conservatives comments, sometimes it's just better to laugh it off. Laughter heals, which might very well explain the antics of the GOP, they are trying to "heal" the nation through laughter.

                    • 2 votes
                    #5.7 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 12:32 PM EST
                    Yearning

                    Ya know the true beauty of this presidential election is that no matter whom one votes for(Obama or Romney) we will get the same result.- Tesla, just above.

                    My sentiments exactly, Tesla. Funny thing is we won't vote for anyone besides Obama and Romney... as THAT would be "throwing away our vote".. which is as hilarious as it is tragic.

                    We are indeed a docile, obedient and easily controlled electorate.

                    ...which pleases the DemocratsandRepublicans very much.

                    • 1 vote
                    #5.8 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 1:19 PM EST
                    Auto 101

                    ... gas is getting cheaper

                    where? it is $4.09 here. and still going up.

                      #5.9 - Wed Feb 8, 2012 8:21 PM EST
                      tesla013

                      No claim just a sad fact. Sorry that sarcasm is yet another concept above and beyond you.

                        #5.10 - Fri Feb 10, 2012 11:04 AM EST
                        Reply
                        T. Gracchus

                        These numbers are seasonally adjusted, which means that the jump in December is on top of any increase which would normally be expected due to the holiday rush.

                        • 2 votes
                        Reply#6 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 11:47 AM EST
                        tesla013

                        You know what it means when they say the numbers have been adjusted?

                          #6.1 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 11:53 AM EST
                          Thinknaboutit

                          T.Gracchus obviously knows what it means, he explained it quite well. The sad part is that even after such a straitforward explanation some still don't get it.

                          • 1 vote
                          #6.2 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 12:02 PM EST
                          tesla013

                          No apparently he doesn't. Neither do you think but that comes as no surprise. I imagine you are shocked and startled at every sun rise.

                          Adjusted means changed. We must take on faith it is an accurate adjustment.

                            #6.3 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 12:05 PM EST
                            Thinknaboutit

                            Thanks so much for providing the definition for the word "adjusted". Now get back on topic and understand that the explanation provided in post#6 was for the "seasonally adjusted" numbers in the December jobs report.

                            • 1 vote
                            #6.4 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 1:28 PM EST
                            Nicey-1026620

                            No apparently he doesn't. Neither do you think but that comes as no surprise. I imagine you are shocked and startled at every sun rise.

                            Adjusted means changed. We must take on faith it is an accurate adjustment.

                            Every annualized bit of statistical data has to be adjusted for *annual trends*, if you don't do that, your numbers are not going to reveal real trends, direction, etc.

                            Anyone who does stats does this, private, government, etc.

                            It might also suprise you that they subtract jobs in the summer as an *adjustment* but since you are biased, you're not going to acknowledge that happens. Adjustments are only positive in your mind.

                            • 2 votes
                            #6.5 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 2:33 PM EST
                            Nicey-1026620

                            These numbers are seasonally adjusted, which means that the jump in December is on top of any increase which would normally be expected due to the holiday rush.

                            Actually, the seasonal adjustment moves numbers up in the winter. Traditionally, there are less people working in the winter than average. Even with the Holidays.

                            So many jobs are associated with being able to work outside, and obviously that will be less on a national basis in the winter time.

                            It's still correct to seasonally adjust, but the number is just the number. That's what seasonal adjustment does, give you the trend minus normal annualized trends (minus a negative = positive, - positive in the summer time means it's adjusted down)

                              #6.6 - Wed Feb 8, 2012 10:14 AM EST
                              Auto 101

                              This number is not that much higher then normal (after 08) they advertise 2.8 and hire 3.5 million people both numbers change some times it is 3.8(not adjusted)-3.2 million adverisments and hiring is about 3.5-4.5 million people every month.

                                #6.7 - Wed Feb 8, 2012 8:19 PM EST
                                tesla013

                                We are having an unusually warm winter in many parts of the country normally frozen solid by now. Could this be a factor in the higher numbers?

                                Hey Nicey why the insult? Biased I am not. Not trusting of faceless entities that are for hire I am. By the way, adjustments are not really positive in my mind, they are in fact road signs that indicate these numbers have been in fact adjusted or changed. Why can't we simply be given the numbers as they are? Are you fixin to explain to me that the plain numbers would not be an accurate assesment of the actual situation?

                                  #6.8 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 12:07 PM EST
                                  Nicey-1026620

                                  We are having an unusually warm winter in many parts of the country normally frozen solid by now. Could this be a factor in the higher numbers?

                                  It's somewhat of a factor. But certainly not the only one. Part of the factor is the world didn't fall apart last fall and consumers just got more confident.

                                  Not trusting of faceless entities that are for hire I am.

                                  For hire by who? This would suggest the FBI is for hire.

                                  By the way, adjustments are not really positive in my mind

                                  As in....they are positive in terms of the adjusted number, qed, the numbers are adjusted *up* in the winter time.

                                  , they are in fact road signs that indicate these numbers have been in fact adjusted or changed. Why can't we simply be given the numbers as they are?

                                  ....because that would not tell you true trends. It would hide true trends.

                                  Seasonal adjustment is done by private statistic agencies as well, it's common practice for annualized data that sees "repeated trends"

                                  If not, it would look at though we are always losing jobs in the winter and gaining them in the summer. But that may not truly be the case, since there are annual job trends that always occur then.

                                  Are you fixin to explain to me that the plain numbers would not be an accurate assesment of the actual situation?

                                  They would only be as accurate as the overriding trend.

                                  Any statistical agency private or government would say the same thing.

                                  In terms of trends, it conceals data, rather than reveal it. But the easiest thing to see is that if you compare them in year-over-year formats, *there's no difference* in the overall increases or decreases using seasonally adjusted or non seasonally adjusted.

                                  What will be different is trends from month to month. Reporting we gain 500,000 jobs a month from June thru September doesn't tell you much about whether the market is truly creating jobs minus *what always happens*, which is summer hiring. Same thing for winter.

                                    #6.9 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:13 PM EST
                                    tesla013

                                    I knew you were fixin to tell me that the real numbers would not be the real numbers. All due respect Nicey and I do respect you, you are very smart on this economic stuff, you need to put that book down and really look at what you just told me. Try and see it through my eyes. I believe that this is common practice, I ask myself why? I know what you have been told and apparently believe. But what I have taken away from your explanation is that these numbers are much like the numbers in an ad for a new car. Lots of fine print telling you that the bold number displayed on your screen is a complete fallacy. Thank you though for answering my question. I do appreciate it.

                                    PS all the historical eveidence available and you would claim the FBI is completely without(for lack of a better word) sin? I cannot believe that.

                                      #6.10 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:21 PM EST
                                      Nicey-1026620

                                      I knew you were fixin to tell me that the real numbers would not be the real numbers. All due respect Nicey and I do respect you, you are very smart on this economic stuff, you need to put that book down and really look at what you just told me.

                                      I didn't tell you the real numbers weren't real numbers.

                                      I told you that the raw data will *mask* underlying trends. Because it's the *raw data* that get's skewed by things like summer hiring, lower winter hiring, and so on.

                                      And I've provided you both comparisons on a year-over-year basis.

                                      That *both* non-seasonally adjusted data and seasonally adjusted data will work out to the same gain or loss over 1 year.

                                      This is especially true of data that impacts financial markets and also other programs. Many companys, agencies, investors make decisions based on these data. If the CPI reported a -20% inflation rate on fuel in October, that would cause some pretty wide fluctuations, not only this, without removing the normal drop, you're not getting the true trend number.

                                      Providing examples is getting redundant here. But needless to say, you simply aren't seeing the true trend if it is masked by seasonal affects.

                                      I'm sure in spring time, the housing market looks strong in raw data (people buy in spring), I'm sure in the fall gas prices appear to be deflating (it always drops in the fall). Reporting the raw data masks underlying trends.

                                      i.e. if there are below normal housing sales in the spring....how is the raw data going to tell you that? (it will still look robust)

                                      if gasoline is seeing inflation above normal in the fall, how will you see that? raw data will say it's down.

                                      And beyond this, the fact is that *private businesses* do these adjustments for trending data. It's statistical method.

                                      Try and see it through my eyes. I believe that this is common practice, I ask myself why? I know what you have been told and apparently believe.

                                      I didn't have to be "told", I have a minor and mathematics in which I had courses in statistical analysis where I was able to measure data like this on the theoretical and practical level.

                                      I ask myself more than most do. I've gone into even the calculations (which are also available) which are much more involved than just this discussion and satisfied myself.

                                      While there are many aspects of the reports that don't provide the most meaningful headline data (like U3 for instance), underlying is a wealth of information freely available.

                                      But what I have taken away from your explanation is that these numbers are much like the numbers in an ad for a new car. Lots of fine print telling you that the bold number displayed on your screen is a complete fallacy.

                                      They are doing exactly what they should do.

                                      I see people criticize, for instance, the BLS restatement of the birth death model, or recent changes to the census that impact the overall population in the labor force and outside of it.

                                      Why do people see these as "lies"?

                                      It's refining. Statistics, is not exact. That is true. There is margin of error (as there is with a surprising amount of the daily processes your life depends on, all engineering is mathematical guessing to a degree).

                                      I'd rather they re-analyze their methods, see their mistakes, and make corrections. This is a lot of data to compile, it should almost always be re-stated, which is what they do as well. GDP is restated twice, unemployment is restated for two months following, jobs as well, etc, etc.

                                      PS all the historical eveidence available and you would claim the FBI is completely without(for lack of a better word) sin? I cannot believe that.

                                      I didn't say that.

                                      But as an agency I don't believe they've ever been contracted to someone who made a lump sum payment. You are implying that the BLS, Census, CBO, etc, etc are all available to anyone who wants to purchase the answers they want.

                                      While I will be the first to tell you the government has been infiltrated by a wide variety of private wealthy types, I have yet to see that they have decided how these agencies will calculate data. It remains in the hands of accepted Academia of mathematics and empirical evidence based on what they have observed in the data.

                                      • 1 vote
                                      #6.11 - Mon Feb 13, 2012 4:35 PM EST
                                      tesla013

                                      Yes I am suggesting that government agencies are available to the highest bidder. Thank you for the rest. I knew there was reason I did not want to take economics in college. I do not necessarily see the numbers as lying, but that they are slanted this way and that depending on the need. The most trusted info on the economy I have are the gas prices right down the street from my house, the food prices right cross the street, and the number of folks in the unemployment office when I go there ever other week to see if anything new has popped up. These give me a good idea on the shape of the economy, that and the amount of change I find lying about town. Which may sound silly but is really a quite accurate indicator. I understand bout the trends and how they are required if one is to get the jump on things. Thanks again, you have educated me one more time.

                                        #6.12 - Wed Feb 15, 2012 3:08 PM EST
                                        Reply
                                        mstanley2265

                                        The private sector needs to get their marketing people fired up and selling their products. geez, then they would hire more people. South America is an open market for a lot of products..Get with it and get people back to work. Holding onto that money isn't going to make the situation any better.

                                        • 1 vote
                                        Reply#7 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 11:55 AM EST
                                        don-72

                                        Obama 50% Romney 45% and going down the best news of this year.

                                        • 4 votes
                                        Reply#8 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 12:02 PM EST
                                        HappyToSeeYa

                                        Washington: Boosted by rising US jobs figures, President Barack Obama's approval rating has hit the magical 50-percent mark and he has opened up a double-digit lead over his likely Republican opponent in November, a poll showed on Monday.

                                        Read more at: http://www.ndtv.com/article/world/obama-approval-soars-to-50-percent-on-jobs-figures-173943&cp

                                          #8.1 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 2:07 PM EST
                                          Reply
                                          Pablo-123

                                          It's Obama's fault!

                                          Oh wait a minute

                                          • 2 votes
                                          Reply#9 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 12:46 PM EST
                                          ron17571

                                          Numbers can be massaged any way you want. I dont give the government credit for any improvements,if anything the private sector does it in spite of the gov.

                                          You watch the childish fighting and gridlock in washington and actually think theyve done anything positive?

                                          They are good at increasing the dept.( both partys) A lot of folks here sure kiss some obama but.

                                          Just wait for the Iran war to collapse our society with insane oil prices.

                                          • 1 vote
                                          Reply#10 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 12:54 PM EST
                                          Brian-497171

                                          if anything the private sector does it in spite of the gov

                                          The private sector would have let GM and Chrysler die.

                                          • 3 votes
                                          #10.1 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 1:21 PM EST
                                          mstanley2265

                                          yep, the private sector would have bought the assets and sold them off, piece by piece and junked the rest...

                                          • 1 vote
                                          #10.2 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 1:28 PM EST
                                          Yearning

                                          Well, with Saudi Arabia financing our elections (legally through the US offices of their state owned corporations) Our oil problems are not really likely to get too bad.

                                          Thing is, the in-between guys also make hefty campaign contributions.. you know.. the speculators.. and they're likely to be the ones to cash in on higher gas prices... The Saudis just want us to return Iran to the Sunnis..and turn our wars to the Shia... all easily done by our noble statesmen and gentlemen legislators.

                                          Add in the "soft dollar" policies for the Chinese contributors, and there you go... the State of the Union.

                                          Neatest thing... being an obedient and docile bunch of voters... we're just going to argue about a 2% difference in taxes, and Romney/Obama is a sure win in November. We won't even TOUCH on an actual issue.

                                          Our one monolithic US political party (RepublicratsandDemicans) shall continue into the indefinite future... as will the way they run things.

                                          • 2 votes
                                          #10.3 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 1:33 PM EST
                                          TheyreAllCrooks

                                          These job numbers have been pulled from thin air. Rush Limpbag says so. Those 250,000 jobs created last month are just a fig newton of the president's imagination. No jobs were created.

                                          Don't believe anything this administration says, and especially don't believe any "numbers" they put out. This is all just "Chicago style gangster politics"...yeah, that's what this is. So be afraid, be very, afraid!

                                          This economy is no better today than it was 3 years ago but if you listen to these liberal "numbers creators"...we're heading in the right direction. We're not. Rush Limpbag says were not.

                                          • 1 vote
                                          #10.4 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 2:40 PM EST
                                          Castor Bridge

                                          Elitist Barack Hussein Obama is no friend of the common man.

                                          Secretary of Energy Steven Chu:

                                          said, “Somehow we have to figure out how to boost the price of gasoline to the levels in Europe.” With gasoline prices in Europe consistently hovering between $7 and $10 a gallon...Steven Chu said that in explaining the Obama policy of “progressively” making gasoline more and more expensive in order to force Americans to turn to alternative energy sources.

                                          Chu was appointed by Obama and reports directly to Obama.

                                            #10.5 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 3:06 PM EST
                                            Chuck1968

                                            Castor Bridge: Yet another quote pulled right out of the a$$ of the right wing.

                                            Obama has zero control over gas prices. He has zero ties with them as Bush and Cheney did.

                                              #10.6 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 5:27 PM EST
                                              Reply
                                              nevy the healthgal

                                              in my city it's still 1500 applicants for every job! i wonder who's fault that is...

                                              • 1 vote
                                              Reply#11 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 2:28 PM EST
                                              Americanpatriot12

                                              Uh, oh! Must be an "election year" if we're gonna be bombarded with upbeat (if largely fictitious) claims of an improving economy. But then what else can we expect from the Obama White House.

                                              I mean, after all. . . I remember reading a whole bunch of upbeat stories about declining unemployed articles read on MSNBC in 2011, along with contradictory stories a day or two later about a rise in unemployment claims -- ALSO read on MSNBC.

                                              When the feds can PROVE a genuine, verifiable, demonstrably real DROP in unemployment numbers -- then I'll gladly become a believer. Sorry, but if I sound a bit jaded and skeptical -- we've been through these upbeat, albeit bogus claims before. Many, many times before.

                                              Come November, I'll pull the Republican lever -- regardless of whom the presidential candidate is. Maybe Republicans are a bit pro-business, but I'm pro-American and want to see millions more of my fellow Americans regaining their self-respect with a real, decent-paying job after months, even years of frustration. Maybe we should ask our Democrats in Congress and our government what they're doing, what they HAVE DONE to eliminate OUTSOURCING our jobs to overseas locales.

                                              • 1 vote
                                              Reply#12 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 2:36 PM EST
                                              TheyreAllCrooks

                                              So there were 3.3 MILLION jobs created over that last 23 months and your position is those jobs were actually NOT created?

                                              You sound like Rush Limbaugh.

                                              • 1 vote
                                              #12.1 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 2:46 PM EST
                                              Americanpatriot12

                                              Read it again "theyreallcrooks"

                                              I want PROOF, inarguable, demostrable PROOF that these jobs are real and have truly been created. We've had too damned many lies coming out of the Obama Administration.

                                                #12.2 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 3:12 PM EST
                                                echo82

                                                what lies? and prove it!

                                                • 1 vote
                                                #12.3 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 3:34 PM EST
                                                echo82

                                                yeah, I didn't think you could back that up, Americanpatriot12.

                                                • 1 vote
                                                #12.4 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 5:11 PM EST
                                                TheyreAllCrooks

                                                The proof would be the 3.2 MILLION people who've gone back to work...why don't you go interview all 3.2 MILLION and then get back to us with "the lies"....

                                                You're claimining it's not true just like the fat man on the radio...but of course you can't bak it up...it's just more Obamahateration!

                                                • 1 vote
                                                #12.5 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 8:01 PM EST
                                                Reply
                                                Fifth Horseman

                                                GOP is hiring. You got to be kidding. They never hire anyone unless that person is a REP. REPs will work for less, longer, harder, and still have time to pray. They make a nice guy feel sick. They are strange duds. Talk about being a slave to their job. I have seen them actually put in a 8 hour day of work. How stupid it is. Do you not hate people like that. Reminds you of a dumb farmer, up before dawn in the fields, still in the fields after the sun goes down.

                                                What losers they must be.

                                                  Reply#13 - Tue Feb 7, 2012 3:01 PM EST
                                                  Obbop

                                                  Type of jobs?

                                                  Careers? Benefits? Let's all work for minimal wages with no benefits and no opportunity to amass capital!!!!!!!!!!!

                                                  As long as the greatest percentage of the national wealth continues its ever-upwards path to the top of the socio-economic pyramid-shaped hierarchy then all is normal and proper within the modern USA.

                                                    Reply#14 - Wed Feb 8, 2012 4:52 PM EST
                                                    denni issacDeleted
                                                    Sammy-2678587

                                                    Yet it still can't keep up with the job losses. There is not a week that goes by where yet another major manufacturing is closing it's doors and hundreds are losing their jobs. Nothing has changed.

                                                      Reply#16 - Sat Feb 11, 2012 10:23 AM EST
                                                      Auto 101

                                                      and hundreds are made. just remember the jobs increase is over what is lost.

                                                        #16.1 - Sun Feb 12, 2012 7:54 PM EST
                                                        Reply
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