Who should pick up the biggest share of the cost for expanding health care coverage?

No Free Lunch----get a clue this is a Free Lunch for societies non wanabe workers.

No Free Lunch----get a clue this is a Free Lunch for societies non wanabe workers.

There should be a way of spreading the cost throughout peoples lifetimes.The sad thing is that people are falling for the fear tactics of the insurance providers,the they want to kill granny,death panels,long waits for vital surgeries, the list is endless.You would think that Europeans are dropping like flys.The truth is that they are healthier and live longer than we do,at far less the cost.

for you that says this is for non-workers...get a clue bud..

I am 48 years old, have worked since I was 15 years old, and I cannot get health insurance unless I work for corporate america. I cannot, for instance, join my husband in working our family business because I had cancer 15 years ago and insurers won't accept me. So all of you that go to church every week and think you're a good Christian, but believe in kicking your fellow man when he's down, Jesus would be ashamed of you.

So, let me get this straight.  I have insurance.  I can afford insurance.  I am happy with my coverage, but now you want me to pay for your insurance as well?

Up yours!

Its not a free lunch its just that some people will pay $23 for a $10 hamburger and others will pay $1 for the same $10 hamburger.

Write or call your senators and congressmen, tell them to stop the insanity. You can find a link on google to an on line form to email them, or link to it from loudobbs.com but please do it now before it is too late! We cannot afford a $2 trillion sicialist mistake.

Everyone, rich or poor, will shoulder the costs of the Obama healthplan. It is hard to believe that anyone thinks that a national program of any kind will be paid by suppiers of health services, insurers, or drug companies. All insured people now will be charged surcharges to finance the industry increases resulting from this plan. Not one politician has hit at the heart of the matter. Look at the tax rates in the European union countries that have national health insurance and ask yourself, can I afford that same rate? The liability insurce paid by doctors, the treatment of clients by insurers, the cost of processing new patents for all the new fashion drugs, and the cost of beaucracy in implementing plans would provide for funds available to insure the current uninsured who deserve the same dignity as anyone else in the country.

The tax rates should be huge issue.

I agree with your comment on who should pay for health care. We should all pay a piece. My hope is those who reap the biggest profit will pay the most. Your right. IT MUST BE DONE! SHTexas

We Need a Public Option!!! The More I hear, the more I am Convinced! A Public Option is simply adding. ... another choice... another alternative to the mix. The MORE CHoices the Better!! And a Public Option will give the Insurance companies a Run for their Money!! That's what we Americans are all about. MOre choices ... equals More Competition.... means Lower Prices !! Yippee!

Insurers will be Forced to Compete and Will Offer Competitive Affordable and Comprehensive Benefits to Employers and Families!! Why do you think they are fighting so Hard against this?!

And I disagree with the Senate bill to tax "Cadillac" plans because I think many middle-class Americans will be hurt by this. I do however believe we should tax those individuals with an annual income of $500,000.00 or more to help pay for the public option. And the amount individuals and families pay in premiums and co-pays, must be reasonable and not become such a large portion of their income, or nickel and dime families when a health care emergency arises.

Tom's place "A long time ago, someone said, "There's no such thing as a free lunch." We all will benefit so we all should contribute to the success of this needed plan. Coming up with an equitable distribution of the costs will be difficult, to say the least. But it has to be done."

Hi Tom...are you aware of the fact that Congress has exempted themselves from this horribly flawed health bill? Doesn't that bother you at all and everyone else who posts these comments...why isn't there a larger uproar over this. You say we will all benefit. Can you possibly tell me how I will benefit whose care is great and probably will be lost to the "public option" with far less benefits than I have now - how will that benefit me? And if Congress feels its such a crap plan that they won't even join it, why should it be shoved down the public's throat. And why on earth are they messing with the millions and millions of Americans who have good coverage and are happy with it? Why aren't they simply filling in the gap for those who cannot afford insurance and isn't it rather ironic that they have put in the bill (along with trillions of dollars of earmarks, the politically correct name for Pork Barrels), they will force people to pay the government money for not having insurance and they will forbid doctors and hospitals to take cash payments, can only be paid through insurance - you truly don't find anything alarming about this? When did America become a dictatorship, with the incompetent Congress (which caused most of the problems our country is dealing with now)creating a incomprehensible health bill that is ripping this country apart. And why the rush? And finally to all those who suggested Congress pay for it, President Obama pay for it - the government absolutely pays for nothing - it is the American citizens who support this government with our taxes - they work for us, not the other way around. And we should get off our apathetic bottoms and start voting, demanding referendum, tort reform, pharmaceutical ads forbidden on television (like cigarettes, they are bad for your health)and other reforms that would cost nothing but would improve all our lives. And of course, the biggest help to our country and our lives - term limits on all politicians.

The whole problem with health care in this country is the cost. And the type of "reform" that congrss and obumba are talking about , is not going to work. Nothing will change , it will only get worse, if they dont do anything about cost. The drug makers and the providers of health care need to charge less. The problem is, is that they are taking too much of the money. My husband had ONE test, and it cost us, AFTER ins., $1800.00!! For ONE test. Even with ins., that is unaffordable.

I do not trust obama and his thugs with this. It is NOT about health care anyways, it is about power, money and control. Scary.

I dont think that it is fair, that one household will have to pay probably about six hundred dollars or more for health ins., because they both work, and the family that does not want to work that hard or much, will get health ins. for probably about twenty five dollars a month. EVERYBODY needs to pull their weight! I am tired of paying the bills of people that sit on their a$$es.

I will not benefit in it. Most if not all working people will suffer. I know to many people who can afford it but spend it on other things. Will not work if available and still have children.

The truth of the matter is that most of you are angry at the wrong people.  There are doctors and hospitals that are on the verge of going out of business true, but there are many others in the medical business that are getting paid enormous sums of money.  With artificial shortages of doctors and nurses caused by the powers that be either not letting schools graduate more of them, or standing idly by watching it and doing nothing.  The truth is that we are already paying more than enough for good medical care for everyone in the states, legal or not, as well as a good portion of Canada and Mexico.  To use that hamburger analogy, you are getting mad at the two or three people in the restaurant that get free or reduced price burgers that you subsidized by buying a $100 burger when you should get mad at the shopkeeper and all the suppliers that are making out like bandits with your money!!!

You "Right wing Christians" should be absolutely ashamed!! There is nothing good or God-fearing about letting innocent people suffer and die because you are too ignorant, stupid or blind to stop the robbery.  All you have to do is to watch a few of the right PBS documentaries, then do enough academic type research to know that our system sucks and there actually are many better ones that exist in this world.  Shame on the person that dared say "Up Yours" to the poor who can't pay.  Do you really expect people to just suffer and die just so you can go on happily paying all your hard earned money to rich murderous thieves?

I was let go from my company 3 years ago and have only been able to find part time work. No one wants to hire the older person probably for health reasons. But what I wanted to say is the insurance industries deal in health and auto ins. a lot of people pay in and never make a claim but never get any money back. That is why insurance companies are so profitable. Now Obama saying people that don't buy insurance will be fined that sounds a little communistic to me.

The biggest problem is the sneaky weasel insurance industry, and the fact of the matter is that the insurance companies do not provide health care . . .

Of course, their marketeers and lobbyists want everyone to believe that insurance companies are "health care providers", but the reality is that there are four groups in the equation:

(1) Patients . . .

(2) Health Care Providers: Doctors, Nurses, Medical Technicians, Physical Therapists, Pharmacists, Psychologists, Medical Device and Equipment Manufacturers, Pharmaceutical Companies, Medical Laboratories, Clinics, Hospitals, and so forth and so on . . .

(3) Private Insurance Companies . . .

(4) State and Federal Bureaucrats, Legislators, and Administrators of Government-Sponsored insurance . . .

[NOTE: Actually, private insurance companies (3) do most of the claims processing for Medicare, so there is a bit of overlap of (3) and (4), except that the federal government is the overseer and the private insurance companies do the work under contract with strict guidelines to prevent them from engaging in sneaky weaseling . . . ]

Over the years, private insurance companies have been very successful with respect to inserting themselves between the first two groups (1) Patients and (2) Health Care Providers, and the primary places into which they have inserted themselves are the wallets and purses of the American citizens who still can afford health care at the dawn of the early 21st century . . .

Private insurance companies are in business to make a profit--not to provide health care--and they are so bold in their sneaky weaseling that they have no hesitation after watching a 30-minute training cartoon to tell doctors what to do; to deny or to rescind coverage when a patient moves from being profitable to being an expense; and so forth and so on . . .

Look at all the fine print and virtual festivals of legalese, and understand that there is nothing special about sneaky weasel insurance companies other than their abilities to lobby the Congress and President to tailor the laws, rules, and regulations that make it possible for them to collect huge amounts of money for doing absolutely nothing, except of course cheating and stealing hard-earned money from Americans . . .

Look at the so-called "fat baby" and "skinny baby" in Colorado that were in the news this week . . .

Both were denied health insurance, even though both babies are healthy according to their pediatricians, and had it not made national news, the sneaky weasel insurance companies would have been able to deny healthy babies insurance . . .

They simply are sneaky weasels, and they will say and do anything to make a penny, because they are sociopaths (which is the gracious term for "psychopaths") . . .

http://www.cassiopaea.com/cassiopaea/psychopath.htm

Once you understand what psychopaths are and what they are able to do with respect to tricking and deceiving people, there are no mysteries regarding health care and insurance companies . . .

If you have insurance today, then good for you!

But things have a way of changing overnight or in the blink of an eye, and when you become one of the 50 to 75 million Americans who has no insurance, you are screwed, because you cannot afford even the most basic health care, and your only option when you are sick is to go to the emergency room where at least in public hospitals you can receive indigent medical care . . .

If you have a job and believe that the economy is getting better, then keep smoking that wacky-backy, because all the jobs that were lost are gone and will not return for a long time, as is the case for all the jobs that were lost in the first few years after the terrorist attacks of September 11, 2001 . . .

If you read the news diligently and stayed awake during mathematics and statistics classes, then you know that the real unemployment rate is 20 percent, except that it does not include all the people who were forced out of the workforce 5 or more years ago, so if you include them, the unemployment rate is closer to 30 percent, and none of these folks can afford much of anything once the unemployment insurance checks stop and their COBRA health care ends . . .

You might believe that government-sponsored and managed health insurance is not so good, but the fact of the matter is that Medicare when combined with a Supplemental Part B policy is the best health insurance on this planet, and it is very cost-effective, because the sneaky weasels go to prison when they are identified and put to trial . . .

And regarding the projected cost over a decade of one trillion dollars--which averages to 100 billion dollars a year--it is peanuts compared to the trillions of dollars essentially "gifted" to sneaky weasel banks, insurance and investment companies, foreign banks and investment companies, and sovereign investment funds over the past 15 months (spanning two administrations, incidentally) . . .

http://www.surfwhammys.com/music/08_M-O-N-E-Y-3-5-MP.mp3

Why is it "OK!" to bail-out with trillions of dollars AIG, CITI, General Motors, Bank of America, and so forth and so on, as well as a virtual festival of European banks, and sovereign investment funds of countries in the Middle East and elsewhere, with at least some which we are fighting wars, but it somehow is "bad" to spend perhaps 5 percent of that money to ensure that every American has adequate basic health care?

How twisted is that logic?

Pretty twisted!

It is simply mind-boggling that we as a nation can be so easily fooled by sneaky weasels . . .

We need to eject the sneaky weasels from Tammany Hall, Toad Hall, and everywhere else they abound!

The government granted the sneaky weasels their licenses, and the government needs to revoke the national license to sneaky weasel, posthaste, which is fabulous . . .

Fabulous!

sqzdmidcls

So all of you that go to church every week and think you're a good Christian, but believe in kicking your fellow man when he's down, Jesus would be ashamed of you.

WeareallEvil

You "Right wing Christians" should be absolutely ashamed!! There is nothing good or God-fearing about letting innocent people suffer and die because you are too ignorant, stupid or blind to stop the robbery.

Don't preach! This isn't a pulpit and we're not your congregation. We are discussing legislation. If you want to talk about what's right or wrong in regards to Christianity, find the appropriate thread. However, since you brought the subject up, it is wrong to steal; it is wrong to covet what your neighbor has. Theft through the government by your demand or request is still theft on your part. You can hire someone to do your dirty deeds for you--steal from your neighbor--but you cannot absolve yourself of the crime.

Not everyone who opposes this is Republican. If you persist in directing your arguments towards Republicans, you will continue to appear ignorant and narrow-minded. I know who I should be angry with: those who demand money be taken from their fellow citizens, those who take said demands and form them into legislation, and those who vote for such legislation at the expense of their constituents.

Make the uninsured and democrats pay for it. They are the ones who want it and need it. If they feel so strong that we need it let them pay for it. But that isn't their way they wan to spend money but have everybody pay.

You do not want to pay for any body else s health care,then drop your health insurance!!! pay it all out of pocket.

I don't want to pay for your driving on the roads either, or your kids going to public school, hell, my kid is grown, so stop driving, and I'll stop worring about health insurance, deal?

The vast majority of the uninsured are those who work full-time...get your facts straight before you open your mouth.

please cite your facts?

Let's make this simple! It should be paid by very large tax increases on the top 1% of wealthy Americans!

Why? Don 't you realize that continuing to tax the same group of people will just stifle growth. Those 1% are the people that employee you and everyother crazy on this board. You will tax the top 1% until they no longer can afford to pay you salary you dope! Think with you head not your heart.

Why don't you have a HSA? If all of your numbers are actual...only a dope would pay 10k with a 7k deductible. Look into a HSA. BTW you read like a seminar poster, I don't buy what you are selling.

I'm not sure what you mean by "seminar poster". We are both self-employed and in our sixties. 10K with a 7k deductible is the standard cost for people like us. It was even higher before we switched companies.

have you looked into a HSA? Your 10k would be reduced by a third (most likely)

You clearly do not understand the busininess of business and clearly have a bia as "I'm sure executive salaries consume my premium." This doesn't make sense. Why don't you have a HSA?

Insurance is for catastrophic cost-not 1st dollar coverage unless you want to pay for it. If you think this mess that congress is passing will address any of these issues-you are sadly mistaken. They are only going to make things worse.

I see you are listening to the fear mongers!!So you think that a health care system with a 35% cost overrun is great! You had better get down on your knees every day and beg God you never get a long term illness,you will find out how great our system is when you lose everything you ever worked for and have to file bankruptcy then have to decide weather to eat or buy your medicines that keep you alive and pain free!!!

Well said, I hate these arrogant a**holes, who have apparently never had an issue in their I lives, I hope the whole damn country falls apart one day, and then we will all be equal, or dead, one or the other.

Don't worry with people like you and Obama it will.

Hey, "Concerned," you would have been very happy in Nazi Germany!

THIS is a false Premise we were told in the begininning of this debate that Health care overhaul would save us money not cost money...now we are debating who should pay for it? The goal posts have been moved as they are so often!

Please tell me you never had children!!!If you did you probably potty trained them with a bullwhip!

Certainly not a Nazi, but a very caring person. It is obvious in these difficult times, where so many do not have jobs or are pinching pennies to survive at all, that it just is not possible to carry the burden of those who will not carry their own. I also don't beat animals or people. What personal attacks. You want free eh?

and who elected you to call others unfit.

Hit the nail on the head with this one. Deadbeats and those that think the government OWES them should get nothing since they have never contributed anything for their welfare or anyone elses. So many in our society that thinks that way because our government has given and given to them and caused them to think that way. Whatever happened to integrity and a honest day's work for your food, medicine, shelter, etc.??? Oh, poor me, I never had the advantages you had. Bunch of crock. Education has been available to everyone in American so what is your excuse for being the deadbeat you are??? Like a thief, you want what is mine without working for it. Working people are sick and tired of this and I think we need to stop all welfare of any kind NOW.

Folks have to read Concerned in California's message carefully, and in many ways I agree.

I worked in a low-paying clerk job until I retired, and paid for insurance and am still paying for health insurance. Yes, I've had to scrimp money to pay and still do, but I feel it's been worth it.

I do not want what Canadian taxpayers and the other countries pay...average 48% of income for health care only. British pay more. No taxpayer in health care controlled countries pay less, at least I haven't read or heard about.

So you believe that health insurance execs should be able to make a cool $2 million/year or so by refusing claims of working Americans making $30,000/year. Are you one of them, tess or just a major dumb ass? The doctors, nurses and even hospitals actually earn their $ by providing service. If any of those three deserve less, it would probably be the hospitals. Part of reform should standardize hospital charges.

But the health insurance companies are hiding behind the anti-trust laws intended to cover the life insurance industry. It's time for those blood suckers to pay their way. If they don't want to cooperate with a public option by limiting executive pay and perks while lowering their ridiculous profit margins, then the next move by our Democratic controlled Congress must to go Teddy Roosevelt on them.

Roosevelt was the first and only Republican president since Abraham Lincoln to actually care more about the American people than obscene corporate profits. If you know little of our nation's history, you probably don't know that TR was known as a trust buster and, therefore, very unpopular among the rest of the Repubs of his time.

If you are a middle class American, the political ideology in which you believe doesn't matter to the health insurance companies. You are just another sucker that has to pay their price whether you like it or not. That is the basis of capitalism. These SOB's have to be shown that the real power is in the people that are tired of their abusive practices.It is time to call your senators and congressmen to tell that they work for you.

Regardless of what Limballs or Faux News says, this isn't about our nation becoming socialist or lower income citizens getting free health care(everybody with Medicare pays premiums), it is about stopping greedy, immoral executives from capitalizing on lower and middle class Americans of all races, colors and creeds.

Enough is enough, tess and any other lemming believing the Repug line.

Just how many greedy, overpaid executives do you think there are? It takes a bunch to add up to a trillion dollars.

Oh, give me a break, Concerned, and everybody else out there bandying about this trillion dollar crap. It's over A TEN YEAR PERIOD, FOOLS !! That's a 100 billion a year. And just how high is defense spending every year ?? In 2004 the US allocated 522 billion dollars to Defense. THAT'S MORE THAN A TRILLION DOLLARS IN 2 YEARS. Defense consumes 50% of all discretionary spending in the US. In contrast, only 6% is spent on education, training, employment and social services combined. The defense budget of the United States alone accounts for 47% of ALL military spending IN THE WORLD. In 2004, the next highest military budget was China's, at 63 billion dollars. So, folks, what's wrong with this picture ?

Hooray. Let's lower the bar so we have dumb doctors.

Orpheus, you forgot to mention that the President wants to take money from Medicare.

Well said, Orpheus.  One thing I'm curious about is this: with millions of new "insured" people heading to the hospitals, where are the doctors to treat them going to come from?  Are the bureaucrats pushing this health care reform honestly expecting the existing doctors to fit them into their schedules without affecting the quality of care for EVERYONE? 

And why is this a crisis at this time?  Why can't our elected officials spend the time to develop a well thought out plan?  It seems to me that we're pushing for quick reform to satisfy the ego of ONE MAN; and all working people will foot the bill.

Another thing:  I'm not rich.  Not even close.  But why should the rich people foot this bill?  Because they took advantage of opportunities better than I did?  Because they got better-paying jobs, received a better education?  That's a bunch of crap.  I'm tired of people targeting the rich to get something they haven't earned themselves. 

now that is well said rock